Iowa Postgame Thread

[HoosierFaithful]

10 hours ago, BGleas said:

Iowa’s 3pt shooting had nothing to do with the pack line defense. It’s not like the game plan was to let Bohannon shoot. The dude was hitting 3pt shots at the shot-clock buzzer 5 steps behind the line with a hand in his face. Justin Smith had three 3’s hit in his face because he had his hands down at his side and not in the shooters face. 

Other thoughts...

- Green was awful offensively tonight. Lazy passes, terrible shots, etc.

- Morgan is a senior, he needs to be better with the fouls. He’s letting his team down. Cook is out there playing just as hard physical, but so much smarter. Don’t get me wrong, I love Morgan, but some of the foul trouble shouldn’t be happening. 

- Bohannon was the best player on the court tonight, Cook second. 

- Phinisee was really good. He had some freshmen mistakes, but he was solid. 

- I love Langford, I really do, he played great D in the second half, but there’s just something about him that’s missing for me. Maybe it’s the 3pt shooting? I don’t know, but I’ve said this before but he reminds of a high volume scoring guard in the NBA that puts up points but doesn’t really impact the game. I never enter a game thinking ‘we’ve got Langford, we got this game”.

Romeo reminds me of Tyreke Evans. 

[The Daily Hoosier]

Pulling it all together with grades, highlights, post-game and more as a new reality (the old reality) sets in.

https://www.thedailyhoosier.com/iowa-at-indiana-the-report-card/

[iuthruandthru]

18 minutes ago, cohete15 said:

So much overreaction in here. 

Iowa just finished piss pounding Michigan, and people in here are appauled that we lost to them...by 5...with Juwan missing a lot of minutes. 

This team is no where close to the 7-game losing streak team. Bohannon was hitting Steph Curry threes, and for whatever reason, Justin thought he would play hands down defense against a shooter with the ball in his hands. That's the difference in the game. 

I will agree here.  Iowa is playing dang good and IU kept it close.  A better sign of if the team is ready to finish strong is the OSU game as OSU barely beat PSU yesterday.  Also if the team has no energy for Purdue at home then I got nothing.

[rico]

2 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Well I can go how long did it take Coach K, Belein, Bennett and Wright take to turn their programs around

Quit bringing up K, he did not turn Duke around.

[rico]

7 minutes ago, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

So you'd prefer Archie's tenure mirrors Davis?

Nope, just pointing out that Davis went to the NC game in year #2.

[Maedhros]

3 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Well I can go how long did it take Coach K, Belein, Bennett and Wright take to turn their programs around

How did John Groce do after Illinois gave him five years to turn things around? How is Texas doing in Shaka Smart's fourth year? An anecdote is not data, and none of those examples tell us anything about how Archie Miller will do at Indiana.

[IU Scott]

4 minutes ago, rico said:

Quit bringing up K, he did not turn Duke around.

Still have 3 others who took them a few years to start winning at a high rate

[Rev_AK]

One thing that really aggravated me about Crean was all the ill-timed substitutions. I am starting to see a little of that with Archie. At the first  ( or second?)TV time out, I think the subs killed the momentum we had with the 13-2 run. I know Juwan was in foul trouble, but the propensity to stick with ice cold players, ( Fitzner and Green) and keep rotating them in, even after it was clear Devonte didn’t have it last night, and Fitzner was just not ready to play on this stage, and should be buried on the bench somewhere behind Vijay and Tijan. I appreciate Archie having faith in these kids, I really do. But it seems to be feast or famine. Either too many get to play too many minutes, or we are at home clamoring to play a Clifton Moore, or expand the bench beyond 6 or 7. These  kids are in the best shape of their lives, and can’t be getting THAT tired. The other teams don’t sub like that.. Also, after seeing all this fatigue, and what has happened to Romeo’s shot, ( air ball free throw?) it may be also time to review Cliff Marshall’s program. Are they working these kids to hard? The injuries, fatigue, and tired looking shots are pointing somewhere....

[IowaHoosierFan]

I have reached the point where i mostly don't care anymore.  I don't get sad or upset when we lose and i don't get excited or nervous on close games and don't really feel like bragging when we win.  I watch the games and find myself mostly uninterested in the product we have on the floor.  I don't really have any player on the team i love to talk about and follow.  I was looking for a new Avatar to change too and looked over the whole roster and the only thought was i should use Fitzner as a joke.  Otherwise i don't care if anyone of these players play for IU.

I read the forum and here is what i see.  One group is all in on CAM and wants to give me at least 5 years and will always be all in on whomever our coach is.  Fair enough.  Group two really want to win and is tired of the same excuses and terrible product on the floor but isn't ready to give up on CAM yet.  Again Fair enough.  Group three is ready to move on after this year and wants to hire a big name who is going to put us back in the spotlight tomorrow.  Back on the stage.  Back in Title contention from day one.  Again, fair enough.

Everyone wants the same thing, with different levels of leeway.  But in the end they all want the same thing.  Play smart basketball.  Play with Heart.  Defend out home court.  Win basketball games.  Take that step back up onto the National Stage.

