NBA Thread

[Hoosierhoopster]

They’re already talking to Butler, the Lakers can spend, spend, and spend some more. Anyway they still have guys to trade 

[5fouls]

The Pacers should offer Edmond Sumner to the Lakers for Davis.  

[BGleas]

It’s still unclear if the Lakers will have room for another max contract, it will all come down to the Pelicans agreeing to delay the execution of the trade and AD agreeing to waive a trade kicker. 

But regardless, if I’m LA I’m not bringing in another max guy, I’m going after 2-3 experienced, veteran 3 & D guys. Bring in Reddick and Malcolm Brodgdon and see if you can get a guy like Ariza on a friendly deal.  They’ll still need a guard/ball handler too. 

But I think dumping all their cap room into one player would be a mistake, especially after what we just saw with the Warriors and their injuries. 

[NotIThatLives]

1 hour ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

They’re already talking to Butler, the Lakers can spend, spend, and spend some more. Anyway they still have guys to trade 

They are in a predicament with max players.  From my understanding it's not like the Yankees.  

https://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/la-sp-anthony-davis-trade-lakers-salary-cap-20190616-story.html

[dgambill]

2 hours ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

They’re already talking to Butler, the Lakers can spend, spend, and spend some more. Anyway they still have guys to trade 

The trade is announced to take effect on July 6th...they will have roughly 24 million to spend. That ain’t landing you Butler. They can’t go over the cap to sign someone else’s players. You can only go over the cap to sign your own. This isn’t baseball. This isn’t football...it’s in the middle. You can only exceed the cap to re-sign your own players. Lakers only decent player left is Kuzma...and they don’t want to move him. They can still sign some guys on below market deals to play with Lebron but it won’t be a max player like Butler. Lakers need to be smart to put some shooters around Lebron...can’t shoot their wad in one guy. Even with GS out id still take several teams ahead of Lakers.

[dgambill]

2 hours ago, BGleas said:

It’s still unclear if the Lakers will have room for another max contract, it will all come down to the Pelicans agreeing to delay the execution of the trade and AD agreeing to waive a trade kicker. 

But regardless, if I’m LA I’m not bringing in another max guy, I’m going after 2-3 experienced, veteran 3 & D guys. Bring in Reddick and Malcolm Brodgdon and see if you can get a guy like Ariza on a friendly deal.  They’ll still need a guard/ball handler too. 

But I think dumping all their cap room into one player would be a mistake, especially after what we just saw with the Warriors and their injuries. 

Agreed...I expect then to split up the money...see them going after second tier guys in FA like Mirotic and Lopez to help space the floor....maybe bring back Caldwell Pope to maximize their space.

[Hoosierhoopster]

9 hours ago, dgambill said:

The trade is announced to take effect on July 6th...they will have roughly 24 million to spend. That ain’t landing you Butler. They can’t go over the cap to sign someone else’s players. You can only go over the cap to sign your own. This isn’t baseball. This isn’t football...it’s in the middle. You can only exceed the cap to re-sign your own players. Lakers only decent player left is Kuzma...and they don’t want to move him. They can still sign some guys on below market deals to play with Lebron but it won’t be a max player like Butler. Lakers need to be smart to put some shooters around Lebron...can’t shoot their wad in one guy. Even with GS out id still take several teams ahead of Lakers.

https://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2019/6/16/18681369/lakers-rumors-jimmy-butler-kawhi-leonard-kemba-walker-free-agency-nba-news-analysis-reports

Butler is a free agent. It's not baseball, it's free agency. 

https://heavy.com/sports/2019/05/jimmy-butler-contract-salary-free-agency-rumors/

 

[NotIThatLives]

23 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

https://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2019/6/16/18681369/lakers-rumors-jimmy-butler-kawhi-leonard-kemba-walker-free-agency-nba-news-analysis-reports

Butler is a free agent. It's not baseball, it's free agency. 

https://heavy.com/sports/2019/05/jimmy-butler-contract-salary-free-agency-rumors/

 

Do you think Jimmy Butler will take 8-9 million less per year?

