BornHoosier

On 5/11/2021 at 1:41 PM, 5fouls said:

Lander is going to be a very good player for Indiana before he leaves.  What I find hardest to understand about this whole saga is why Archie encouraged him to reclass.  As indicated in the story, he's not the prototypical PG for Archie's offense.  So, bringing him in was already an awkward situation between player and style of play.  Add to it the burden of making that transition a year before he was supposed to, and it all but set the young man up to struggle.  

Along with the change in playing style, having Xavier Johnson on hand to learn from will really help Lander.  

Not so fast 5fouls as I see a different scenario playing out.  2.1pts per game, 25.7 fg% and a 27.3 3pt % is far from a starting spot on this team especially when you add in 5 star talent in Bates.  I'm not here to bash this young talent but please show me something before talks of leaving early for the NBA.  I mean most here talk like he is a 2 yr player at best and I look at tape like whaaaaaat, really?  With the talent that Coach Woodson is bringing in, lets take a step back in Landers projection until he actually shows his talent on the court.  Here's to 2021 for this young phenom.

On 5/17/2021 at 10:42 AM, FKIM01 said:

Yeah, can't say I've ever understood the wisdom in that.  Right or wrong, it's always been interesting to me hearing what people close to the program were saying/thinking.  I've never felt any need to keep score on their predictive results.  That just shows that sometimes no one really knows.

I will say on the other hand that it didn't help when an insider got defensive when responding.

Billy Donovan and Brad Stevens alone has taken a real hit to not only our insiders but the fanbase in general.  I got caught in the latest Brad Stevens saga that I actually have bad things to say about him regardless if he deserves it or not.  I count at least the 3rd time Brad Stevens has shunned IU but for some reason we all want to win so badly that we continue to go down that road only to be spurned time after time.  Billy D was hard to get over but a 3rd time by Stevens eventually catches up to us all.  I could care less about how close it actually came to be true but the fact it again proved to be false is just maddening.  I do like the direction of Coach Woodson so hopefully Brad Stevens is just a name we used to know!!!

I don't care how this all came about but I will tell you that Jerome Hunter was my #1 biggest disappointment for the season as many times he laid a goose egg on the box score.  Just inexcusable for a player of his potential and all season I couldn't put a finger on why such a dismal performance.  Rob & Jerome were supposed to be the face of IU Nation to pair with TJD but for whatever reason both players just DISAPPEARED in 2020!  All the hype about this guy getting his leg healthy enough to play and he just doesn't have the heart to give it his all is just maddening.  Still can't explain the disappearance of Jerome Hunter but I have moved on and if any of the late to practice rumblings are true then that is all I need to know.  Hope this young man gets his priorities straight and makes something of his self after blowing a career opportunity.

On 5/17/2021 at 3:41 PM, cybergates said:

I think the reason the insiders "missed" is b/c they got their info from someone connected to the program (IU side) and the previous staff felt confident about landing guys that didn't eventually commit here. The insiders don't have connections to the specific recruit in most cases, so its unreliable much of the time unless the recruit has basically gave a verbal commit before a public announcement. 

As for the BS situation, I think that the information insiders got was good, but once again it was from the IU side. IU met all of BS's demands and he still said no. After Woodson was hired, he mentioned/thanked Dolan for letting him out of his contract. Since that was the case for him, I'd imagine the same would apply to BS, so it is possible (still unlikely) that BS wanted to leave (reports/rumors of him trying to resign and telling the team he was leaving) but couldn't get his release from the Celtics. Whatever the case, I'm actually glad we got Woodson instead, and with success we can promote Fife or maybe this new GA is the next BS 2.0. Inevitably when BS gets fired, he can come home to coach the Pacers. Win win.

Regardless, IF BS ever lands on the street I sure hope IU doesn't even bat an eye:

SHAME, SHAME, SHAME

http://memecrunch.com/meme/8STHA/walk-of-shame-after-meals/image.png?w=500&c=1

10 hours ago, 13th&Jackson said:

Yes, it would be much better to have Geronimo backing up TJD.  I must have missed seeing Cockburn and Garza in the portal.

