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I know Tom Izzo is a polarizing figure on this board at times, but he had yet another incident with a player heading into halftime of their loss to UCLA. 

Sparty was up 11 at the half, but Gabe Brown missed a switch. As he and Izzo yelled at each other, Brown walked way and Izzo grabbed him. 

I actually think both parties are in the wrong, but Sparty collapsed and lost a doubled digit lead. What, if any, blame do you put on that incident for the collapse?

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Just now, KoB2011 said:

I know Tom Izzo is a polarizing figure on this board at times, but he had yet another incident with a player heading into halftime of their loss to UCLA. 

Sparty was up 11 at the half, but Gabe Brown missed a switch. As he and Izzo yelled at each other, Brown walked way and Izzo grabbed him. 

I actually think both parties are in the wrong, but Sparty collapsed and lost a doubled digit lead. What, if any, blame do you put on that incident for the collapse?

Well, the made 3 pointer essentially cost them the game.  Would have been no OT otherwise.  I don't think it was Brown that missed the switch.  Thouhght it was the other guy and Izzo got mad when Brown got in that guy's face.

I personally have no problem with what Izzo did if he was mad at Brown for showing up a teammate.  I put it 90% on Brown and maybe 10% on Izzo.

 

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I am trying my best not to argue with you any more KoB as we pretty much always see things oppositely, but I know you crusade against this type of stuff.  I'll go ahead and say it and then let you disagree and I'll stop.  Society is so fragile in so many ways now.  My personal opinion is that coaches could get more out of players if they were allowed to be tough on them and if the players could take it.  Izzo being that way isn't the problem in my book.  However, if your players can't take it, it will cost you and you are probably now in the wrong generation of coaching.  

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From what I understand it was not a missed switch it was a missed trap. Brown misread the screen. Listening to JWILL this morning he said much ado about nothing the troubling part was that a player openly disrespected his coach. Said he and K and everyone that played for K had similar experiences and the 1 time that he disrespected K the next 2 weeks were hell for him. I love it when former athletes recognize how soft we have become. 

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42 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said:

I am trying my best not to argue with you any more KoB as we pretty much always see things oppositely, but I know you crusade against this type of stuff.  I'll go ahead and say it and then let you disagree and I'll stop.  Society is so fragile in so many ways now.  My personal opinion is that coaches could get more out of players if they were allowed to be tough on them and if the players could take it.  Izzo being that way isn't the problem in my book.  However, if your players can't take it, it will cost you and you are probably now in the wrong generation of coaching.  

Amen....some boys need to go to boot camp...well, then again it prolly is soft now too...i said it once i say it 1000x BOYS ARE SO SOFT NOWADAYS....zero MEN are being developed...they cant even change a tire...without Grandpas help...

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12 minutes ago, Dawg Bawls said:

Amen....some boys need to go to boot camp...well, then again it prolly is soft now too...i said it once i say it 1000x BOYS ARE SO SOFT NOWADAYS....zero MEN are being developed...they cant even change a tire...without Grandpas help...

I always preface this with most don't like DD but if you listen to what he says he is accurate on a lot of things. He has always said that when he went to IU he was not a boy and gets sick and tired of people calling players kids. They are young men and can handle being coached. In our school that my kids attend attendance in all sports are way down. I think the biggest reason is that parents don't want their kids coached they want all rainbows and unicorns and at the 1st sight of trouble they quit. We are not doing our kids any justice with how soft we as a nation have become. Everyone is looking for an opportunity to claim they are being victimized. I take real victimization to heart but we have gone way overboard. Off my soapbox. 

The young men that go play for Izzo know what to expect just like those that played for RMK. Some can handle it and others not. 

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9 minutes ago, Dawg Bawls said:

Amen....some boys need to go to boot camp...well, then again it prolly is soft now too...i said it once i say it 1000x BOYS ARE SO SOFT NOWADAYS....zero MEN are being developed...they cant even change a tire...without Grandpas help...

Then this generation of adult males aren't doing their job. Masculinity isn't the problem... the lack of is.  

