btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said: So very hard, so many posts i just don't respond to because it's just not worth it lol 🤪 6 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said: so hard to find yourself agreeing with either of them isn't it? This is like the ultimate pot met kettle moment. 🤣🤣🤣 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 14 minutes ago, btownqb said: You still have to have depth to get to that point. I wasn't confusing you with anyone. Kansas played 9 dudes 9 mins or more a game. In conference that downgraded to 8. And, realistically, you can actually argue 7 since Martin was out for half the games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 Just now, 5fouls said: In conference that downgraded to 8. And, realistically, you can actually argue 7 since Martin was out for half the games. But that wasnt their design, until the injury. I'm not seeing where they downgraded to 8 in general though? From the graph you posted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, btownqb said: This is like the ultimate pot met kettle moment. 🤣🤣🤣 I know right lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 8 minutes ago, btownqb said: This isn't giving me anything. I understand we aren't going to be as good, at times, when the bench is on the court. The Michigan, RU, Purdue, and Wyoming games don't support your stance. And a 4 min break for TJD where we are only -2, is good for our basketball team. He has to rest. And you also mentioned "by the 10 min mark"... and my question is.. why would we, generally, want guys playing more then 10 straight mins in the first half? I think they should be subbed out by that point. Are you deliberately missing the point? No where did I suggest that I want guys playing more than 10 minutes in the first half. Why do we have to rest all 3 of our best players ten minutes into the game at the same time? Are you saying there’s no way to have them rotate through getting rest? I mean, virtually other other CBB team does this effectively. You’re acting like this is a radical strategy. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 Just now, tdhoosier said: Are you deliberately missing the point? No where did I suggest that I want guys playing more than 10 minutes in the first half. Why do we have to rest all 3 of our best players ten minutes into the game at the same time? Are you saying there’s no way to have them rotate through getting rest? I mean, virtually other other CBB team does this effectively. You’re acting like this is a radical strategy. No, I'm saying.. it didnt have that big of an effect. Shit we won half those games lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobSaccamanno Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 All I can say is that the board is active, which is a good thing IMO in the offseason. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 22 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said: That is about as true or provable as saying we can win more by only playing 7. We have no idea because we never did it. And i don't have a problem giving starters a breather. I just don't think at any given time should your best 3 players, when you only have 3 really good players, should be on the bench at the same time, unless you are really controlling the game or getting it handed to you. With that said, i understand that my way of thinking doesn't align with yours or some others and unfortunately aligns with IUScott which makes me want to change my opinion lol, just kidding IUScott . I am probably colored by watching 80-90s IU basketball where knight played his starters for such long times. I am aware that isn't necessary today's game though. Hard to change my thoughts on this though. Great minds think alike, RMK pretty much only subbed due to getting 3 fouls in a half or stupid play. He had no set pattern to when to make subs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 (edited) 4 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Great minds think alike, RMK pretty much only subbed due to getting 3 fouls in a half or stupid play. He had no set pattern to when to make subs. https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1999.html This shows a different story. https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2000.html So does this https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1998.html And this Edited April 12, 2022 by btownqb 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 10 minutes ago, 5fouls said: In conference that downgraded to 8. And, realistically, you can actually argue 7 since Martin was out for half the games. You definitely have to look at more than just the average minutes and look at how many games those players sued in. I would look at the minutes of close games to see how the coaches used their bench Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 minute ago, btownqb said: No, I'm saying.. it didnt have that big of an effect. Shit we won half those games lol You said the Woody doesn’t use those lineups. I demonstrated that he does. And he consistently does. And if these lineups consistently have negative swings, even in wins, than the use of them in loses is highlighted even more. Heck, the negative swings I used as examples were when we playing pretty well. I can only imagine how bad these swings were during our losing streaks. Again, we lost many games by less than 5 points. If we’re throwing our hands up and putting in a completely ineffective lineup mid way thought he first half, opponents are going to take advantage of it. They did - almost every single time. Those 2-4 minutes stretches probably cost us a few games. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: You said the Woody doesn’t use those lineups. I demonstrated that he does. And he consistently does. And if these lineups consistently have negative swings, even in wins, than the use of them in loses is highlighted even more. Heck, the negative swings I used as examples were when we playing pretty well. I can only imagine how bad these swings were during our losing streaks. Again, we lost many games by less than 5 points. If we’re throwing our hands up and putting in a completely ineffective lineup mid way thought he first half, opponents are going to take advantage of it. They did - almost every single time. Those 2-4 minutes stretches probably cost us a few games. Iowa. It cost us at Iowa. After having been very good two straight games against Minnesota and OSU. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 minute ago, btownqb said: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1999.html This shows a different story. https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2000.html So does this https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1998.html And this I have watched a lot of old games since the pandemic started and stand by my comments. In the games I watched which were mainly 81, 87, 92 and 93. In most of those games which were big games and most were close games. In those games RMK did not have a set time to sub and he subbed mainly due to foul troubles which was 3 fouls in a half. He also benched you got stupid plays. You can look at minutes per game for bench players but look at how many games those players played and how many of their minutes were in blowouts. In the 92 we only dressed 10 guys while 3 were redshirting and he only played 8 of those 10 significant minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 18 minutes ago, btownqb said: But that wasnt their design, until the injury. I'm not seeing where they downgraded to 8 in general though? From the graph you posted. Coleman Lands is less than 10 minutes. I included him to show the cutoff point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 9 minutes ago, btownqb said: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1999.html This shows a different story. https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2000.html So does this https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1998.html And this So funny you showed 3 of the worst teams in the RMK era. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 Just now, 5fouls said: Coleman Lands is less than 10 minutes. I included him to show the cutoff point. I feel like 9 mins should still be included in a rotation. He played in 17/18 games. Either way.. the plan wasnt to just play 7 guys for 40 games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 7 minutes ago, btownqb said: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1999.html This shows a different story. https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2000.html So does this https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1998.html And this True the late 90's and early 00's show that. 1979 - https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1980.html 1980 - https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1981.html 1981 - https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1982.html He always played his best player maximum minutes. And maybe that is what i remember the most about him. You do prove your point so i will acquis the point to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 minute ago, IU Scott said: So funny you showed 3 of the worst teams in the RMK era. No... I showed the three last. And I will tell you why.. they all had similar records and post seasons results as our team this past year. So while you try and compare a very marginally above average 21-22 IU basketball team to a National champion... I am trying to make a much more relevant comparison. But either way.. it happened. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 (edited) 5 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said: True the late 90's and early 00's show that. 1979 - https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1980.html 1980 - https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1981.html 1981 - https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1982.html He always played his best player maximum minutes. And maybe that is what i remember the most about him. You do prove your point so i will acquis the point to you. I dont want a point. I'll I'm trying to say is.... you aren't "wrong" to have 8-9 guys in your rotation, if it works for you. I dont think either way is wrong or right. I just dont think you can say a coach was "wrong" when they didnt play their starters X amount of mins.. Maybe their starters suck lol idk Hard to know about 79-- who the heck knows what happens if coach is healthy. Dang it! Edited April 12, 2022 by btownqb 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 @IU Scott https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1991.html What about this season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, btownqb said: @IU Scott https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1991.html What about this season? Pretty good team and look like the two that started every game played 30 minutes. He tried a lot of different starting lineups so a lot of guys started to push up those numbers. Also that was a very deep team with experience. I just didn't think this year's team was deep and those bench players didn't compare to the bench Ayers of the 91 team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 minute ago, IU Scott said: Pretty good team and look like the two that started every game played 30 minutes. He tried a lot of different starting lineups so a lot of guys started to push up those numbers. Also that was a very deep team with experience. I just didn't think this year's team was deep and those bench players didn't compare to the bench Ayers of the 91 team. Who is getting cut from the rotation? You can't say Durr... if the kid from KU wasn't in their rotation, Durr absolutely wasn't in ours. So past him-- Bates, TG, JG, RP-- one of them gotta go. It makes no sense man. You have to get those 4 mins, for just an abundance of reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FKIM01 Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 34 minutes ago, btownqb said: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1999.html This shows a different story. https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2000.html So does this https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/1998.html And this Must have been a lot of stupid play...🤷♂️ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 6 minutes ago, btownqb said: Who is getting cut from the rotation? You can't say Durr... if the kid from KU wasn't in their rotation, Durr absolutely wasn't in ours. So past him-- Bates, TG, JG, RP-- one of them gotta go. It makes no sense man. You have to get those 4 mins, for just an abundance of reasons. Bates or Galloway. I am not worried about keeping the most kids happy I am worried about putting the best team in the floor. If we had 10 guys on this team and had lite drop off then go for it and play two different units but we don't have that and most teams don't. Just look at the final four teams this year they say 7-8 guys most of the minutes especially in the tournament. I guess the major difference is that kids back then we're patient enough to wait their turn for playing time. Today if they aren't playing coaches have to worry about them transferring early. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted April 12, 2022 Report Share Posted April 12, 2022 We need some personnel decisions to go final lol.. need new material to argue about. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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