By all accounts, unless the pelicans are trying to make the Lakers a super team are not going to allow them to wait.  Crazier things have happened but no one sees Davis not taking the trade kicker.  

You are a smart and reputable poster.  Did you read your first article all the way through?  It explains all this.  

Edited June 17, 2019 by NotIThatLives

[BGleas]

30 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

https://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2019/6/16/18681369/lakers-rumors-jimmy-butler-kawhi-leonard-kemba-walker-free-agency-nba-news-analysis-reports

Butler is a free agent. It's not baseball, it's free agency. 

https://heavy.com/sports/2019/05/jimmy-butler-contract-salary-free-agency-rumors/

 

They have to have the cap space to sign him, unless they are able to work out some kind of S+T with Philly, but the problem there is the only asset the Lakers have to trade is Kuzma. You can only go over the cap to resign your own free agents. 

[NotIThatLives]

Two conflicting reports.  I'll go with Woj until told otherwise.  

• The Pelicans are open to waiting to complete the trade to help the Lakers with free agency, but if they move the No. 4 pick to a third team, it could complicate matters because that team or the Pelicans would not likely have the No. 4 pick during Summer League from July 5-15. (Tania Ganguli, Los Angeles Times)

 

• The Pelicans and Lakers plan to complete the Davis trade on July 6, but if they wait to July 30, Los Angles would end up with $32.5 million in cap space compared to $23.7 million. (Adrian Wojnarowski and Bobby Marks, ESPN.com)

[IU Scott]

27 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

Two conflicting reports.  I'll go with Woj until told otherwise.  

• The Pelicans are open to waiting to complete the trade to help the Lakers with free agency, but if they move the No. 4 pick to a third team, it could complicate matters because that team or the Pelicans would not likely have the No. 4 pick during Summer League from July 5-15. (Tania Ganguli, Los Angeles Times)

 

• The Pelicans and Lakers plan to complete the Davis trade on July 6, but if they wait to July 30, Los Angles would end up with $32.5 million in cap space compared to $23.7 million. (Adrian Wojnarowski and Bobby Marks, ESPN.com)

Have no idea why the Pelicans would be willing to help the Lakers out anymore than they already have.

[Hoosierhoopster]

9 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Have no idea why the Pelicans would be willing to help the Lakers out anymore than they already have.

It's an interesting situation for sure. The Pel's made out well in this trade, how much they're willing to work with the Lakers going forward is likely tied to the deal.

[Hoosierhoopster]

57 minutes ago, BGleas said:

They have to have the cap space to sign him, unless they are able to work out some kind of S+T with Philly, but the problem there is the only asset the Lakers have to trade is Kuzma. You can only go over the cap to resign your own free agents. 

Yeah, I'm just saying they're obviously working through their options including sign and trade deals and working with AD on the numbers. The efforts to acquire Butler have been in the works for some time now. People didn't think the Pels would work with the Lakers and this wouldn't happen. Now it has. Lakers obviously aren't done here.

[Hoosierhoopster]

1 hour ago, NotIThatLives said:

Do you think Jimmy Butler will take 8-9 million less per year?

By all accounts, unless the pelicans are trying to make the Lakers a super team are not going to allow them to wait.  Crazier things have happened but no one sees Davis not taking the trade kicker.  

You are a smart and reputable poster.  Did you read your first article all the way through?  It explains all this.  

No I don't. Butler is all about money, lol, that's been his mo, and why he's with Philly now, for a long time now. And yep, as I posted above, I'm just saying the Lakers aren't done and are exploring all options, including S&T's, to acquire Butler or a comparable player. There are guys who will take less, etc., to join a super team with LeBron and AD. They're now the favorites for a title. I'm no Lakers fan, at all, but they're not done here.

