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52 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

Baloney.

Other than volume scoring, show me the stats where he had a better career.

Yogi was far better in assists to turnovers.

Yogi was a better shooter.

Carson scored more points because frankly, he shot a lot more.  Sure, he averaged 24 his junior year.  He also shot under 40% from the field.  Some tourney heroics don't change the overall story.

This debate I'm ready for.

Yogi shot 43% on 10.8 FGA while Carsen shot 41% on 14.2 FGA so very comparable with the higher FGA for Carsen. Yogi did shoot 40% from 3 versus 36.8% for Carsen but on 2 less attempts per game over his career (5 for him versus 7 for Carsen.) The scoring was what separated them.

It’s hard to compare a true PG versus a true SG though. Their games were drastically different. Carsen’s usage rate was much higher for his career than Yogi’s. He also received better accolades postseason than Yogi did as well which I’m sure played into it. He was a consensus All-American and Yogi wasn’t. 

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Carson doesn't belong ahead of Yogi.  He was a short volume scorer.

Not to turn this thread sideways, but man watching that Aaron Craft clip and watching some of the IU games from the 2011-13 teams when BTN had IU Day, when was the last time IU had a team play with as

Baloney. Other than volume scoring, show me the stats where he had a better career. Yogi was far better in assists to turnovers. Yogi was a better shooter. Carson scored more point

1 minute ago, Stlboiler23 said:

Yogi shot 43% on 10.8 FGA while Carsen shot 41% on 14.2 FGA so very comparable with the higher FGA for Carsen. Yogi did shoot 40% from 3 versus 36.8% for Carsen but on 2 less attempts per game over his career (5 for him versus 7 for Carsen.) The scoring was what separated them.

It’s hard to compare a true PG versus a true SG though. Their games were drastically different. Carsen’s usage rate was much higher for his career than Yogi’s. He also received better accolades postseason than Yogi did as well which I’m sure played into it. He was a consensus All-American and Yogi wasn’t. 

You are cherry-picking your stats.  Let's just lay their junior years next to each other:

 

Season School Conf G GS MP FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS   SOS
                                                     
                                                         
2018-19 Purdue Big Ten 36 36 35.4 7.7 19.5 .394 3.9 9.0 .440 3.8 10.6 .355 5.1 6.1 .837 0.4 3.2 3.6 2.9 1.3 0.3 3.1 2.0 24.3   11.99

 

Season School Conf G GS MP FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS   SOS
                                                         
2014-15 Indiana Big Ten 34 34 34.9 5.3 12.1 .439 2.9 6.3 .460 2.4 5.8 .416 3.3 3.8 .860 0.6 2.6 3.2 4.9 0.7 0.0 1.9 1.7 16.3   7.20
                                                         

 

At the same point in their development, Yogi shot 43.9% vs 39.4% and 41.6% vs 35.5% from distance.  Yogi was better than 2:1 ATO rate vs Carson's under 1 rate.  Again, Carson is a volume scorer who took a lot of shots.  That's the only area he really leads in and it's simply because he shot it more.  It's not like Yogi didn't shoot or had a really low utilization rate here...it's simply that Carson shot a lot.  Given his stats, I'd argue he tried to do too much.  I absolutely disagree that Carson was a better player.  Yogi simply played on a more balanced team (and still averaged 16+).  If Yogi shot as much as Carson did, I don't think he would have had any real trouble matching the scoring output.

 
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11 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

You are cherry-picking your stats.  Let's just lay their junior years next to each other:

 

Season School Conf G GS MP FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS   SOS
                                                     
                                                         
2018-19 Purdue Big Ten 36 36 35.4 7.7 19.5 .394 3.9 9.0 .440 3.8 10.6 .355 5.1 6.1 .837 0.4 3.2 3.6 2.9 1.3 0.3 3.1 2.0 24.3   11.99

 

Season School Conf G GS MP FG FGA FG% 2P 2PA 2P% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS   SOS
                                                         
2014-15 Indiana Big Ten 34 34 34.9 5.3 12.1 .439 2.9 6.3 .460 2.4 5.8 .416 3.3 3.8 .860 0.6 2.6 3.2 4.9 0.7 0.0 1.9 1.7 16.3   7.20
                                                         

 

At the same point in their development, Yogi shot 43.9% vs 39.4% and 41.6% vs 35.5% from distance.  Yogi was better than 2:1 ATO rate vs Carson's under 1 rate.  Again, Carson is a volume scorer who took a lot of shots.  That's the only area he really leads in and it's simply because he shot it more.  It's not like Yogi didn't shoot or had a really low utilization rate here...it's simply that Carson shot a lot.  Given his stats, I'd argue he tried to do too much.  I absolutely disagree that Carson was a better player.  Yogi simply played on a more balanced team (and still averaged 16+).  If Yogi shot as much as Carson did, I don't think he would have had any real trouble matching the scoring output.

 

If you look at their sophomore years, Carsen shot better than Yogi on more attempts both from 2 and from 3. That Purdue team was much more balanced than the one he played on his junior year and Carsen was pretty efficient. We’ll have to agree to disagree re who the better player was. 

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5 minutes ago, Stlboiler23 said:

If you look at their sophomore years, Carsen shot better than Yogi on more attempts both from 2 and from 3. That Purdue team was much more balanced than the one he played on his junior year and Carsen was pretty efficient. We’ll have to agree to disagree re who the better player was. 