Great point 13thetc...  Never even considered this a depth move for whatever reason scratching my head.

3 hours ago, dgambill said:

His concerns if he is going to be BIG enough?? He called him a tweener? Of course there are questions about how he will do...but his size is a question? Surely you gist?

I just don't think he passes the eye test to be anything relevant at the B10 level of play.  Both Garza and Cockburn look like MEN to me and this guy does not for whatever it's worth.  Maybe a little scarred from previous 7' prospects that played 5' 10"!  I've seen what 275lbs can do at this level, show me that 250lbs is not a doormat.  

On 5/17/2021 at 12:26 PM, Hoosierfan1901 said:

Here is a highlight tape from last year 

 

Sorry Michael, Big10 will be a much bigger challenge but let's see how you adjust before judging!!!  Welcome to HOOSIER NATION

Not a fan at all but I will defer to Coach Woodson on this one to be honest.  Doesn't have the girth to be effective in the B10 and will be pushed around or in foul trouble from reaching.  When will IU learn that it not only takes 7' but 275+ lbs to be effective in this league???  Both Cockburn and Garza have been really effective in this league an no coincidence both are not only around 7' but both are around 275 lbs of MUSCLE and not TWEENERS!!!

11 hours ago, btownqb said:

Actually.. Romeo absolutely showed that until his wrist injury. Romeo could flat out flick it.  Maybe not quite what the % Braden does, it's unfortunate for Romeo that injury slowed him. I still laugh at many of our fan base that act like Romeo was a bust.. he avged 17p 6r as a FR. 

I don't think he was a bust just that I have a different mindset of a great basketball player vs everyone else.  You tell me an instate kid with all the accolades that Rome had and I had vision of a kid that could shoot lights out anywhere on the court and a little let down that he was just a good scorer.  Seems most kids these days are just that good scorers and shooting is a lost art.  27% from 3pt range is a little disappointing for someone toted to be the next big thing coming out of the state and add in a 72% ft percentage further tells that shooting is not his strong suit.  Cant argue with 17pts per game as a Frosh lol.

On 5/8/2021 at 11:42 AM, BobSaccamanno said:

I love how our recruiting script has flipped.  We have an attractive style of play with personable coaches who can relate to kids.   The style of ball is appealing and not tedious and boring. Our staff is obviously extremely aggressive and relentless on the recruiting trail. 

Notably, we have three assistants who are outstanding recruiters.  Any of the three could be lead recruiter types at big schools. Yet we have three!  And then they have an accomplished NBA coach to pitch.  

Times have changed. 

The times have only changed if we start shooting 35+% from 3 and until then these recruits and/or transfers will be just another stat.  I didn't even mention FT% but we can throw that in when it comes respectable and only then the times have truly changed!  

42 minutes ago, Danomatic said:

This. I think one of Archie’s biggest mistakes was trying to be the “hard ass” type of coach, so he could appease the Knight crowd. Don’t get me wrong… I loved Coach Knight, but that’s no longer appealing to the youth. 

No idea what you are referring to as I would hope at the end of the day is did said player put the ball in the hoop??  Dont care about "hard ass" or "Knights crowd"?  Does the player catch net is all I'm interested in!

On 4/27/2021 at 8:16 AM, btownqb said:

man.. you're just looking at the ranking. 22p 6a 5r playing in Hamilton Co isn't something that just "a ton of kids across the country" can do. 

I just hope all these NBA type prospects our new coaching staff seems to have all the INS on can only wish they can put up SMITH type numbers in college!!!  How many more BRICKS do we have to endure before A COACHING STAFF understands that 40+% as a HS career has to mean something correct?  I mean Romeo never showed the stop and pop ability Smith showed throughout his HS career but lets continue to throw star rankings at players!  Tape shows me all I need to know and quite honest its the constant pts per game of 22 that says all I need to know!  I don't want to see elite athleticism driving to the rim shooting 3ft layups to be impressed, I want to see cross over step back 3 pt attempts that go in over and over at a clips of 40% to be impressed!!!  That to me SHOWS true talent but we all shall see unfortunately.  dgambill has his heart on these NBA type talents that never have a 40+% from Seth Curry LAND but glad they can drive to the rim vs lesser talent at the AAU level!  

