Big Ten 2021-2022

[kyhoosier29]

4 hours ago, 5fouls said:

Makes him very dangerous.  If he does a better job of balancing proven veteran transfers with incoming 5 star talent, he fixes the problem he's had the last few years.

Most underachieving coach in college basketball just got a lifeline. And I don’t want to hear people say all of us would have loved to have his results blah blah blah. The guy has had a top 3 recruiting class 10 years in a row and has ONE title, thanks to a once-in-a-lifetime recruit in AD. Results may have been even less if they didn’t play in the weakest Power 5 conference and able to coast most of the year. Gets out-coached every year in the tourney. 

[Hoosier51]

16 minutes ago, kyhoosier29 said:

Most underachieving coach in college basketball just got a lifeline. And I don’t want to hear people say all of us would have loved to have his results blah blah blah. The guy has had a top 3 recruiting class 10 years in a row and has ONE title, thanks to a once-in-a-lifetime recruit in AD. Results may have been even less if they didn’t play in the weakest Power 5 conference and able to coast most of the year. Gets out-coached every year in the tourney. 

Good post 👍 

[KoB2011]

28 minutes ago, kyhoosier29 said:

Most underachieving coach in college basketball just got a lifeline. And I don’t want to hear people say all of us would have loved to have his results blah blah blah. The guy has had a top 3 recruiting class 10 years in a row and has ONE title, thanks to a once-in-a-lifetime recruit in AD. Results may have been even less if they didn’t play in the weakest Power 5 conference and able to coast most of the year. Gets out-coached every year in the tourney. 

How has he made so many Final Fours if he keeps getting outcoached in the tournament? 

I understand he brings in a lot of talent, but he's taken three different schools to Final Fours and gotten a lot of guys to buy in to playing as a team where others have failed with guys that aren't even that talented. Maybe it isn't great x and o coaching but it certainly is great leadership. 

[Hoosier51]

Just now, KoB2011 said:

How has he made so many Final Fours if he keeps getting outcoached in the tournament? 

With the talent he has had he should make the Final Four almost every year. You could put just about any decent coach with that talent and they will make some Final Fours. Heck Matt Painter might actually make one. 😀

1 minute ago, KoB2011 said:

Maybe it isn't great x and o coaching but it certainly is great leadership. 

This i do agree with you on.👍

[KoB2011]

9 minutes ago, Hoosier51 said:

With the talent he has had he should make the Final Four almost every year. You could put just about any decent coach with that talent and they will make some Final Fours. Heck Matt Painter might actually make one. 😀

This i do agree with you on.👍

So what we are saying is he gets talent other, supposedly better, coaches can't get and that he is a really good leader. 

The things you're agreeing to about him sure seem like things I would want in a coach. You brought up Painter, who I think most of us would admit is a good coach... Anyone want to make the case for Painter over Calipari? He may not be Coach K or or Coach Knight, but he is a pretty dang good coach.

[IU Scott]

27 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

How has he made so many Final Fours if he keeps getting outcoached in the tournament? 

I understand he brings in a lot of talent, but he's taken three different schools to Final Fours and gotten a lot of guys to buy in to playing as a team where others have failed with guys that aren't even that talented. Maybe it isn't great x and o coaching but it certainly is great leadership. 

In the record books it shows him only taken one team to the final four

[KoB2011]

Just now, IU Scott said:

In the record books it shows him only taken one team to the final four

One school yes, but still multiple trips which is not taking just one team. How many coaches have multiple Final Four trips?

[Hoosier51]

24 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

The things you're agreeing to about him sure seem like things I would want in a coach.

I would also want a coach that doesn't have to have only NBA All Star talent to win. If the one and done ever goes away he might want to think about going back to the NBA.

24 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

He may not be Coach K or or Coach Knight, but he is a pretty dang good coach.

I think he is an average coach but a really good salesman. Which to be fair is part of the game i guess.

 

 

Edited July 8, 2021 by Hoosier51

[Steubenhoosier]

What makes Calipari successful, why his model has done so well, and why the transfer portal is perfect for him is because he excels at managing egos. Whatever else you want to say about him, Calipari gets elite level, big egos to buy into the team concept and put individual agendas aside for the greater good of the team.

Maybe he just rolls the ball out there, but what he does to foster a team environment is infinitely more challenging than what he makes it look 

[rico]

1 hour ago, KoB2011 said:

One school yes, but still multiple trips which is not taking just one team. How many coaches have multiple Final Four trips?

Off the top of my head?

