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Ramsey Named Starting QB


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I am not surprised based on what media guys who watched practice said.  I forgot if it was Zach but one of the media guys predicted Peyton.  Apparently Dawkins was erratic in his throwing.  But, supposedly, Penix is legit, just young.

Now that it's settled, I'd get some packages ready for Dawkins too.  He can really run and has good size.

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So they should go with who looks best and if it’s Ramsey so be it.  However, I find this announcement deflating.  I was not a fan of Ramsey last year and honestly thought Legow, even with his faults, gave us a better glance to win.  I hope that Ramsey has elevated his game over the last year and when we see him play that will ease my concern.  Strictly based off what I saw last year I didn’t expect Ramsey to win this.

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Just now, iuthruandthru said:

So they should go with who looks best and if it’s Ramsey so be it.  However, I find this announcement deflating.  I was not a fan of Ramsey last year and honestly thought Legow, even with his faults, gave us a better glance to win.  I hope that Ramsey has elevated his game over the last year and when we see him play that will ease my concern.  Strictly based off what I saw last year I didn’t expect Ramsey to win this.

Agree completely with all of this.

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That's fair.  But he was just a freshman.  

From what is being said, Peyton has really worked on his core strength and is showing more arm strength.  I think that's critical.  Whether there is a real difference, we will have to wait and see.  

You need good arm strength to be able to spread the field lest the defenses crowd the line and make running difficult.

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6 minutes ago, BobSaccamanno said:

That's fair.  But he was just a freshman.  

From what is being said, Peyton has really worked on his core strength and is showing more arm strength.  I think that's critical.  Whether there is a real difference, we will have to wait and see.  

You need good arm strength to be able to spread the field lest the defenses crowd the line and make running difficult.

His arm strength is what concerned me the most last year. Hopefully you are correct and he has improved in that area. That would go a long way, in my opinion.

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1 hour ago, iuthruandthru said:

So they should go with who looks best and if it’s Ramsey so be it.  However, I find this announcement deflating.  I was not a fan of Ramsey last year and honestly thought Legow, even with his faults, gave us a better glance to win.  I hope that Ramsey has elevated his game over the last year and when we see him play that will ease my concern.  Strictly based off what I saw last year I didn’t expect Ramsey to win this.

I completely agree...I think this decision, sadly, speaks more to Dawkins' inability to learn/succeed in Allen's system and click with the offense (albeit in short order) than it speaks to Ramsey's overall ability to be the best QB on the team.

Dawkins didn't come here to sit and fans expected him to come in and be head and shoulders above Ramsey and apparently he's not. Ramsey said he's improved his arm strength in the off season and he better be right or we're not going to win many games this season. 

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I didn't see Ramsey throw with any accuracy over 20 yards last year and in today's game it's hard to be successful not doing that.  Penix will probably get in the 4 games and redshirt. Really surprised Dawkins isn't the starter. With that said. Staff made the call. It's on them. If it backfires....again....on them. 

My biggest thing is we don't have the luxury of losing early. I think we have to start off 3-1 or even 4-1 to feel comfortable with bowl bound season. We'll see on this call. 

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1 hour ago, Seeking6 said:

I didn't see Ramsey throw with any accuracy over 20 yards last year and in today's game it's hard to be successful not doing that.  Penix will probably get in the 4 games and redshirt. Really surprised Dawkins isn't the starter. With that said. Staff made the call. It's on them. If it backfires....again....on them. 

My biggest thing is we don't have the luxury of losing early. I think we have to start off 3-1 or even 4-1 to feel comfortable with bowl bound season. We'll see on this call. 

I may eat my words later (and I really hope I do) but this was my fear about Coach Allen when he was hired and it's my fear now....All he cares about is taking care of the football on offense and building up his defense. He was a very good DC but I'm not convinced that he's cut out for the head coaching role at IU. You have play to win the game, rather than playing "not to lose". My fear is that we'll never get to see Dawkins' potential because Ramsey will play smart, take care of the ball and just well enough not to lose his job but not well enough to win big games....again....I really hope I'm wrong on this one.

