KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 11 hours ago, 5fouls said: The thing some of you don't give Romeo enough credit for is having a good head on his shoulders. He's not going to be in a rush to make his millions and go to the NBA prematurely and turn out like Ben McLemore, just because he is projected lottery. He's much more likely to wait a year or two in order to be ready to contribute at a high level. Klay Thompson would be a great comparison. Romeo does not have Klay's shot, but he may be more offensively diverse than Klay. In any event, Klay had three very good years in college and could have left a year before he did. I don't expect Romeo to stay 3 years, but if you asked me about a sophomore year, I think the odds favor it at this time. I'm a huge Klay fan but having a more diverse game than Klay just means he knows how to do a cross over dribble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FW_Hoosier Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 20 minutes ago, 5fouls said: Romeo is not going to go pro until his defense is NBA ready. So, he could average 22 points and stay if his defense sucks. Or, he could average 14 and go if his defense improves. 22 ppg may give IU fans a woody and 14 may disappoint, but the NBA acouts will be looking much closer at his defense than his offense when determining where he would get drafted. Bottom line is he's not going to risk long term NBA success by going before he is ready. If he is drafted top 5, its because his defense is deemed worthy by NBA scouts. So he goes. If he projects at 14, then the NBA questions his defense and he stays. Its as simple as that. Plenty of guys go in the top 10 that can’t play NBA-ready defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 13 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said: Plenty of guys go in the top 10 that can’t play NBA-ready defense. And many of those guys fail in the NBA. Romeo will do whatever it takes to maximize his chances of success. And, if that means an extra year to get stronger and refine his defensive skills, that's exactly what he will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, 5fouls said: And many of those guys fail in the NBA. Romeo will do whatever it takes to maximize his chances of success. And, if that means an extra year to get stronger and refine his defensive skills, that's exactly what he will do. The NBA can teach him defense better than Archie Miller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 Tre Young just went in the top 5 and that kid couldn't guard a fruit stand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 5 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said: Tre Young just went in the top 5 and that kid couldn't guard a fruit stand Trae Young is a dynamic playmaker that led the nation in assists (by a wide margin). And, once again, I am not arguing whether Romeo goes top 5 or not. I'm arguing about whether he comes out if he is late lottery or just outside. There is a HUGE difference in what I am saying and what some of you are implying I have said. That said. He is a shooting guard. He is not going top 5 if his defense sucks. If he goes top 5, improved defense has earned him that, not his offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FW_Hoosier Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 32 minutes ago, 5fouls said: And many of those guys fail in the NBA. Romeo will do whatever it takes to maximize his chances of success. And, if that means an extra year to get stronger and refine his defensive skills, that's exactly what he will do. I just don’t buy it. Kids hardly ever pass up being a guaranteed top 10 draft pick, and it’s almost always the right decision to go in those scenarios. Romeo has mentioned being ready to play in the NBA in a year. If he’s a guaranteed top 10 pick, I would bet a lot of money that he’ll leave whether he’s “ready” on D or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FW_Hoosier Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 10 minutes ago, 5fouls said: Trae Young is a dynamic playmaker that led the nation in assists (by a wide margin). And, once again, I am not arguing whether Romeo goes top 5 or not. I'm arguing about whether he comes out if he is late lottery or just outside. There is a HUGE difference in what I am saying and what some of you are implying I have said. That said. He is a shooting guard. He is not going top 5 if his defense sucks. If he goes top 5, improved defense has earned him that, not his offense. Luka Doncic, Markelle Fultz, Brandon Ingram, Buddy Hield, Jamal Murray, D’Angelo Russell, Mario Hezonja, Andrew Wiggins, Nik Stauskas. All combo guards/wings that went in the top 5-10 over the past 5 drafts without demonstrating that they could play a lick of defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, 5fouls said: And many of those guys fail in the NBA. Romeo will do whatever it takes to maximize his chances of success. And, if that means an extra year to get stronger and refine his defensive skills, that's exactly what he will do. If you know the kid, or his family, and this is coming direct, then I can understand, but strongly doubt he would stay despite being a high lottery pick just because his D isn't NBA-ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 28 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said: Luka Doncic, Markelle Fultz, Brandon Ingram, Buddy Hield, Jamal Murray, D’Angelo Russell, Mario Hezonja, Andrew Wiggins, Nik Stauskas. All combo guards/wings that went in the top 5-10 over the past 5 drafts without demonstrating that they could play a lick of defense. I am still trying to formulate a list of career accomplishments for that group of players. Tough to find a place to start. I can promise you this. The list below 10 will be better. And, for that matter, some of those guys you listed did not come out after their freshman year. Never said Romeo would be Buddy Hield and stay 4 years in order to learn defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: If you know the kid, or his family, and this is coming direct, then I can understand, but strongly doubt he would stay despite being a high lottery pick just because his D isn't NBA-ready. Every post I have said regarding him staying references the 'tail-end' of the lottery. Please refer me to the post where I said a 'top 5' Romeo stays in school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FW_Hoosier Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 18 minutes ago, 5fouls said: I am still trying to formulate a list of career accomplishments for that group of players. Tough to find a place to start. I can promise you this. The list below 10 will be better. And, for that matter, some of those guys you listed did not come out after their freshman year. Never said Romeo would be Buddy Hield and stay 4 years in order to learn defense. Stauskas and Hield were the only college players who weren’t one and done. And I don’t think the success or failure of those players have anything to do with how long they played in college. Either you have what it takes to make it in the NBA, or you don’t. Romeo deciding to leave after his freshman year and work on his defense in the pros, or stay another year to work on his defense in his college, won’t make a difference when it comes to his long-term career prospects. It’s all about what he does with the opportunity once he gets there. And if he’s a guaranteed top 10 pick in the 2019 draft, I don’t think he’s passing that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, 5fouls said: Every post I have said regarding him staying references the 'tail-end' of the lottery. Please refer me to the post where I said a 'top 5' Romeo stays in school. I didn't say you were saying otherwise, but was commenting on this: " Romeo is not going to go pro until his defense is NBA ready. So, he could average 22 points and stay if his defense sucks. Or, he could average 14 and go if his defense improves. 