Feathery

1 hour ago, Sea Turtle said:

And yet they just won the football national championship in football and hired the basketball coach we wanted. 

Yep. It’s viewed that the team won in spite of the AD and not bc of. There was a big rift behind the scenes between the AD and Harbaugh. The AD will never win that debate and he needs both his football and basketball hires to pan out or he is gone. The previous AD got ran out of town because of a guy who runs the largest fan site , MGoBlog. The guys who run that site have already turned on Warde and he is a former football player there. 

1 hour ago, Tom White said:

I know nothing about who-is-who at Michigan, so someone fill me in. Is this the same AD who hired Howard?

Yes. Warde Manuel hired Howard. 

9 minutes ago, IUfaninIllinois said:

As I sit here watching Marquette I’m surprised more people don’t want us to look at Shaka Smart. I don’t like how he “plays defense” on the sideline but what he’s done with three different teams, two of which don’t have the resources we have, and the third being a football school is pretty impressive. He should be right behind Pearl if not equal to Pearl. 

I’d love to see IU play this style. Just not sure he would leave Marquette. He is from Wisconsin and after his issues at Texas, I could see him being a lifer at Marquette. 

12 hours ago, Fkfootball said:

Michigan allows their AD to do his job.

Hahaha. Michigan fans want their AD fired and is generally viewed as being incompetent at his job. Their fans are split on Dusty being successful or not. But Warde Manuel has a track record at Michigan of being very slow at making decisions, see their hockey coach contract expiring and sitting on a report with no action for 6ish months before the media got it and he had to do something. He let their baseball coach go, his handling of sign stealing in football was not well received for not backing Harbaugh when the NCAA had the Big Ten come after him bc NCAA rule wasn’t technically broken. 

45 minutes ago, Tom White said:

And when will people let go of that saying? It is getting tiring already.

When the man who claimed that there are true fans, and by proxy the opposite exists, is gone or has won at such a level everyone is on board. 

There are enough good players in the portal for IU to be a good team next year. It’s going to come down to 2 things. 
 

1. Can they land the talent they need. 
2. does the newly acquired talent actually fit into a cohesive team that can win. 

3 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Dusty May could very well be a better coach than Mike Woodson.  But, he should NOT be in the top 3 on the IU candidate list.

Yes, his team made one magical run to the Final Four.  News flash.  They would not even be in this year's tournament if they had not done that.

Heck, you want to base it on one tournament run, then let's go hire Kevin Ollie.  He won the whole damn thing and look at where he is now.

 

I’d take May if it means winning a title and firing him 2 years later. Them bring a new guy to win it again. Lol

11 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

So, the program trajectory is not going in the right direction after an abysmal season. I know we’re all wondering: why the 4th year? If the chances of turning this thing are low then why not rip off the band-aid? I’m only coming to 2 conclusions. 

1. Some people in power really think Woody is up for the challenge. 

And bare with me….

2. The perception of fairness. I’m wondering if how quickly we got rid of Crean and Sampson came back to bite us. There is somewhat of a coaches fraternity in all sports where they bond over all the BS they have to deal with. In CBB, Izzo and K love to speak out and defend their own. Programs like ours that are, rightly or wrongly, rifling through coaches may be getting that ‘toxic’ reputation within that fraternity. 

With all the high end coaching prospects out there, after Crean we made 2 underwhelming hires in a row. I can’t imagine either were top 3 (possibly top 5) on the AD’s wishlists. This likely means that high end coaches are saying ‘no’ behind the scenes. 

We repeat it daily: we have the tradition, the resources, the money, the national exposure, a recruiting destination, fan support, etc. But if the candidates we go after do not perceive IU as being fair in there expectations, is it realistic to assume that we can lure them away from a competitive program they built? 

This time, I’m wondering if Woody has to fall flat on his face to overcome the perception that we are jumping the gun by firing a head coach….one of our own….once again. 

I don’t think the expectations are the issue. I think the administration has targeted the wrong coaches to fulfill those expectations. Be it not wanting to pay what it takes to get an elite coach or internal politics keeping AD’s from hiring who they want (Sampson over Beilein), ect. The issue has been and continues to be the administration and donors flexing for the wrong guys. 