13 hours ago, dgambill said:

I just think that the connections that Yasir and Hunter have that we aren’t worried about the pg spot. Wouldn’t even be surprised to see Thornton or another pg transfer in to us after next year either. If this offense is anything like I expect it...pg is going to have a lot of freedom and I think will generate a lot of interest of kids wanting to play here. Funny Archie being a pg you would think he would be the pg guru but it just never clicked with him. He just seemed to run things too tight to the chest. Happy to see more freedom in our offense in the future.

I really hope you are correct dgambill as I don't mean to be against you but what if Smith tears it up and the Yasir or Hunter options fail??  I hope this isn't the case and will hold judgement until the end of the season before I go all in on our coaching staff judgements!  Time will tell

13 hours ago, dgambill said:

I just think that the connections that Yasir and Hunter have that we aren’t worried about the pg spot. Wouldn’t even be surprised to see Thornton or another pg transfer in to us after next year either. If this offense is anything like I expect it...pg is going to have a lot of freedom and I think will generate a lot of interest of kids wanting to play here. Funny Archie being a pg you would think he would be the pg guru but it just never clicked with him. He just seemed to run things too tight to the chest. Happy to see more freedom in our offense in the future.

I just want to see respectability when it comes to a jump shot, forget the 3pt shot!  I don't care who we have on the roster anymore as long as they can put the ball in the hoop!  SHOW ME, as I'm tired of 4 star talent not hitting water if they fell out of a boat!!!  I'm waiting and will judge all this NBA star talent that this staff seems to all of a sudden be able to sign!!!  SHOW ME

On 4/26/2021 at 11:08 PM, IU878176 said:

OK, against my better judgement I’ll bite.

Yogi was a 5 star, 2nd ranked PG in the nation, recruit in high school that now plays in the NBA. If Smith was my kid I would be very proud of his 20 per game but a ton of kids across the country do that every year. I think your Yogi vs Smith comparison is, to say the least, a bit of a stretch.

Thank you but the point is very mute these days as the instate team that has kicked our arse for what seems as a decade chose to sign the kid.  It had nothing to do with 26 pts per game that had me intrigued but more of how he managed to score his pts and that is the stop and pop, I can make it in the hoop no matter who is guarding me mentality that this IU team has lacked since YOGi.  Please forgive me as I'm not comparing the talent of Yogi vs Smith but I see Smith as the more natural shooter and creator than Yogi!  Funny, who is ranked 3 star (Smith) vs 5 star(Yogi) but I will throw out Stars and relate to film when I watch how Smith shoots the ball so natural.  Time will tell the whole story here as Smith has committed to PU but I feel that our NBA staff just may have overlooked a potential in state juggernaut due to size and/or race!!!  I grew up the biggest Bob Knight, Born Hoosier supporter but will keep an eye out for this kid to succeed and hope our NBA potential offers don't shoot ourselves in the ars when they can't hit water if they fell out of a boat!  

Player A stats

ppg defr offr rpg apg spg bpg tpg pfpg

Player A 3pt % = 37%

Player B stats

ppg defr offr rpg apg spg bpg tpg pfpg

Player B 3pt % = 45%

Which player is a 5 star and projected by many to jump to the NBA after just 2 short yrs of College and which player is projected to be just a MID MAJOR talent with little to no hope for NBA aspirations?

Hint, one stands at 6'2" tall (tall enough to defend in the BIG) and the other is at 6' (too short to defend anybody in the power 5 conf).  Yes, just 2" is the deciding factor here by some that dictates NBA potential vs nothing more than a Mid Major offer.  