Stop believing everything your kid tells you, stop switching 6th grade AAU teams because Timmy sat out the 4th q of a pool play game, get them off tiktok/IG/Snap.. watch ball with them, rebound for them, have an expectation for how your child should act and hold them to that. 

Stop playing the victim.  

I didnt see the incident. The one with Aaron Henry was one of the most blown out of proportion incidents I've ever seen. I get so sick of the media thinking they have any sort of clue what it takes to win/build men. They don't. My opinion on the media rivals Bob Knights. 

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6 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

I always preface this with most don't like DD but if you listen to what he says he is accurate on a lot of things. He has always said that when he went to IU he was not a boy and gets sick and tired of people calling players kids. They are young men and can handle being coached. In our school that my kids attend attendance in all sports are way down. I think the biggest reason is that parents don't want their kids coached they want all rainbows and unicorns and at the 1st sight of trouble they quit. We are not doing our kids any justice with how soft we as a nation have become. Everyone is looking for an opportunity to claim they are being victimized. I take real victimization to heart but we have gone way overboard. Off my soapbox. 

The young men that go play for Izzo know what to expect just like those that played for RMK. Some can handle it and others not. 

Sorry...but the boys are WEAK and SOFT....parents included....

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8 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Then this generation of adult males aren't doing their job. Masculinity isn't the problem... the lack of is.  

Stop believing everything your kid tells you, stop switching 6th grade AAU teams because Timmy sat out the 4th q of a pool play game, get them off tiktok/IG/Snap.. watch ball with them, rebound for them, have an expectation for how your child should act and hold them to that. 

Stop playing the victim.  

I didnt see the incident. The one with Aaron Henry was one of the most blown out of proportion incidents I've ever seen. I get so sick of the media thinking they have any sort of clue what it takes to win/build men. They don't. My opinion on the media rivals Bob Knights. 

Im playing a victim? 

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2 minutes ago, btownqb said:

It absolutely matters HOW they got there. That's literally the MOST important thing. 

You are right I am wrong it's always somebody else's fault not self responsibility not making sure you improve yourself it's always somebody else's fault because you are right I am wrong it's about how a person is a weak and soft person not that they build themselves up to be a strong man by themselves I didn't have parents to make me strong wheeled I did it on my own I went to bootcamp on my own I excelled in the military on my own I became a man on my own but you are right I am wrong it is the parents fault that these boys are not men not them take it upon themselves to be better and stronger men it's always someone else's fault

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Just now, Dawg Bawls said:

You are right I am wrong it's always somebody else's fault not self responsibility not making sure you improve yourself it's always somebody else's fault because you are right I am wrong it's about how a person is a weak and soft person not that they build themselves up to be a strong man by themselves I didn't have parents to make me strong wheeled I did it on my own I went to bootcamp on my own I excelled in the military on my own I became a man on my own but you are right I am wrong it is the parents fault that these boys are not men not them take it upon themselves to be better and stronger men it's always someone else's fault

Punctuation will help at some point. I am a HS teacher and coach HS sports. Doesn't mean I know more than anyone, but I do have a lot of experiences with young people/HS kids/young adults. If you are arguing that parents don't influence kids more than anything else in this world, I'm not really sure what to tell you. This has been an incredibly confusing conversation with you. You didn't understand that I obviously wasn't talking about you in my first post, apparently soft parents don't make soft kids? No clue where this has all gone. 

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2 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Punctuation will help at some point. I am a HS teacher and coach HS sports. Doesn't mean I know more than anyone, but I do have a lot of experiences with young people/HS kids/young adults. If you are arguing that parents don't influence kids more than anything else in this world, I'm not really sure what to tell you. This has been an incredibly confusing conversation with you. You didn't understand that I obviously wasn't talking about you in my first post, apparently soft parents don't make soft kids? No clue where this has all 

You are right. I am wrong...the 18 yr old men are victims....

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10 minutes ago, btownqb said:

I don't think they are the victims lol what in the world. 

No no...you are right...these kids are victims of their parents...assuming they have them...they are victims of their coaches...victims of their peers...victims of video games...victims of movies, social media....we must develop a flag now. Start a fund and have a protest for these victims...

