IUFLA Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 6 minutes ago, IUwins0708 said: You act like I want Archie to fail. I DO NOT! To me (obviously not to you) he has up to this point. I hope like hell he turns this thing around and have said that multiple times. No true IU fan wants a coach to fail! More a commentary on you and I agreeing on something than anything else... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steubenhoosier Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 9 minutes ago, IUwins0708 said: It’s because so many of us are frustrated with the state of basketball at IU. Your points are all correct and I’m right there with you on this. I get the frustration. I get that everyone on here ( I think) is pulling for the same thing...for IU to start winning games. Just seems like the ongoing and all encompassing criticism, as well as calling for a guy's job, just opened the doors to the herd mentality of piling on. Guess that's what the world of social media does sometimes. I am hoping that those who have stated that they really want to see CAM succeed, even though they continue to degrade him, exert the same amount of energy to rooting for these kids to win as they have in the never ending criticism of the coaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cthomas Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 17 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said: Not sure why this has turned into such a kerfuffle. "Kerfuffle" always puts a smile on my face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUwins0708 Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said: I get the frustration. I get that everyone on here ( I think) is pulling for the same thing...for IU to start winning games. Just seems like the ongoing and all encompassing criticism, as well as calling for a guy's job, just opened the doors to the herd mentality of piling on. Guess that's what the world of social media does sometimes. I am hoping that those who have stated that they really want to see CAM succeed, even though they continue to degrade him, exert the same amount of energy to rooting for these kids to win as they have in the never ending criticism of the coaches. I’ll never cheer for IU to lose, never. Been a season ticket holder for many years and plan to continue that no matter who the coach is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 2 hours ago, Steubenhoosier said: I did not give CAM credit, but I did say that I thought he might have done something to instill confidence. So why does Archie not get credit when a player improves but he gets blasted if a kid doesn't improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billingsley99 Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 Just now, IU Scott said: So why does Archie not get credit when a player improves but he gets blasted if a kid doesn't improve. Its called being a coach. Coaches lose every game and players win every game. Just goes with the territory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUwins0708 Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said: Its called being a coach. Coaches lose every game and players win every game. Just goes with the territory. Hit the nail on the head. Is it fair? Absolutely not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted January 19, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 8 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said: Its called being a coach. Coaches lose every game and players win every game. Just goes with the territory. What about player/coaches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 20 minutes ago, cthomas said: "Kerfuffle" always puts a smile on my face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billingsley99 Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 6 minutes ago, 5fouls said: What about player/coaches? Its kind of like when you have 2 quarterbacks you really have no quarterbacks so with a player/coach you have not player nor a coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 18 minutes ago, IU Scott said: So why does Archie not get credit when a player improves but he gets blasted if a kid doesn't improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 Armaan Franklin sure does have a nice mid range shot. You don't see that as much these days as you used to. And recently he did a little floater from the foul line was just really nice to see. He should do that more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 21 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said: Armaan Franklin sure does have a nice mid range shot. You don't see that as much these days as you used it. And recently he did a little floater from the foul line was just really nice to see. He should do that more. The inside shots I always love to see developed -- the floater, bank shot, and baby hook. Everyone loves dunking, but each of those shots make a player and team so much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 1 hour ago, IUwins0708 said: You act like I want Archie to fail. I DO NOT! To me (obviously not to you) he has up to this point. I hope like hell he turns this thing around and have said that multiple times. No true IU fan wants a coach to fail! Edit- One of my favorite shows I guess I don't understand some of the benchmarks then... Last year, I kept hearing "make the tournament." By most accounts we would have. I have also said that we weren't that far from being a top 5 B1G team (6 points in 3 losses...Maryland, Illinois, and Wisconsin)...So no, I don't count last year as a failure... This year? It's not over yet...Remembering the 81 team keeps me from making any kind of mid-year assessment... Lastly, I simply don't take vague subjective comments ("our offense sucks" "we don't give effort") much credence. I'm not from Missouri, but you gotta "show me." I try to back up every one of my beliefs or statements with fact driven stats or comments. If you're trying to convince me of something, it takes more that just window dressing...I'll be the first one to admit, I'm a bit stubborn, but my mind can be changed...Facts rule the day here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muckraker Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 The fact that he is TAKING those shots, shows me that he recognizes what the defense is doing. When defenses collapse on TJD, those midrange shots will be there. Those are shots all of our players should be looking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUwins0708 Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 16 minutes ago, IUFLA said: I guess I don't understand some of the benchmarks then... Last year, I kept hearing "make the tournament." By most accounts we would have. I have also said that we weren't that far from being a top 5 B1G team (6 points in 3 losses...Maryland, Illinois, and Wisconsin)...So no, I don't count last year as a failure... This year? It's not over yet...Remembering the 81 team keeps me from making any kind of mid-year assessment... Lastly, I simply don't take vague subjective comments ("our offense sucks" "we don't give effort") much credence. I'm not from Missouri, but you gotta "show me." I try to back up every one of my beliefs or statements with fact driven stats or comments. If you're trying to convince me of something, it takes more that just window dressing...I'll be the first one to admit, I'm a bit stubborn, but my mind can be changed...Facts rule the day here... I let my eyes do the work for me. I don’t see the effort each game. Honestly our two best played games this year were losses. FSU and Wisconsin. I saw guys playing hard, buying in, whatever anyone wants to call it. Those games gave/give me hope. My problem is that they are few and far between. I’m sure there is another game that I’m forgetting where the effort was to that level but those two games stick out to me. Having played and coached the game for a while I look at different things than most. Maybe you and others played too and see something totally different, and that’s ok too. edit- One thing I look at in particular is body language, it tells a major story in players I’ve noticed through the years. I remember specifically a little swagger in the FSU game that I didn’t see in any game other than the first half of the Nebraska game. Swagger can come across as arrogance but to me it’s belief in yourself and your teammates to get a job done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 21 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: The inside shots I always love to see developed -- the floater, bank shot, and baby hook. Everyone loves dunking, but each of those shots make a player and team so much better. The little floater or runner can just be a killer shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 Just now, IowaHoosierFan said: The little floater or runner can just be a killer shot Both ways...ask Al Durham vs Purdue... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 Just now, IUFLA said: Both ways...ask Al Durham vs Purdue... I wasn't just referencing IU in this statement. Any player who can do a little runner or floater can just kill you if they can penetrate your defense to the just inside the foul like. Great guards can and will do it often Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said: I wasn't just referencing IU in this statement. Any player who can do a little runner or floater can just kill you if they can penetrate your defense to the just inside the foul like. Great guards can and will do it often I agree with that...tough to do on the run, but some guys have that innate feel for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 31 minutes ago, IUwins0708 said: I let my eyes do the work for me. I don’t see the effort each game. Honestly our two best played games this year were losses. FSU and Wisconsin. I saw guys playing hard, buying in, whatever anyone wants to call it. Those games gave/give me hope. My problem is that they are few and far between. I’m sure there is another game that I’m forgetting where the effort was to that level but those two games stick out to me. Having played and coached the game for a while I look at different things than most. Maybe you and others played too and see something totally different, and that’s ok too. edit- One thing I look at in particular is body language, it tells a major story in players I’ve noticed through the years. I remember specifically a little swagger in the FSU game that I didn’t see in any game other than the first half of the Nebraska game. Swagger can come across as arrogance but to me it’s belief in yourself and your teammates to get a job done. I think they have played better on the road and besides the two you gave I thought they played that way at UI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUwins0708 Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 Just now, IU Scott said: I think they have played better on the road and besides the two you gave I thought they played that way at UI. I didn’t get to watch that game, but from what I’ve read I would agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13th&Jackson Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 29 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said: The little floater or runner can just be a killer shot None more deadly than Devonte Green’s 5 foot floater from 8 feet away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 4 hours ago, IowaHoosierFan said: Steuben, i don't know why but every time you post something, i immediately want to contradict you. I thought your post was great right up until you tried to give CAM credit for all the work that AF has done. If you're not going to give Archie any credit because Franklin worked hard on his own, then you can't criticize the staff when other players don't improve. Why didn't Race improve his perimeter shot? Why didn't TJD improve his perimeter shot or his right hand? How come Phinisee hasn't worked hard to improve his game? If Franklin alone improved his game with no help from the staff at all (highly, highly unlikely) because he worked hard, then you can't criticize Archie for the other guys not putting the work in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted January 19, 2021 Report Share Posted January 19, 2021 16 minutes ago, BGleas said: If you're not going to give Archie any credit because Franklin worked hard on his own, then you can't criticize the staff when other players don't improve. Why didn't Race improve his perimeter shot? Why didn't TJD improve his perimeter shot or his right hand? How come Phinisee hasn't worked hard to improve his game? If Franklin alone improved his game with no help from the staff at all (highly, highly unlikely) because he worked hard, then you can't criticize Archie for the other guys not putting the work in. I stated earlier and deleted my comments. I am no longer in this conversation. I am not derailing this thread any more than i have Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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