But mostly, i just don't care enough anymore to be emotionally involved in IU basketball like i used to be.  And that makes me kinda sad.

[rico]

I pointed it out weeks ago.  There just never seems to be a sense of urgency with this team.

[HoosierFaithful]

Well said IowaHoosierFan. I was having beers with Reacher and watching the game (he came through PHX) and said it’s always funny to me how a group of people  who agree on 90% can focus on the 10% to talk about!

posters here all want the same thing but all have different levels of risk in how they see us getting there. Your post was an insightful way to phrase it 

[ArchieBall13]

3 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I have reached the point where i mostly don't care anymore.  I don't get sad or upset when we lose and i don't get excited or nervous on close games and don't really feel like bragging when we win.  I watch the games and find myself mostly uninterested in the product we have on the floor.  I don't really have any player on the team i love to talk about and follow.  I was looking for a new Avatar to change too and looked over the whole roster and the only thought was i should use Fitzner as a joke.  Otherwise i don't care if anyone of these players play for IU.

I read the forum and here is what i see.  One group is all in on CAM and wants to give me at least 5 years and will always be all in on whomever our coach is.  Fair enough.  Group two really want to win and is tired of the same excuses and terrible product on the floor but isn't ready to give up on CAM yet.  Again Fair enough.  Group three is ready to move on after this year and wants to hire a big name who is going to put us back in the spotlight tomorrow.  Back on the stage.  Back in Title contention from day one.  Again, fair enough.

Everyone wants the same thing, with different levels of leeway.  But in the end they all want the same thing.  Play smart basketball.  Play with Heart.  Defend out home court.  Win basketball games.  Take that step back up onto the National Stage.

But mostly, i just don't care enough anymore to be emotionally involved in IU basketball like i used to be.  And that makes me kinda sad.

Put me down for Camp 2. Constant coaching turmoil is never going to lead to success, that is the one certainty in this. We owe it to ourselves as a program to see if we have found a good one in Archie or not. Yes, that means a full recruiting cycle and potential tough sledding ahead.

But really, let's say the most pessimistic fan wants Archie out at end of this season. Cue up groundhogs day and buckle up for more bad days ahead. I see no reason we can lure in the big hire/Brad Stevens/Billy Donovan type hires a lot of us dreamed of. Even then, it may not be all roses.

I say we see this through (full recruiting cycle). We will likely know enough at the end of fourth year.

[Huntnfreak]

12 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I have reached the point where i mostly don't care anymore.  I don't get sad or upset when we lose and i don't get excited or nervous on close games and don't really feel like bragging when we win.  I watch the games and find myself mostly uninterested in the product we have on the floor.  I don't really have any player on the team i love to talk about and follow.  I was looking for a new Avatar to change too and looked over the whole roster and the only thought was i should use Fitzner as a joke.  Otherwise i don't care if anyone of these players play for IU.

I read the forum and here is what i see.  One group is all in on CAM and wants to give me at least 5 years and will always be all in on whomever our coach is.  Fair enough.  Group two really want to win and is tired of the same excuses and terrible product on the floor but isn't ready to give up on CAM yet.  Again Fair enough.  Group three is ready to move on after this year and wants to hire a big name who is going to put us back in the spotlight tomorrow.  Back on the stage.  Back in Title contention from day one.  Again, fair enough.

Everyone wants the same thing, with different levels of leeway.  But in the end they all want the same thing.  Play smart basketball.  Play with Heart.  Defend out home court.  Win basketball games.  Take that step back up onto the National Stage.

But mostly, i just don't care enough anymore to be emotionally involved in IU basketball like i used to be.  And that makes me kinda sad.

THIS...is exactly how I feel too!! Well said!!👊

[BADGERVOL]

37 minutes ago, mchenry34 said:

This year reminds me of Coach Crean's Third year at IU. When Hulls and Watford and Elston were sophomores and Oladipo and Sheehey were Freshmen and Verdell and Pritchard and Matt Roth were Juniors. We even had a senior transfer in Jeremiah Rivers. Going into that year it seemed like it would be the year that things would turn around. They had more talent and experience than the recent past. But, Maurice Creek had his time derailed with injury a couple of other things went wrong and they had a terrible year.

This team is better than that team, and I think that we will likely win 8 games in the league and end up just outside the Bubble, where as Crean's third year was a disaster. But, that team added basically one piece the next year, Zeller, and really took off.

I fully believe that while we are likely to lose our best two offensive players, we will be much better next year. We will have an influx of talent, more experience, and better depth in the post.

I think that the of this year is about maintaining some growth trajectory for Archie Miller's tenure, and if that is accomplished we will really break through.

Edit: I also believe that Archie will then be able to sustain success in a way that Crean could not...there won't be as many years that were complete head scratchers like the 2013 team that was so horrible. I think that the personality of the team will grow in a direction that is more dependable and tough.

I remember that season vividly! I remember the frustration big time!I remember that season vividly! I remember the frustration big time!

[HoosierDom]

15 minutes ago, rico said:

I pointed it out weeks ago.  There just never seems to be a sense of urgency with this team.