Cal

Pitino

Sutton

Hmmmmm

[Hoosierinbham]

2 minutes ago, rico said:

Off the top of my head?

Cal

Pitino

Sutton

Hmmmmm

Roy Williams 

[rico]

1 minute ago, Hoosierinbham said:

Roy Williams 

Dammit....I was trying to give it a UK "slant", geez.  LOL

[Hoosier51]

Ok lets get this thread back on track for the B1G and not turn it into the Calipari thread.

With most teams pretty much settled, assumuing Kofi doesn't go back to the Illini, which teams will have the biggest dropoff and which will be the biggest risers. I personally think Illinois and the Hawkeyes will be the biggest losers this season. The Hawkeyes and Illini have lost to much to not have a big dropoff. And this might be bias but i think the Hoosiers will be around fourth or fifth in the league and make the biggest leap forward. Last couple of seasons the Hoosier players seemed like they were just going through the motions, hopefully that is different this season.

 

Edited July 8, 2021 by Hoosier51

[IUFLA]

I agree that Illinois and Iowa will take a step backward, and throw Wisconsin in there too...also, I think Michigan State and Rutgers will either tread water or go backward...

I think IU and Northwestern will show the biggest gains...

[Hoosier51]

15 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I agree that Illinois and Iowa will take a step backward, and throw Wisconsin in there too...also, I think Michigan State and Rutgers will either tread water or go backward...

I think IU and Northwestern will show the biggest gains...

Northwestern is one of the only teams in the B1G that i don't mind doing well, so i would be ok with them improving. Most teams in the B1G i like to see fall flat on their faces anymore lol.

[kyhoosier29]

3 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

How has he made so many Final Fours if he keeps getting outcoached in the tournament? 

I understand he brings in a lot of talent, but he's taken three different schools to Final Fours and gotten a lot of guys to buy in to playing as a team where others have failed with guys that aren't even that talented. Maybe it isn't great x and o coaching but it certainly is great leadership. 

Well, for one…. again, he somehow convinces multiple 5 star kids to come to UK annually. (Yet for some reason can’t get any to stay more than one year.)

Secondly, he’s rarely tested in a normally weak conference which helps him secure top seeds almost every year making it much easier to win 4 games and make final fours. GUARANTEE his results would not have been the same to date if UK was in the Big10. Seeding is a big deal. 

Most UK fans think he’s a lousy X’s and O’s guy, but maybe you’re right. He’s able to foster an environment where all of these high ego guys that don’t care about school (most) buy into his plan. Buying in is definitely important for any coach or you can’t get past first base, but I hope we don’t turn into a one and done factory like he has where he throws out offers to every 5 star and doesn’t care about character, etc. I hope we are more strategic and the TYPE of people we bring in fit the program. Not saying I don’t hope for the same type talent, just hope it’s not at the expense of the culture Woody is building. Trust me, all Cal cares about is talent. He doesn’t do his homework on the front end. 
 

 

 

[KoB2011]

2 minutes ago, kyhoosier29 said:

Well, for one…. again, he somehow convinces multiple 5 star kids to come to UK annually. (Yet for some reason can’t get any to stay more than one year.)

Secondly, he’s rarely tested in a normally weak conference which helps him secure top seeds almost every year making it much easier to win 4 games and make final fours. GUARANTEE his results would not have been the same to date if UK was in the Big10. Seeding is a big deal. 

Most UK fans think he’s a lousy X’s and O’s guy, but maybe you’re right. He’s able to foster an environment where all of these high ego guys that don’t care about school (most) buy into his plan. Buying in is definitely important for any coach or you can’t get past first base, but I hope we don’t turn into a one and done factory like he has where he throws out offers to every 5 star and doesn’t care about character, etc. I hope we are more strategic and the TYPE of people we bring in fit the program. Not saying I don’t hope for the same type talent, just hope it’s not at the expense of the culture Woody is building. Trust me, all Cal cares about is talent. He doesn’t do his homework on the front end. 
 

 

 

So I will agree I don't want us to turn in to a 5 star factory, but we will have to agree to disagree about the rest. I would love Cal's results and I can't really think of many/any character issues. 

I'll just say I would take Cal over Izzo any day. Both have really good results, both go about it different ways, but I can't buy in to the fact that one and done equates to character issues. 

[IUFLA]

3 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

How many coaches have multiple Final Four trips?

67

[KoB2011]

8 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

67

Being one of 67 of the thousands of coaches to ever coach college basketball puts you in pretty rare company. If we look at active coaches it an even smaller group, obviously.