And now for the spoiler alert:

https://www.ncsasports.org/mens-basketball-recruiting/indiana/westfield/westfield-high-school5/braden--smith1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pQPHbau8MI

Who am I?  Were talking just a 2" difference in height but way different projections even know both put up the same numbers throughout their high school career.  

We haven't had a true prolific, stop and pop or a cross over step back 3 pt shooter on this roster since Yogi and it's no coincidence we haven't made the dance since.  If this is a 5 star, 6-4 stud or a 2 star, mid major, 5-10 hopeful, I don't care as long as they get the job done.  Yogi was under 5'9" and what he brought to the table offensively easily outweighed any deficiencies on defense much like Smith will do too.  26pts per game is on the same level as Michael Jordan, Lebron James, James Harden and the late Kobe Bryant so please don't forget about that comparison even if it is at a different level.  45% from beyond the arc is in the Seth Curry comparison too as an added bonus.  These stats, even if at the high school level, are still on par with the greatest to ever play the game which is why I truly can't believe the lack of buzz from being Caucasian and 6'.

13 hours ago, BGleas said:

We haven't been a very athletic team in about 5 years when we had Bryant...

LOL, all I can remember from the Bryant years is his 2" vertical and his lack of athleticism in the post.  It's crazy how we can all have different views on players.

3 hours ago, dgambill said:

I’ll save my breath. You clearly have this recruiting thing down. Wake me up when the kid has an offer from another power 5 school or better yet a B1G school. I do think he is a great player but let’s not mistaken “interest” for an offer. Nothing wrong with mid major basketball. That’s incredible! So it’s not disrespectful to be of the opinion that is the likely avenue. 

I apologize, just a few too many adult beverages on the Friday night lanes got me fired up.  After watching Archie ball for the last 4 yrs and the lack of pure shooting on this team from many that were considered 4* recruits, I just don't get the lack of interest in a kid that can score from anywhere on the court at will. 

On 12/23/2020 at 7:44 PM, Bustout said:

He was still a 2021 recruit. He decided to enroll early, but you can’t say IU whiffed on the state when they got the best player from the class - in the state. He happened to come on campus early - but he’s part of the class.  
 

Also, had IU not landed Lander, People like you would be saying how much they whiffed on guys.   Can’t have it both ways.  IU got the best recruit in the 21 class.  Bottom line.  
 

While in the context of semantics, he ended up enrolling early from the 2021 class.

 In the context of IU whiffed on in-state players in 2021, it’s just factually incorrect. 

I don't see a projected NBA player with the stat line of 2.1 pts per game, 1.2 assists per game and 26% shooting from the field in both FG and 3pt% no matter how you slice it.  If this is the best player in the class then no wonder IU did not make the tourney and doesn't bode well for the future.  Lets just say he makes a 10pt per game improvement in yr 2, I still don't see an NBA player at 12 pts per game?  To me an NBA player is at least 17+ per game and a difference maker in the eye test.  Time will tell.

On 4/19/2021 at 9:37 AM, dgambill said:

We've heard how great Yasir is....he is supposedly a pg guru with ties to top recruits. You think he is going to dig for a local diamond in the rough? He wasn't a priority for the Archie staff...you think THIS staff will prioritize him? I do think he is a great HS player...I think he will make a solid college player. But we are told we just landed this all-star staff.....I just don't think they are going to prioritize an under ranked recruit. We are going to go after the elite recruits...the ones that Archie couldn't land but we should have a shot with now that Yasir and Hunter are on staff. In a day and age where the transfer portal is so active and player movement is so easy I do think it is important to supplement your team with kids that are LOYAL to IU. That IU is where they want to go to school for more than just playing time...else we won't see any 4 year players anymore. Guys like Leal and Galloway...and I think Smith would be as well...but this kid would get buried for a few years on the rosters that Woodson is building....I do think he would stick it out but the guys that we are bringing in and targeting...I think IU will continue to look outside the state to build its team. Honestly, I'm surprised that Gunn is deciding to stay committed because I think the staff would like to use that offer on better talent. Maybe I'm wrong and even though we have Fife and Woodson who are IU legacy and one is Indiana born...I don't even think they will put the emphasis on the state that Archie did.