To me that just sounds like you're saying we lost. Romeo missed his 3 and their guy hit his - that was the difference in this game. If those two shots go the other way then this board would be filled with people saying that we are finally playing with a sense of urgency. 

[rico]

12 minutes ago, HoosierDom said:

To me that just sounds like you're saying we lost. Romeo missed his 3 and their guy hit his - that was the difference in this game. If those two shots go the other way then this board would be filled with people saying that we are finally playing with a sense of urgency. 

No, not what I meant at all.  We lost the game in the 1st half....no sense of urgency.

[5fouls]

54 minutes ago, The Daily Hoosier said:

Pulling it all together with grades, highlights, post-game and more as a new reality (the old reality) sets in.

https://www.thedailyhoosier.com/iowa-at-indiana-the-report-card/

Devonte deserved an F.

[CauseThatsMyDJ]

1 hour ago, rico said:

Nope, just pointing out that Davis went to the NC game in year #2.

He also took over for a coach that wasn't fired for performance or poor roster construction.

[rico]

4 minutes ago, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

He also took over for a coach that wasn't fired for performance or poor roster construction.

So did K.

[CauseThatsMyDJ]

1 minute ago, rico said:

So did K.

So?

[Zuckerkorn]

49 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I have reached the point where i mostly don't care anymore.  I don't get sad or upset when we lose and i don't get excited or nervous on close games and don't really feel like bragging when we win.  I watch the games and find myself mostly uninterested in the product we have on the floor.  I don't really have any player on the team i love to talk about and follow.  I was looking for a new Avatar to change too and looked over the whole roster and the only thought was i should use Fitzner as a joke.  Otherwise i don't care if anyone of these players play for IU.

I read the forum and here is what i see.  One group is all in on CAM and wants to give me at least 5 years and will always be all in on whomever our coach is.  Fair enough.  Group two really want to win and is tired of the same excuses and terrible product on the floor but isn't ready to give up on CAM yet.  Again Fair enough.  Group three is ready to move on after this year and wants to hire a big name who is going to put us back in the spotlight tomorrow.  Back on the stage.  Back in Title contention from day one.  Again, fair enough.

Everyone wants the same thing, with different levels of leeway.  But in the end they all want the same thing.  Play smart basketball.  Play with Heart.  Defend out home court.  Win basketball games.  Take that step back up onto the National Stage.

But mostly, i just don't care enough anymore to be emotionally involved in IU basketball like i used to be.  And that makes me kinda sad.

I can't argue with anything you posted.

I DO care and will continue to watch, albeit with radically tempered expectations.

Talk of firing Archie seems silly to me. I don't see any chance or reason that would lead to him being let go before his contract nears it's end. Frustratingly, we just have to wait and see how he does. We certainly haven't seen the results we want or expect, but I still believe he can build a team that will. What will tick me off is if he follows good seasons with bad ones without maintaining what he has built.  I remember how Crean dropped the ball and we ended up with a team that couldn't shoot (Vonleh year?) and I think he repeated that mistake with the roster and recruits he left behind.  Archie knows the game (I believe much better than Crean), so I expect he will put together a quality squad.

Eventually.

[Artesian_86]

[FWIUFan]

2 hours ago, 5fouls said:

Devonte deserved an F.

Agree with you Fouls.  The lack of meaningful development from DG and I would have to include JS from last year has disappointed me the most about this year.  Both players possess great athleticism but their BB skills and IQ are sorely lacking.  Comparing their development to what I see in Al, who I don't think is as athletic and it is puzzling.  Al has been rumored to take on the responsibility  simile to what we heard about VO to improve himself year over year and it absolutely shows on the court this year.  Al, in my opinion, is the most improved player on the team.  Makes one wonder if DG and JS were as willing to put in the work how good they can become.  I just get the feeling that they continue to rely on that athletic ability at the detriment of practicing the fundamentals.  Forgoing the adage to practice to your weaknesses and play to your strengths.  I would love to see the same development for DG and JS going forward but just think it is fools gold at this point.  

[Hoosierdave]

Frustrating loss because that's one where we could have definitely won. Basically lost because guys weren't getting a hand up on Bohannon enough.

For the first time in a while, I actually thought our offense looked decent. IMO the ball was moving a lot better than usual, guys were finally cutting off ball, and we were getting uncontested 3 point shots from dribble penetration.  I hate to call players out because they are just kids and everyone makes mistakes but DG once again made some TERRIBLE decisions and derailed the offense at times with those dumb running floaters he loves to take and forcing bad passes.

I've felt all season long that we can't make excuses about injuries but after seeing what Deron has done these last couple of games, I really begin to wonder what this team would look like fully healthy. Deron is unselfish, can guard bigs/wear them down on the offensive end, and could very well be the difference in Morgan constantly getting into foul trouble. Moreover, I really can't see DG or Fitz ever seeing the floor if Hunter and Thompson are healthy.

Moving forward, I'd love to see Davis, Morgan, Langford, Smith, Durham, Phin get more minutes and only use DG/Mcroberts/Fitz if we are in dire circumstances.

[HoosierDom]

Speaking of, did something happen to McRoberts?