[BGleas]

1 hour ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

Yeah, I'm just saying they're obviously working through their options including sign and trade deals and working with AD on the numbers. The efforts to acquire Butler have been in the works for some time now. People didn't think the Pels would work with the Lakers and this wouldn't happen. Now it has. Lakers obviously aren't done here.

Of course they're not done, they only have 6 players. The question ultimately is how much cap space will they have. The Lakers were projecting to have room for two max players (AD + a free agent) but it appears unless they get some help that they potentially miscalculated how much space they would have. 

Davis is giving up a lot of money to make this move to LA, so I don't see him passing on the $4M trade kicker, so then they're basically relying on the Pels to help them out if they want to have room for another max. Will be interesting, will the Pels help them in good faith since they got a pretty big haul or won't they? It's actually in the Pels best interest to not help the Lakers as they'll want those picks to be as bad a possible. 

It could actually be helping the Lakers from themselves, as I believe the Lakers are better off adding 2-3 quality, veteran players with their space as opposed to 1 max guy. 

Will be interesting to see how it plays out. 

[Hoosierhoopster]

1 hour ago, BGleas said:

Of course they're not done, they only have 6 players. The question ultimately is how much cap space will they have. The Lakers were projecting to have room for two max players (AD + a free agent) but it appears unless they get some help that they potentially miscalculated how much space they would have. 

Davis is giving up a lot of money to make this move to LA, so I don't see him passing on the $4M trade kicker, so then they're basically relying on the Pels to help them out if they want to have room for another max. Will be interesting, will the Pels help them in good faith since they got a pretty big haul or won't they? It's actually in the Pels best interest to not help the Lakers as they'll want those picks to be as bad a possible. 

It could actually be helping the Lakers from themselves, as I believe the Lakers are better off adding 2-3 quality, veteran players with their space as opposed to 1 max guy. 

Will be interesting to see how it plays out. 

Definitely interesting to watch how all this pans out. 

[dwtaylor1055]

Jazz are front runners to acquire Mike Conley.   More than likely Conley gets traded this week. 

[dgambill]

Pacers....most likely to re-sign their own and run them back out there in an attempt for 4 seed and rake in the cash from a few home playoff games. 

[IU Scott]

Looks like if Kyrie goes to Brooklyn then they might let Russell go as a restricted free agent and the Pacers are one of the front runners to get Russell.

[FKIM01]

13 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Looks like if Kyrie goes to Brooklyn then they might let Russell go as a restricted free agent and the Pacers are one of the front runners to get Russell.

From what I've seen, I'd rather have Russell than Kyrie.

[BGleas]

59 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

From what I've seen, I'd rather have Russell than Kyrie.

I don't know. I've definitely shifted on Kyrie from where I was at the beginning of the season and don't want him back in Boston, but at the same time Russell is actually a worse defender than even Kyrie, and much less efficient offensively. He improved a lot for the Nets last season no doubt, but I think he's getting a little perception boost from the great story that the Nets were. 

Edited June 17, 2019 by BGleas

[Hoosierhoopster]

25 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I don't know. I've definitely shifted on Kyrie from where I was at the beginning of the season and don't want him back in Boston, but at the same time Russell is actually a worse defender than even Kyrie, and much less efficient offensively. He improved a lot for the Nets last season no doubt, but I think he's getting a little perception boost from the great story that the Nets were. 

This is another interesting question -- who would you rather have on your team, here the Pacers, and why?

On a pure stats basis (just last season's stats), it's Kyrie. 

23.8 ppg, on 48.7% FG's, and 40.1 from the arc, 55.7 eFG%, 24.3 PER, 6.9 assists and 5 boards, and a 4.7 VORP, to 

21.1 on 43.4% FGs, 36.9 from the arc, 51.2 eFG%, 19.4 PER, and 7 assists and 3.9 boards, and a 3.3 VORP. 