The SEC churns and burns through coaches in football, and nobody blinks an eye about unrealistic expectations……it’s the SEC dag gummit. If expectations are not met, then the coach wasn’t up to that standard. It’s that simple. They have mouth pieces on ESPN that promote and defend their moves. IU doesn’t utilize that type of strategy well.  So the fans and expectations get dumped on.
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2 hours ago, IUFLA said:

Michigan's Dug McDaniel in the portal

I’d take him if his academics are back in order. Quick PG with a couple years of eligibility left 

2 hours ago, ledies22 said:

does Cal get his Final Four reinstated with Umass?

Why not? He claims the UMass final four. We all watched them play and it literally happened. Removing a piece of cloth hanging from a ceiling isn’t a punishment. lol. it’s like saying the Fab 5 never happened. lol. I don’t ever think oh they weren’t there. I distinctly remember Weber calling a timeout he didn’t have. Oh wait he was being laid so it never happened. lol. Reggie Bush is suing the NCAA for defamation. NCAA is like a cartel exploiting people to make billions off a basketball tournament. 

Duke didn’t get their banners taken away for all the jewelry and houses they bought recruits and their families. Selective enforcement at its finest. lol. 

44 minutes ago, ledies22 said:

You are correct. It was not illegal. It was against the rules of the NCAA. I'll choose my words more carefully, knowing someone is always there to argue semantics. I apologize.

Pearl broke the rules before it was even conversation of players getting paid. and there were other instances other than just paying players. and how he payed the players still does not fall within the rules. He doesn't get the benefit of the doubt because the rules changed. You cant go back and award Pistol Pete 300 more points because the 3 point line was invented later.

I wasn’t arguing semantics. I’m arguing it’s not revisionist and shouldn’t be held against him.
 

Players getting paid has been a conversation for decades. Since before I was born, think UCLA. It’s why the SEC and others have been doing it under the table. How Learl paid the players is within the rules because Tennessee and Virginia sued the NCAA and the ncaa has stopped any and all NIL investigations. Because they know they will lose any NIL lawsuit and it can’t be a legal rule unless it was collectively bargained. Until the players unionized pay for play is absolutely legal regardless of what the NCAA says. 
 

As for his other rule he broke, wasn’t it having a bbq at his home that recruits attended? So it’s ok to take the recruit to dinner but not cook them one. Very minor and I don’t hold it against him. I actually applaude athletic departments that are consistently pushing the envelope. OSU football has always pushed the limits and break mi or violations. Then they self report the minor violations but land top 3 recruiting classes annually. If you act to the letter of NCAA rules then you get IU basketball. Lol
 

1 hour ago, ledies22 said:

not necessarily true, and it was still illegal then, and he knew it. Cant go back and rewrite history because of new rules. 

With that said, i'd still want Pearl.

It wasn’t illegal. It was a rule that was ruled to be against the laws of the United States, per US Supreme Court. So the rule by the NCAA has always been the issue, not what Pearl and others were doing. To me he and others were being the ethical ones by paying players their market value. So to me no ncaa rules violations for paying players should be held against any coach. 

29 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

Oooo, legal tampering season or no?  So dumb.  I'm sure these dudes have heard from 100 schools already.

A lot of players have agents. So you don’t have to tamper and break a rule. Just talk to the agent. 

Guess I can go back to just watching IU basketball from afar. They still aren’t serious and would rather be nice or fair than actually win at an elite level. 

2 hours ago, RoadToZion said:

He will blame it on Health. 

Calhoon’s health is the word. Iykyk 

14 minutes ago, dbmhoosier said:

It's gonna get ugly folks.  Really ugly.  I had hoped it wouldn't come to this but Buckner is hell bent on putting his friendship over the best interests of the University.  Buckle up.

Dolson is not the problem.

I’d expect some boos starting up at the next home game and the BTT. 

25 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Really?

"Of the alleged $91,500 Person received during the investigation, the complaint says Person claimed to have given $11,000 of that money to the mother of the first player and an additional $7,500 to the mother of the second player." 

Honestly who cares. He broke a NCAA rule that ended up being shot down by the Supreme Court. Now people are getting their money through “NIL” which is literally pay for play. And most of these families are poor. So a coach gives a poor family $11k, that’s the morally right thing to do. Screw the NCAA and their illegal rules and subjective/selective enforcement. Schools have learned not to take any crap from the NCAA, see the Tennessee and Virginia Attorney Generals suing the NCAA for trying to limit NIL. paying players is what it’s always taken and any rule to stop it has been proven to be illegal. 

16 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Interesting take...Pearl didn't have any real success at Auburn until around 2017...Here's that roster...