I don't think Cal is going on anyone's Mt. Rushmore of coaching, but he's clearly a damn good basketball coach. 

[kyhoosier29]

24 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

So I will agree I don't want us to turn in to a 5 star factory, but we will have to agree to disagree about the rest. I would love Cal's results and I can't really think of many/any character issues. 

I'll just say I would take Cal over Izzo any day. Both have really good results, both go about it different ways, but I can't buy in to the fact that one and done equates to character issues. 

I don’t think you want Woody recruiting guys solely based on their stars without completing his due diligence. That leads to character issues or cultural issues. I was not making a direct correlation.  It has happened on numerous occasions at UK under Cal and I know that for certain. It’s just not always made public. 

[Hoosierinbham]

3 hours ago, rico said:

Dammit....I was trying to give it a UK "slant", geez.  LOL

Been with the kids all day. Completely missed that one!

[dgambill]

12 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

Being one of 67 of the thousands of coaches to ever coach college basketball puts you in pretty rare company. If we look at active coaches it an even smaller group, obviously.

I don't think Cal is going on anyone's Mt. Rushmore of coaching, but he's clearly a damn good basketball coach. 

Living in Kentucky for many years I had to listen and watch tons of UK basketball games and call in shows due to those around me. Cal is absolutely a good coach. He coaches his players VERY hard. Defense especially. His teams almost without exception improve more from Nov to March than any team in the country. He preaches sharing the ball, sacrificing for the team, and playing hard. The issue with playing so many freshman is that they are inconsistent. Unless you have a special class of kids they revert back to old ways and they don't have the experience how hard they have to play ALL the time to win. They often just think their talent will win the game and when they experience adversity sometimes they struggle not having the experience of older players how to play through it. He walks a fine line with these OAD kids. How he keeps them all playing together and sacrificing their stats and their shots for the good of the team is very difficult. That said he typically has more talent on the floor than anyone he ever faces. His challenges are just different than most coaches. 

Oh and his in game adjustments and X/O's....yes I don't think they are his strengths AT ALL. We've seen him struggle many times when losing key assistant coaches and at end of game situations. I do think he is getting better at that...after all we all learn and grow over time. I think his ego is probably the biggest threat to his coaching ability though...which is immense. Whatever we think of him and his salesman persona...the guy can motivate and put together a team like few others.

[rico]

2 hours ago, dgambill said:

Living in Kentucky for many years I had to listen and watch tons of UK basketball games and call in shows due to those around me. Cal is absolutely a good coach. He coaches his players VERY hard. Defense especially. His teams almost without exception improve more from Nov to March than any team in the country. He preaches sharing the ball, sacrificing for the team, and playing hard. The issue with playing so many freshman is that they are inconsistent. Unless you have a special class of kids they revert back to old ways and they don't have the experience how hard they have to play ALL the time to win. They often just think their talent will win the game and when they experience adversity sometimes they struggle not having the experience of older players how to play through it. He walks a fine line with these OAD kids. How he keeps them all playing together and sacrificing their stats and their shots for the good of the team is very difficult. That said he typically has more talent on the floor than anyone he ever faces. His challenges are just different than most coaches. 

Oh and his in game adjustments and X/O's....yes I don't think they are his strengths AT ALL. We've seen him struggle many times when losing key assistant coaches and at end of game situations. I do think he is getting better at that...after all we all learn and grow over time. I think his ego is probably the biggest threat to his coaching ability though...which is immense. Whatever we think of him and his salesman persona...the guy can motivate and put together a team like few others.

Giving Cal any love whatsoever is strictly prohibited on this site.

[dgambill]

Just now, rico said:

Giving Cal any love whatsoever is strictly prohibited on this site.

I could just as easily do a post of his bad qualities as a coach...I think the point though is he is a very good basketball coach. He demands a lot from his players and they respond. You can't stay at this level with smoke and mirrors and lies and slick sales pitches....there is definitely a really good coach there. I've seen his post game shows and him exactly identifying what went wrong...plays that worked and didn't etc.....he knows what he is doing. That said he has immense expectations on him from the fan base and college basketball based on the recruiting advantage he has there. He has had some mixed results for sure. He started out about as fast and successful as one can....and he has hit a pretty big road block the past 3-4 years...but one thing Cal does is ADAPT to the game. We are now seeing it with the portal...and I think UK will again be hard to beat next year based on how he has changed his tactics to surround those 5* OAD types now with veteran transfers. Trust me....no one gets more satisfaction in watching UK struggle then me. It pains me to give them their due...

[ColtsIUDomer]

So...How will Cal do in the BIG10 this year?