But the Nets overachieved, lead by Russell, who played good team basketball, whereas Boston underachieved, and according to many largely due to the way Kyrie plays/demands the ball, including going nuts in the playoffs and shooting horrifically bad, and then answering questions about that as I should have shot it more. 

As for me, I  do not want Kyrie as the alpha dog on my team. As a secondary player (like with LBJ), yes -- with certain players like LBJ, as the alpha, no. I'm not sure I'd want Russell as the alpha either, but end of the day the question is who would run better with Vic, as we're talking Pacers, and I'd take Russell there.

[BGleas]

11 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

This is another interesting question -- who would you rather have on your team, here the Pacers, and why?

On a pure stats basis (just last season's stats), it's Kyrie. 

23.8 ppg, on 48.7% FG's, and 40.1 from the arc, 55.7 eFG%, 24.3 PER, 6.9 assists and 5 boards, and a 4.7 VORP, to 

21.1 on 43.4% FGs, 36.9 from the arc, 51.2 eFG%, 19.4 PER, and 7 assists and 3.9 boards, and a 3.3 VORP. 

But the Nets overachieved, lead by Russell, who played good team basketball, whereas Boston underachieved, and according to many largely due to the way Kyrie plays/demands the ball, including going nuts in the playoffs and shooting horrifically bad, and then answering questions about that as I should have shot it more. 

As for me, I  do not want Kyrie as the alpha dog on my team. As a secondary player (like with LBJ), yes -- with certain players like LBJ, as the alpha, no. I'm not sure I'd want Russell as the alpha either, but end of the day the question is who would run better with Vic, as we're talking Pacers, and I'd take Russell there.

Absolutely, you wouldn't pair Vic and Kyrie, and I wasn't really suggesting the Pacers should even entertain that. I just meant in a vacuum, Kyrie is the way better player, and I think the team that forks over a truckload to Russell is going to end up regretting it long-term. I don't know what Russell will command as a RFA, but I would not want my franchise giving him a max deal. That's a contract I think any team will regret in 2-3 years. 

[dgambill]

2 hours ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

This is another interesting question -- who would you rather have on your team, here the Pacers, and why?

On a pure stats basis (just last season's stats), it's Kyrie. 

23.8 ppg, on 48.7% FG's, and 40.1 from the arc, 55.7 eFG%, 24.3 PER, 6.9 assists and 5 boards, and a 4.7 VORP, to 

21.1 on 43.4% FGs, 36.9 from the arc, 51.2 eFG%, 19.4 PER, and 7 assists and 3.9 boards, and a 3.3 VORP. 

But the Nets overachieved, lead by Russell, who played good team basketball, whereas Boston underachieved, and according to many largely due to the way Kyrie plays/demands the ball, including going nuts in the playoffs and shooting horrifically bad, and then answering questions about that as I should have shot it more. 

As for me, I  do not want Kyrie as the alpha dog on my team. As a secondary player (like with LBJ), yes -- with certain players like LBJ, as the alpha, no. I'm not sure I'd want Russell as the alpha either, but end of the day the question is who would run better with Vic, as we're talking Pacers, and I'd take Russell there.

Don't forget.....Kyrie has already had some major injury concerns...missed many games already and at 27 in the midst of his prime actually decreased in scoring etc last two years...would cost starting out at 32 million.

Russell....23 years old...hasn't missed any time...scoring avg jumped 6pts per game (so improving)....might be able to be had for less than the max...but at the max 27 million....saving you 5 million a year for other players even if you max him out.

That's a more complete picture.....I'd be scared of Kyrie's history...runs out on Lebron...locker room issues in Boston...injury issues....lot's more money. Yikes!

[NotIThatLives]

7 hours ago, dgambill said:

Pacers....most likely to re-sign their own and run them back out there in an attempt for 4 seed and rake in the cash from a few home playoff games. 

May be more of a realistic indication of where Vic is.  Hold the horses and go all in when he's 100% in 20-21