22 ppg may give IU fans a woody and 14 may disappoint, but the NBA acouts will be looking much closer at his defense than his offense when determining where he would get drafted. Bottom line is he's not going to risk long term NBA success by going before he is ready. If he is drafted top 5, its because his defense is deemed worthy by NBA scouts. So he goes. If he projects at 14, then the NBA questions his defense and he stays. Its as simple as that." So if he's #6 (gets assurance from team drafting there), or #7, or #8 and so on he won't go pro just because his D isn't NBA ready? I don't think that's likely. Same for #10. What's tail end? I mean if you get a guaranty from a team at #12, that's a LOT of money and a guaranteed spot, realizing your NBA dream. Every kid and family has their own decision-making process, and again I don't know Romeo, but strikes me as unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, 5fouls said: Every post I have said regarding him staying references the 'tail-end' of the lottery. Please refer me to the post where I said a 'top 5' Romeo stays in school. Your original statement didn't mention where he would be drafted. You mentioned the top for those that had good defense. So i read it like unless he has good defense he can't go top 5 which is untrue but i accept your addendum to your statement. But with that said, if they guaranteed he is top 10, he is gone. Whether he makes a career in the NBA or not, top 10 is guaranteed millions and i doubt he passes that up. I do agree though that unless he is top 10, he stays at IU for another season. But if he averages 22+ a game, the kid will be a top 10 draft pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 3 hours ago, FW_Hoosier said: Plenty of guys go in the top 10 that can’t play NBA-ready defense. They play defense in the NBA ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CauseThatsMyDJ Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FW_Hoosier Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 18 minutes ago, milehiiu said: They play defense in the NBA ? I would say they play defense at a higher level in the NBA than in college. But watching Curry and Harden get abused in the Western Conference Finals, I question how important it is for high-scoring guards to be able to play defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 24 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said: I would say they play defense at a higher level in the NBA than in college. But watching Curry and Harden get abused in the Western Conference Finals, I question how important it is for high-scoring guards to be able to play defense. Was a legit question. Seeing as how, I quit watching, for the most part, the NBA years ago.... partly due to the porous defenses I was watching at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 2 hours ago, milehiiu said: Was a legit question. Seeing as how, I quit watching, for the most part, the NBA years ago.... partly due to the porous defenses I was watching at the time. They play very good defense in the NBA. And unlike in college where the best defensive teams usually mug the opponent, they manage to do it without fouling in the NBA. Watching a good defensive team in the NBA is actually one of the most enjoyable basketball watches around IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CauseThatsMyDJ Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 34 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: They play very good defense in the NBA. And unlike in college where the best defensive teams usually mug the opponent, they manage to do it without fouling in the NBA. Watching a good defensive team in the NBA is actually one of the most enjoyable basketball watches around IMO. I loathe the Pistons (much more during the malice in the palace years) but their streak of holding opponents under 80 points was cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 52 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: They play very good defense in the NBA. And unlike in college where the best defensive teams usually mug the opponent, they manage to do it without fouling in the NBA. Watching a good defensive team in the NBA is actually one of the most enjoyable basketball watches around IMO. How often does it happen ? Seriously, trying to find a reason to watch again. Used to go to a ton of Nugget's games. Got disenchanted with the play on defense. Haven't been back for years, because of that. Still..... trying to open my mind up. But after seeing what I saw in the past.... something that is very hard for me to overcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, milehiiu said: How often does it happen ? Seriously, trying to find a reason to watch again. Used to go to a ton of Nugget's games. Got disenchanted with the play on defense. Haven't been back for years, because of that. Still..... trying to open my mind up. But after seeing what I saw in the past.... something that is very hard for me to overcome. Good teams usually play good defense, especially in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CauseThatsMyDJ Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 minute ago, KoB2011 said: Good teams usually play good defense, especially in the playoffs. Right...teams like the D'Antoni Suns are the exception, not the rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 12 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: Good teams usually play good defense, especially in the playoffs. Well. Right there is one of my problems with the NBA. Having the ability to play good defense.... but doing it during the playoffs. Really, saw that happen. And is what caused me to turn away. Oh, I understand upping one's game for crunch time. What I can't understand is why some take time off during the regular season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2018 Report Share Posted June 25, 2018 1 hour ago, milehiiu said: Well. Right there is one of my problems with the NBA. Having the ability to play good defense.... but doing it during the playoffs. Really, saw that happen. And is what caused me to turn away. Oh, I understand upping one's game for crunch time. What I can't understand is why some take time off during the regular season. What sport do you believe doesn't do this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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