 

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2 minutes ago, Dawg Bawls said:

No no...you are right...these kids are victims of their parents...assuming they have them...they are victims of their coaches...victims of their peers...victims of video games...victims of movies, social media....we must develop a flag now. Start a fund and have a protest for these victims...

 

Again.. I dont think that. 🤣 I think you're a bit out of your element. 

 

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23 minutes ago, Dawg Bawls said:

You are right I am wrong it's always somebody else's fault not self responsibility not making sure you improve yourself it's always somebody else's fault because you are right I am wrong it's about how a person is a weak and soft person not that they build themselves up to be a strong man by themselves I didn't have parents to make me strong wheeled I did it on my own I went to bootcamp on my own I excelled in the military on my own I became a man on my own but you are right I am wrong it is the parents fault that these boys are not men not them take it upon themselves to be better and stronger men it's always someone else's fault

My hat is off to you for overcoming, and your military service...Thank you...

But you are the exception rather than the rule...I know a few people who grew up without parents all together or with crappy parents, and it's a mixed bag...

But children ARE a product of their environment...That's why I hate the keep-no-score participation trophy mindset of today...Kids don't learn to deal with failure early in life because the parents don't want to subject them to it. When they DO fail, a lot just give up...I was in the military too...20 years...And I mentored and trained quite a few kids (and despite what Dakich says, they ARE kids) in air traffic control during that time...Some could take constructive criticism, even when delivered in a fairly harsh manner (and I wasn't nearly as harsh as some of the other people training them)...Some couldn't...I saw some tears and felt guilty sometimes, but it was for their own good...I wasn't going to let them jack around and endanger people...It was (and still is) serious business to me...I actually ran into one guy I had trained (and unfortunately made cry one time)  at Indy ARTCC a couple of years back...He was getting ready to retire from the FAA with a hefty pension...And he thanked me...

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7 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

My hat is off to you for overcoming, and your military service...Thank you...

But you are the exception rather than the rule...I know a few people who grew up without parents all together or with crappy parents, and it's a mixed bag...

But children ARE a product of their environment...That's why I hate the keep-no-score participation trophy mindset of today...Kids don't learn to deal with failure early in life because the parents don't want to subject them to it. When they DO fail, a lot just give up...I was in the military too...20 years...And I mentored and trained quite a few kids (and despite what Dakich says, they ARE kids) in air traffic control during that time...Some could take constructive criticism, even when delivered in a fairly harsh manner (and I wasn't nearly as harsh as some of the other people training them)...Some couldn't...I saw some tears and felt guilty sometimes, but it was for their own good...I wasn't going to let them jack around and endanger people...It was (and still is) serious business to me...I actually ran into one guy I had trained (and unfortunately made cry one time)  at Indy ARTCC a couple of years back...He was getting ready to retire from the FAA with a hefty pension...And he thanked me...

Agree....Of course they are...but at some point, you have to press on...become own MAN...stop making excuses about past and use that as fuel not as victimhood...there are lots of sorry parents out there...but that doesn't mean the kids have to be sorry...parents are just part of their growing experience..

Edited by Dawg Bawls
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Oh boy. Bunch of old guys yelling at clouds. The world is changing. It happens all the time. Women vote now, for example. We have cars and cell phones. The kids that you're calling "soft" and on and on and on are the ones that are changing the world for the better in many ways, and are dealing with things that your generation has watched get worse and worse while doing little to nothing about it - the cost of education or the issues with the environment, for example. The world is a much different place than when you were younger. Imagine if every single dumb thing you did or said in your teens was immediately available to everyone, and not just everyone at your school, but everyone. Whether you like social media or not, it's here, it's been here over a decade, and it's here to stay. You either accept that and learn to live with it, or you do what you're doing now, and complain about how soft everyone that's not your age is, while ignoring that in some ways, your generation has made things much more difficult. 

As for the "get off your phones" nonsense, I'm pretty sure a lot of you had Ataris, or Intellivisions, or spent significant time in a video game arcade in the 80s, or Ninetendo in the 90s, and so forth. When I was younger, television was ruining kids, then it was explicit lyrics, then video games, and now it's social media. Give it a rest.

The kids today aren't the problem. Your fear of change and your inability to adjust to it is.

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