Guys like Leal and Galloway will get buried and don't be surprised if either is pushed out but don't put Smith in this category due to his lack of offers which is mind boggling.  Did Leal or Galloway have tape that showed this type of talent and that is to hit from a long distance to the rim off his own dribble or bounce?  A stop and pop from anywhere on the court?  40+% from 3pt for that matter?  45%, just checking.  The ability to not only shoot from his own creation but to see the floor and make assist passes like Isaiah Thomas or Magic Johnson?  Did you see any of that talent when you watched Landers highlights from a yr ago?  

On 4/18/2021 at 8:18 PM, dgambill said:

I think with the new focus of the staff and their connections....they are on bigger fish.

When will the bigger fish finally feed the colony?  Rob P, Jerome H, Race T, Kristian L, Trey G, Anthony L to name a few.  I will be glad if whoever they land in Smith's place, ACTUALLY performs to their ranking and/or ceiling or projections.  Way too many prospects for IU not living up to their hype.  As much as I LOVE TJD, most said he was a 1-2 yr player at most but yet we all know that unless he develops a jump shot he is not NBA ready.  Cody Z, Noah V, Romeo L all left early before they were truly ready and some could argue they have yet to show they are ready at the next level.  Hope we dont pass on this kid for bigger fish that never reach their potential at weigh in!

On 3/30/2021 at 8:35 PM, Coach Robby said:

Tom Coverdale minus the Budweiser good? A capable shooting point guard? Who will make 37-42% of 3’s in college off the catch? I’m in. 

Coach, that is the comparison I have too and its the GRIT that both players possess.  I think Smith has a higher overall grade than ole Tom C but I see the same fire inside that this team has lacked since.  Coincidence, last time IU had this type player they played in the National Championship?  NO, he IMO is a must get and I would hate to lose him to Tony B at Virginia as he has our Indiana kids in his sights!!!  40+% off the catch or bounce he is says Yoda so hopefully CMW does too!!

On 3/30/2021 at 4:35 PM, Hoosier51 said:

This kid seems like he could be a Jordy Hulls type player. Would be a nice get.

I love Jordy H to the max but this comparison is selling Smith wayyyyy short.  Smith has a complete game and its a matter of time before this new staff make him priority 1!  If you like Hulls, just wait till you get a load of Smith!!!

On 7/1/2020 at 1:07 PM, BobSaccamanno said:

Somebody may recall the details better than me, but we’ve heard that Archie really likes him.  I think the story was something like Braden visited for a game, and afterwards Archie said he liked him and didn’t care how tall he was.  

I have not seen the kid in person so it’s hard to get a good gauge on this from clips, but he looks physically strong and tough.  It looks like his core is especially solid.  My thinking is everything starts with the core,  Being a tough, strong guard can be a plus.  There’s more than one way to skin a cat, and not everybody needs to be long, lean and an electric athlete.

As for ranking, I truly don’t care other than a curiosity.  I, like others, tend to think he won’t be top 150.  The ratings “gurus” tend to overrate physical athleticism and length, and underestimate the “it factor” and the kid that just has that indescribable winning gene.  There are plenty of good athletes that play basketball that end up rated 75 or whatever because they fit the profile.  But they may not have what I referred to as the “it factor.”  They run around, look good physically, but just don’t have the knack to make those winning plays. 

Let me ask you one question, do you see a lack of size when watching his tape?  Do you see his size as being a negative for the BIG10 level of play and a reason not to offer?  Do you see a low level ranking player when you watch the tape, the kind that commits to Indiana Wesleyan?  

I'm gonna go out on a limb and answer NO to all the above and not one time did this kids size even became a focal point because he plays much bigger than the his opponent.  Stop and pop at will, quickness to drive to the lane, vision to pass to an open teammate and even have the IQ to step in the passing lane for a quick steal.  6-4 or 5-10 doesn't matter as long as you have this skillset correct?  Anybody on our current roster with this resume?  NOPE