He went from having 1 RSCI top 100 kid to 5...and his top 3 players were all freshman...

So I wonder...What would be the allure of playing basketball at Auburn? History? No...The Cliff Ellis years were ok, but other than that, nothing...

OH! Maybe Pearl met them in "Person?"  

You’re barking up the wrong tree to me. I’ve long been a proponent of paying players, even before NIL. And the US Supreme Court agrees and it is illegal for the NCAA to enforce their  rules as previously. So who is more morally bankrupt the NCAA or the coaches who were caught on tape paying players? One was breaking a rule that if challenged would have been found illegal. Hmmmm

Just now, IUFLA said:

Not his first year he didn't...

Ok? I guess I’m missing your point. I didn’t see anyone saying fire Crean after year 1. Nobody said fire Woody after year 1 either. 

8 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

A little bit more than a double standard based on the results, wouldn't you say? 

No one is denying Pearl can coach...But he's not exactly the moral standard bearer when it comes to college basketball...

The standard for Iu Basketball most will say is Knight. He is hardly a bastion of purity or moral standards. Pearl has issues in his past. But I’m not someone who thinks you need to hire a saint to be a basketball coach. Hire someone who can win. I thought the university should have backed Sampson over the phone calls. Now the drugs that’s different. But to win, nobody is squeaky clean and it’s a standard that is not attainable. There isn’t a person in the planet that is righteous, not one. 

13 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Crean had to play a lot of kids that had no business playing D1 basketball at a P6 school...Despite what's been said in this thread previously, if you look at what Pearl walked into, he had some talent there...400+ games of D1 basketball experience...Crean had Devan Dumas, Kyle Taber and 12 freshmen (including walkons)...

 

Crean had a good group of young players in Hulls, Watford, Jones, Creek, Vic, and Sheehey. Then won 27 games in year 4. Be built on recruiting class after recruiting class. Fans could see trajectory was there to be good. Then when Zeller stayed it was a great year.  
 

I was a Crean supporter until it was clear he had lost the state and recruiting became a mess. He never recovered and a change was needed. Glass just chose to hire the wrong coach in Miller. 

1 minute ago, IUFLA said:

That has nothing to do with it...

It's a pretty simple question...would he have gotten a 4th year?

Depends on recruiting and what the makeup of the team play is. Have a young squad with a good class coming in, then yes. Because you can see that the project is progressing. Inversely, if the team is projected to lose a lot of talent and not a strong class coming in, then no to a 4th year. 

25 minutes ago, btownqb said:

This seems contradictory. 

Yeah it does. What did Fife do? I don’t remember anything other than offering a kid and Woodson didn’t want to offer the kid. And then something about not liking NIL. 

7 hours ago, IUCrazy2 said:

Internet has been around over 30 years.  Even the "You've got mail" players are approaching 50.  I don't think 60 and 70 year olds are as in tune to the modern realities of college athletics like the younger guys.  

Not sure I’ll take the 60-70 year old opinions either. There hasn’t been one high level successful coach of that bunch either. And the game is drastically different today than when they played. It’s more of Dolson making them feel valued and part of the program. 
 

I’m shocked that it’s been so long of IU being down that the powers that be at the university haven’t figured out the magic formula to winning. It’s really not that hard. College and pro sports are totally different. NBA is about elite players. College basketball is about elite coaches. Go hire a F’ing elite coach and all this madness will stop. 

2 hours ago, HoosierDom said:

They had two deep tourney runs.

That 4 transfer stat seems pretty misleading. I wonder how many teams qualify? I would assume not many. To me, look at teams that have a couple of starters (that's what we need - it's really not hard to see us being hugely successful next year with just one transfer starting. I don't care too much how we fill out the back of the roster), just with 5 minutes of research, I found Houston, and Tennessee have two transfers starting. Kansas has one plus a top 7 rotation player. UConn is loaded with transfers in their 2nd year at the program (I would assume that means last year, which worked out quite well for them, they had a lot of transfers starting/rotation players.) 

I think we need a starting PG SG and Center for next year. Reneau can’t protect the rim well enough and it’s a problem unless you play 2 bigs. So I don’t expect the style of play to change unless Reneau transfers or Woodson can play without a rim protector. Though Rabby said Woodson wants a rim protector in the portal. 
 

I don’t think the stat is misleading bc it’s literally what IU is facing. They will need 5 portal players. Maybe the can poach some high school players when the coaching carousel starts to add to our ugh school class of 1 player.