Vincent14 Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 I think the biggest problem right now is we play too many guys. Just because we have 11 guys who can play doesn't mean we need to play all of them. It's hard for players to get into a rhythm when they are getting subbed in and out every 3 minutes. Perfect example was Friday against Nebraska when we started on an 11-2 run looking like we were on our way to a blowout. Then Nebraska called a timeout and we swapped everyone out apart from Trayce and Nebraska was allowed back into the game. Now I'm not the coach and don't know other factors such as work in practice but here's the lineup I think would perform the best PG - Rob (should really be playing 35 min) G - Devonte G - Al F - Justin F - Trayce Armaan off the bench to backup the guards Jerome at the 3 Race at the 4 Joey to clean up minutes at the 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 I totally agree with you on the amount of players being used. I know I am old school but I like seeing an 8 man rotation with no more than 9. Right now if we went to a 9 man rotation my two to be left out are Arman and De'Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 Green was just injured, again. Rob of course has missed most of our games with injuries, etc. and is still getting back to major minutes. And so on. This is one reason you can't pigeon-hole a short bench. It's also a reason for developing guys so they're ready when other guys get injured, get sick, etc. I've never been in favor of a short bench just to play a short bench. If you have the guys who can contribute and add different looks / different strengths, there's just no reason not to play them. How "deep" or not deep we are is always a question, however, and who can contribute meaningfully during conference play seems to still be something of a question mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 Just now, Hoosierhoopster said: Green was just injured, again. Rob of course has missed most of our games with injuries, etc. and is still getting back to major minutes. And so on. This is one reason you can't pigeon-hole a short bench. It's also a reason for developing guys so they're ready when other guys get injured, get sick, etc. I've never been in favor of a short bench just to play a short bench. If you have the guys who can contribute and add different looks / different strengths, there's just no reason not to play them. How "deep" or not deep we are is always a question, however, and who can contribute meaningfully during conference play seems to still be something of a question mark. I know when I played and could play more minutes you would get in a better flow of the game and being a shooter I would have a better rhythm to the game. I hated when we would sub every few minutes because you could never find your flow for the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoosier_exotics Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: Green was just injured, again. Rob of course has missed most of our games with injuries, etc. and is still getting back to major minutes. And so on. This is one reason you can't pigeon-hole a short bench. It's also a reason for developing guys so they're ready when other guys get injured, get sick, etc. I've never been in favor of a short bench just to play a short bench. If you have the guys who can contribute and add different looks / different strengths, there's just no reason not to play them. How "deep" or not deep we are is always a question, however, and who can contribute meaningfully during conference play seems to still be something of a question mark. Agreed. I also think that Archies intentions are to keep guys fresh for defensive purposes. But, he isnt getting the effort from the fellas consistently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWB Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 Seems to me our deep bench should be viewed as a tool box, rather than 11 guys that need minutes. By that I mean, Archie could use the bench to create better match ups. Big line vs big line, small vs small, fast vs fast. Some games certain guys play, other games other guys play depending on the match-ups and adjust as needed in the flow of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 25 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I know when I played and could play more minutes you would get in a better flow of the game and being a shooter I would have a better rhythm to the game. I hated when we would sub every few minutes because you could never find your flow for the game. No one is talking about subbing every few minutes, and that's not something that CAM does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 41 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: No one is talking about subbing every few minutes, and that's not something that CAM does. Well Friday night he did at the first timeout when we were up 13-4 and took out 4 starters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zlinedavid Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 1 hour ago, IU Scott said: I totally agree with you on the amount of players being used. I know I am old school but I like seeing an 8 man rotation with no more than 9. Right now if we went to a 9 man rotation my two to be left out are Arman and De'Ron A) We only have 10 healthy scholarship players at the moment, so "limiting" it to 9 is not much of a stretch. B) Doesn't mean it has to be the same 8-9 players from game to game. There might be matchups and situations where playing De'Ron over Damezi might be beneficial. Having things at least set in wet concrete might be nice, but don't bypass a potential advantage just because "this player is not in the rotation". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zlinedavid Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 4 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Well Friday night he did at the first timeout when we were up 13-4 and took out 4 starters They didn't get back from NYC until early Wednesday morning. Yeah, this are young kids that are in great shape, but they're not machines. If you're up 9 that fast and you know that tired legs might be a problem in the 2nd half, why not get them an extra blow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 10 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Well Friday night he did at the first timeout when we were up 13-4 and took out 4 starters Oh come on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent14 Posted December 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 Nebraska played 3 players off the bench who logged 13, 12, and 2 min. Conditioning shouldn't be that big of a problem for college kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zlinedavid Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, Vincent14 said: Nebraska played 3 players off the bench who logged 13, 12, and 2 min. Conditioning shouldn't be that big of a problem for college kids. Nebraska had nearly a week off prior. We had maybe a day and a half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 32 minutes ago, Zlinedavid said: They didn't get back from NYC until early Wednesday morning. Yeah, this are young kids that are in great shape, but they're not machines. If you're up 9 that fast and you know that tired legs might be a problem in the 2nd half, why not get them an extra blow? Why not put the team away and get up big then sub. Nebraska was coming off a blow out loss and if we could just got the lead to 15 then they might have went away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 28 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: Oh come on. You saying that did not happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zlinedavid Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 Just now, IU Scott said: Why not put the team away and get up big then sub. Nebraska was coming off a blow out loss and if we could just got the lead to 15 then they might have went away Because one of your subs was more or less your starting PG, another was a kid who has started several games this year, and the other two have been reasonably reliable in recent games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 you KNOW this thread is right up my alley! no need to go deep into the bench. play the top 6 or 7 a ton of minutes and play 8 and 9 some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 5 minutes ago, Zlinedavid said: Because one of your subs was more or less your starting PG, another was a kid who has started several games this year, and the other two have been reasonably reliable in recent games? Did not say you not sub at all but there was no need to take out 4 guys at that time. I know I am old school but watching a lot of older games RMK would keep the same lineup in the whole second half and not sub at all. Watch the 1 Maryland game in the tournament which was one of the best games I saw an IU team play. In the first half the bench played a total of 2 minutes and that was because one of the starters got his 3rd foul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 21 minutes ago, IU Scott said: You saying that did not happen You're killing me with this stuff. No, I responded to your subbing every few minutes comment. Come on already. Are you really complaining about the number of substitutions, substitution patterns with CAM, really? Is that really where you want to go? This kind of discussion just kills me man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 13 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said: you KNOW this thread is right up my alley! no need to go deep into the bench. play the top 6 or 7 a ton of minutes and play 8 and 9 some. I knew you'd love it! We don't agree on this but it's all good, there's really no right or wrong here, all opinion and yours is just as warranted as anyone else's. For me, depth is important particularly with all the injuries etc. But there are plenty of coaches who successfully stick with a short bench. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: You're killing me with this stuff. No, I responded to your subbing every few minutes comment. Come on already. Are you really complaining about the number of substitutions, substitution patterns with CAM, really? Is that really where you want to go? This kind of discussion just kills me man. I also see Izzo do this some and I just don't like having a pattern for subbing. If the team is on a role let it play out instead of stopping momentum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 10 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I also see Izzo do this some and I just don't like having a pattern for subbing. If the team is on a role let it play out instead of stopping momentum. In Archie's defense, he kept the same lineup in that was playing really well, from about the 9-minute mark of the second half until about 2 minutes left in the game against UConn. In that situation he took heat for not bringing TDJ and Phinisee back sooner. Also, in OT against Nebraska he did not make a single substitution because the guys in the game were playing well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 Just now, BGleas said: In Archie's defense, he kept the same lineup in that was playing really well, from about the 9-minute mark of the second half until about 2 minutes left in the game against UConn. In that situation he took heat for not bringing TDJ and Phinisee back sooner. Also, in OT against Nebraska he did not make a single substitution because the guys in the game were playing well. No no, stop using actual facts. Instead, just throw out complaints about "substitutions", facts are irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zlinedavid Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: No no, stop using actual facts. Instead, just throw out complaints about "substitutions", facts are irrelevant. Never let facts get in the way of a good story Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted December 16, 2019 Report Share Posted December 16, 2019 Some of you guys must watch a different game than I do. Anyone that does not currently have Damezi in the preferred rotation please explain to me why. Now, on the broader issue. This is why you don't use all 13 schollies. There simply not enough minutes in a game. Use that 13th scholly on a Sr. walk on who will help the team's APR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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