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I get the concern, but I am not sure it is applied to the personnel as you framed the issue.  I'd say that if Dawkins could remotely function in the passing game effectively, he'd get the job.  I think Allen went for Peyton because he can throw while being mobile.  Dawkins would be electric running but from what we have heard, is not a passing savant by any stretch.

If you wanted a safe, ball control offense, you'd go for Dawkins.

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3 minutes ago, Hoosier82 said:

I may eat my words later (and I really hope I do) but this was my fear about Coach Allen when he was hired and it's my fear now....All he cares about is taking care of the football on offense and building up his defense. He was a very good DC but I'm not convinced that he's cut out for the head coaching role at IU. You have play to win the game, rather than playing "not to lose". My fear is that we'll never get to see Dawkins' potential because Ramsey will play smart, take care of the ball and just well enough not to lose his job but not well enough to win big games....again....I really hope I'm wrong on this one.

Pretty much in line with this. Allen was a safe and cheap hire by Glass. We are seeing a safe and cautious approach with our staff. As  you say...hope I'm dead wrong but the only thing I have to go off of is last year. Didn't see it at all. 

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2 minutes ago, BobSaccamanno said:

I get the concern, but I am not sure it is applied to the personnel as you framed the issue.  I'd say that if Dawkins could remotely function in the passing game effectively, he'd get the job.  I think Allen went for Peyton because he can throw while being mobile.  Dawkins would be electric running but from what we have heard, is not a passing savant by any stretch.

If you wanted a safe, ball control offense, you'd go for Dawkins.

Appreciate you adding this. I haven't read or heard many reports from camp. Are you saying Dawkins who played in a RichRod system basically couldn't throw the ball?

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I do agree that the bucks stops with Allen.  He is a good man and has a good defensive mind, but he has to produce.  The offense last year was a disappointment and the team couldn't push through in tougher games.  He's remedying the depth and recruiting has been good.  But, even Allen would admit this isn't a charitable enterprise.  He needs to produce good football.  

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9 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Appreciate you adding this. I haven't read or heard many reports from camp. Are you saying Dawkins who played in a RichRod system basically couldn't throw the ball?

I have been listening intently to the media guys give their takes, and that's my interpretation (although, to be honest, no one said it this bluntly).  Basically, what I have heard is he was a combination of rusty and having trouble with some of the passing concepts.

Unlike the NFL, we don't have exhibitions to see these guys in action.  Since I am not at practice either, it's tough to get a good gauge on things, so I rely on what the media guys say (Zach, Bikoff, Weaver, Hoosier Huddle, Miller et al.).

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57 minutes ago, Hoosier82 said:

I may eat my words later (and I really hope I do) but this was my fear about Coach Allen when he was hired and it's my fear now....All he cares about is taking care of the football on offense and building up his defense. He was a very good DC but I'm not convinced that he's cut out for the head coaching role at IU. You have play to win the game, rather than playing "not to lose". My fear is that we'll never get to see Dawkins' potential because Ramsey will play smart, take care of the ball and just well enough not to lose his job but not well enough to win big games....again....I really hope I'm wrong on this one.

You won’t get to see Dawkins play because......well......he isn’t there boys. Lol. He is gone, flew the coop, probably at a d2school, but vacated the living quarters and disappeared. Maybe they are calling trying to get him to come back, lol. I’m not sure how the graduate rule works. Can he just transfer to another d1 and keep going till late registration is closed? I don’t know, but things just got interesting for Allen who has shown no ability to manage the offense or qb’s and when Dawkins does surface there is no telling what he is going to say, but it will not be as a student at IU.

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44 minutes ago, BobSaccamanno said:

I do agree that the bucks stops with Allen.  He is a good man and has a good defensive mind, but he has to produce.  The offense last year was a disappointment and the team couldn't push through in tougher games.  He's remedying the depth and recruiting has been good.  But, even Allen would admit this isn't a charitable enterprise.  He needs to produce good football.  

I think fans need to be careful in thinking the recruiting has improved because while the player rankings are going up, they’re going up for all recruits across the country. Our national ranking for recruitment classes has been stagnant if not worse and we’re still in the bottom of the bigten. 