You can disagree, but, well, you're wrong (lol). Yogi was clearly the better player. You are driven by PU bias here, which is understandable, but doesn't change the fact.

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Carson got good Devonte hot for 4 games in the tournament.  28 3's for a 35% shooter in 4 games.  Great time to get white hot.  However,  he could have just as easily had one of his 1-10 from 3 games and shot Purdue OUT of the tournament.  I'll take Yogi, but they did play different positions. 

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16 hours ago, 5 championships said:

Really close between Carson and Yogi..  not sure who I’d rather have. Who was better leader? Better defender? 

Yogi was an All B10 defensive team selection his senior year...

All around player, it's Yogi hands down...Edwards was a one trick pony...

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37 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

Did Cody get shut out?  I haven't seen the actual team lists.

He will yeah. Makes the Craft decision even more curious. So far, first team is Draymond, Evan Turner, and Burke. My guess is the last two are Kaminsky and Denzel Valentine. 

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8 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

I don't see much argument with the 1st team, but some of the other selections...😂😂😂💩

I mean no offense to Jordan Murphy and Aaron Craft but they shouldn’t have been on the 3rd team over guys like Zeller, Hummel, Gary Harris, etc...

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1 minute ago, Stlboiler23 said:

I mean no offense to Jordan Murphy and Aaron Craft but they shouldn’t have been on the 3rd team over guys like Zeller, Hummel, Gary Harris, etc...

It is a little odd how they seemed to lean towards guys that played 3-4 years over the 1-2 year guys. Yet, they include guys like Turner and Draymond Green who only played 1-2 seasons in the decade. Turner was a great player, absolutely, but 2/3 of his career was in the previous decade. 

I'm probably overthinking it and make it harder than it needs to be.

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2 minutes ago, BGleas said:

It is a little odd how they seemed to lean towards guys that played 3-4 years over the 1-2 year guys. Yet, they include guys like Turner and Draymond Green who only played 1-2 seasons in the decade. Turner was a great player, absolutely, but 2/3 of his career was in the previous decade. 

I'm probably overthinking it and make it harder than it needs to be.

Same with Deangelo Russell. Obviously had 1 really good year but that’s all. Same with JaJuan Johnson. Had obviously a great senior year but that’s the only year that was factored into this analysis. Very strange. 

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3 minutes ago, Stlboiler23 said:

Same with Deangelo Russell. Obviously had 1 really good year but that’s all. Same with JaJuan Johnson. Had obviously a great senior year but that’s the only year that was factored into this analysis. Very strange. 

And to not have Zeller anywhere? I realize some guys got further in terms of tournament success, but Cody Zeller was a stud from the day he stepped on IU's campus and should get extra credit for basically turning around an entire program. It wasn't an accident that IU went from 6, 10, 12 wins in the 3 years prior to Zeller's arrival and then 27 and 29 in the next two years when he arrived. That should almost be the equivalent of a FInal Four appearance or something. 

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3 hours ago, BGleas said:

And to not have Zeller anywhere? I realize some guys got further in terms of tournament success, but Cody Zeller was a stud from the day he stepped on IU's campus and should get extra credit for basically turning around an entire program. It wasn't an accident that IU went from 6, 10, 12 wins in the 3 years prior to Zeller's arrival and then 27 and 29 in the next two years when he arrived. That should almost be the equivalent of a FInal Four appearance or something. 

While Cody's brother's chose to go elsewhere.  Cody was essential in breaking the barrier surrounding Indiana kids going to IU. After Cody. It was once again ok for Indiana kids to choose IU.   Yeah.  IMHO... Cody did more for IU than a bunch of guys not choosing him for their all decade team.

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47 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Carsen, Happ, Sullinger, Swanigan especially, Murphy...even Johnson is laughable over Cody. Oh well. Folks in Chicago haven't got things right in about 40 years. No reason to worry much about this one. 

I agree. Its actually crazy he’s not on any of the teams. You can make an argument, especially since no Big Ten team won a National Title, that Cody Zeller had a bigger impact on IU in the decade than any other player had on their program. To not have him on any of the teams in crazy. 

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33 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I agree. Its actually crazy he’s not on any of the teams. You can make an argument, especially since no Big Ten team won a National Title, that Cody Zeller had a bigger impact on IU in the decade than any other player had on their program. To not have him on any of the teams in crazy. 

As we all know. He changed us overnight. Getting beat by Northwestern to beating Kentucky in year 1. His wiki reads as highest FG% guys of all time in Big 10 and IU which has been the gold standard program since the New Deal. Leaving him off.....especially with those who were on is just embarrassing for the media who put this together. What's new I guess. 

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1 hour ago, Seeking6 said:

Carsen, Happ, Sullinger, Swanigan especially, Murphy...even Johnson is laughable over Cody. Oh well. Folks in Chicago haven't got things right in about 40 years. No reason to worry much about this one. 

Why Swanigan and Johnson? Swanigan’s sophomore year was unbelievable (1st team AA and BTPOY) and Johnson was 1st team AA and BTPOY/DPOY. Why would Cody make it over them? I 100% think Cody should be on there over guys like Murphy and Craft but Johnson and Swanigan belong there IMO. 

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1 hour ago, BGleas said:

I agree. Its actually crazy he’s not on any of the teams. You can make an argument, especially since no Big Ten team won a National Title, that Cody Zeller had a bigger impact on IU in the decade than any other player had on their program. To not have him on any of the teams in crazy. 

He 100% should have made 3rd team at worst over Murphy and Craft. Zero question. 

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