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42 minutes ago, Payday said:

You won’t get to see Dawkins play because......well......he isn’t there boys. Lol. He is gone, flew the coop, probably at a d2school, but vacated the living quarters and disappeared. Maybe they are calling trying to get him to come back, lol. I’m not sure how the graduate rule works. Can he just transfer to another d1 and keep going till late registration is closed? I don’t know, but things just got interesting for Allen who has shown no ability to manage the offense or qb’s and when Dawkins does surface there is no telling what he is going to say, but it will not be as a student at IU.

Wow. Thanks for the intel, payday. 

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1 hour ago, Payday said:

You won’t get to see Dawkins play because......well......he isn’t there boys. Lol. He is gone, flew the coop, probably at a d2school, but vacated the living quarters and disappeared. Maybe they are calling trying to get him to come back, lol. I’m not sure how the graduate rule works. Can he just transfer to another d1 and keep going till late registration is closed? I don’t know, but things just got interesting for Allen who has shown no ability to manage the offense or qb’s and when Dawkins does surface there is no telling what he is going to say, but it will not be as a student at IU.

I love it when guys from out of state can bring us news about our programs, that others are not aware of. 

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2 hours ago, Payday said:

You won’t get to see Dawkins play because......well......he isn’t there boys. Lol. He is gone, flew the coop, probably at a d2school, but vacated the living quarters and disappeared. Maybe they are calling trying to get him to come back, lol. I’m not sure how the graduate rule works. Can he just transfer to another d1 and keep going till late registration is closed? I don’t know, but things just got interesting for Allen who has shown no ability to manage the offense or qb’s and when Dawkins does surface there is no telling what he is going to say, but it will not be as a student at IU.

Is this prior to or as a result of the announcement? I would assume the latter

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4 hours ago, Hoosier82 said:

I may eat my words later (and I really hope I do) but this was my fear about Coach Allen when he was hired and it's my fear now....All he cares about is taking care of the football on offense and building up his defense. He was a very good DC but I'm not convinced that he's cut out for the head coaching role at IU. You have play to win the game, rather than playing "not to lose". My fear is that we'll never get to see Dawkins' potential because Ramsey will play smart, take care of the ball and just well enough not to lose his job but not well enough to win big games....again....I really hope I'm wrong on this one.

I had that worry when he was first hired, but not anymore.

If he was all about caring for the ball, we wouldn't run the hurry up on offense.  It creates more plays, more possessions, more chance for mistakes on offense, and wears down the defense.  It can do the same to the offense too, but if Allen only cared about taking care of the football, I don't think we'd play such a fast paced offense.

I don't think Ramsey winning really says much at all about what Allen wants to do.  What says a lot more is that he brought Dawkins in to begin with.  If Allen was content with playing it safe, he already has that QB.  There are other transfers and other options out there he could have explored if he wanted to go the safe route.  Bringing Dawkins in shows that Allen is willing to take a risk on a QB who is a high risk/high reward guy.

It sounds like Dawkins wasn't good throwing the ball at all, so Ramsey was probably just playing better.

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If Dawkins couldn’t win the starting spot then I am fine with him leaving honestly.  You were brought in and likely had the starting spot all but handed to you.  The fact you didn’t get it says a lot.  Penix sounds to have the best arm of the three so let him back things up.  This is actually where Tronti leaving actually could hurt more as he knew the offense and the players for the last year.  This is why you don’t transfer so quickly unless the staff made it clear he never was going to start.

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1 hour ago, hoopsta007 said:

Is this prior to or as a result of the announcement? I would assume the latter

22 minutes ago, iuthruandthru said:

If Dawkins couldn’t win the starting spot then I am fine with him leaving honestly.  You were brought in and likely had the starting spot all but handed to you.  The fact you didn’t get it says a lot.  Penix sounds to have the best arm of the three so let him back things up.  This is actually where Tronti leaving actually could hurt more as he knew the offense and the players for the last year.  This is why you don’t transfer so quickly unless the staff made it clear he never was going to start.

I think everyone is trying to read this too much. He was physically the best QB out there, but there are reasons a kid will leave after graduating and is available. Guys, when you graduate from a school you create friends for life, people you will see and stay in contact with. So when you see a graduate QB available, you might want to look at everything. Very few are going to go on and lead Seattle to a Super Bowl. There may have been other factors involved.

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