Wisconsin Postgame Thread

[Hippopotamo]

You can tell this team is learning how to win together. Every single talented transfer came from losing programs, and everyone previously on IU’s roster hasn’t won anything. 

[Coach Robby]

Jeepers, glad I waited until this morning to read all this.... I'm sad, pissed, mad, etc just like the rest of you. Some things:

1. We won't win many games this season where TJD attempts 10 or less shots. Just won't happen.

2. The fact that CMW didn't even think about putting KL in the game tells me he won't be here next season. Just my opinion.

3. A lot of calls didn't go our way when they obviously should have...Geronimo's dunk attempt, Durr, XJ, etc.

4. Indiana has had 2 golden opportunities for quality road wins. We'll get some this year.

5. Last night was game 9 of the CMW resume. While the result isn't a shock, what position would we have been under Archie at Syracuse or at Wisconsin?

 

Trying to be positive. It's been too sad for too long, and I'm not going to let the 2nd half of last night's road game defeat my outlook for the rest of the season.

Edited December 9, 2021 by Coach Robby

[AxnJxn]

58 minutes ago, Fundamentals said:

Painful loss.  But, seeking to identify the good.  
 

Baby steps 

1.  IU played the best basketball I’ve seen for years, in the first half

2.  Mike Woodson, although not his best in the second half, walked down the bench giving X an earful as he was subbed out, TWICE.  Thus, I didn’t think Woodson was aloof to his struggles, but gambled he was best chance to lead us to a win

3.  HSN family: I am as restless as the rest of you, but do believe a full season of Woodson’s leadership will have us improving as the year goes on, but EVENTUALLY to walk out of the basketball purgatory to which we now have a membership card, WE NEED TO BEGIN WINNING games such as we’ve lost this season.  
 

Very well said. For those saying this looks like last year, I'm not sure we're watching the same team. Guys are shooting and hitting 3s with confidence, our defense has been outstanding at times, and we've actually shown signs of hitting FTs now and then (last night notwithstanding). X really, really, really needs to learn not to pick up cheap fouls and stay on the court, because it's clear that this is as good as Rob gets (which is pretty average at best), and apparently KL isn't going to see the floor, for whatever reason. 

Before the game, if you had told us that we would lose by 5 at Wisky, we probably would have been ok with that. I get it, it's how we lost, and I was as frustrated as anyone else with how that went down, but there are a lot of positives to build on here, and the negatives are fixable - we already saw improvement in turnovers, for example. In other words, some patience should pay off this season. 

[13th&Jackson]

This tied the largest comeback in WI history and it’s the largest comeback in D1 this season. That just can’t happen. 
 

Given the opportunities, these two road losses were very costly. As of today, this isn’t a NCAA tournament team. It’s very difficult to find winnable road games remaining that will move the needle. IA may be best chance and maybe MN. MD isn’t looking like an impactful potential win at this time. Don’t see road wins at PU, MSU or OSU. We will likely be home dogs to PU, MI and maybe IL. 
WI was a great opportunity because they are mid pack at best as far as talent and they had a short bench last night. It was a wasted opportunity. This team can’t afford more “learning opportunities”

[Fiveoutofsix]

13 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

This tied the largest comeback in WI history and it’s the largest comeback in D1 this season. That just can’t happen. 
 

Given the opportunities, these two road losses were very costly. As of today, this isn’t a NCAA tournament team. It’s very difficult to find winnable road games remaining that will move the needle. IA may be best chance and maybe MN. MD isn’t looking like an impactful potential win at this time. Don’t see road wins at PU, MSU or OSU. We will likely be home dogs to PU, MI and maybe IL. 
WI was a great opportunity because they are mid pack at best as far as talent and they had a short bench last night. It was a wasted opportunity. This team can’t afford more “learning opportunities”

I'm sure when they watch the tape, they will see opposite sides to energy and effort.  What can be done and what can't be done.  

My hope is that this is all part of the plan, to let them learn how to play and play through adversity.  Just wish is was a one point win.  

This is what happens when you have a cupcake schedule, when you get a team that will play aggressive, and try and out muscle, you are not prepared to go 40min.  

Not sure what could of been different coaching, besides, maybe getting Miller back in there.  The best players were on the floor.  Maybe run more sets?  Or, work the refs more....

Hopefully in the future, a better schedule would be together to prepare for a game like this.  Wisconsin is not going to get fatigued, they get stronger.

[Seeking6]

Durr travel, 3rd on X, missed out of bounds call....and for the 14th straight season Davison is allowed to hook people.

Just a frustrating game. I think my biggest thing is this. Zero leadership from anyone involved with Indiana last night in that 2nd half. Nobody saying we're not letting this happen. Nobody making the shot or free throws or getting a stop on defense. No adjustments from staff.

As somebody mentioned earlier I don't ever want to see TJD with 3rd most attempts in FG again.

It's 1 game on the road in the Big 10 but man that was sickening. Nothing a good 6-7 hours of final day of leaves couldn't cure. 

 

[NotIThatLives]

1 hour ago, btownqb said:

This was a net positive 

Exactly.  If anything they played better that what the starters were bringing in the 2nd half and more had the fake travel not been called.  

[btownqb]

1 minute ago, NotIThatLives said:

Exactly.  If anything they played better that what the starters were bringing in the 2nd half and more had the fake travel not been called.  

Right, plus no one needs to be playing 38mpg right now. They have been more than solid and more than I expected through 2 games in the B1G and a massive improvement since SU. 

I also don't think/can't overly remember... we didn't ever have 5 subs on the court last night. Pretty sure it was never a full 5. 

[btownqb]

1 hour ago, Coach Robby said:

Jeepers, glad I waited until this morning to read all this.... I'm sad, pissed, mad, etc just like the rest of you. Some things:

1. We won't win many games this season where TJD attempts 10 or less shots. Just won't happen.

2. The fact that CMW didn't even think about putting KL in the game tells me he won't be here next season. Just my opinion.

3. A lot of calls didn't go our way when they obviously should have...Geronimo's dunk attempt, Durr, XJ, etc.

4. Indiana has had 2 golden opportunities for quality road wins. We'll get some this year.

5. Last night was game 9 of the CMW resume. While the result isn't a shock, what position would we have been under Archie at Syracuse or at Wisconsin?

 

Trying to be positive. It's been too sad for too long, and I'm not going to let the 2nd half of last night's road game defeat my outlook for the rest of the season.

Good post

[BGleas]

I'm not buying the narrative that I'm seeing a lot that TJD didn't get the ball enough. We spent most of the 2nd half going to him on the right block on almost every possession. 

The issue was that TJD allowed himself to get pushed off the block and was receiving the ball almost out to the wing, he was very slow to recognize the double team (where in the 1st half he recognized it quickly), and he made absolutely zero adjustments to how Wisconsin was defending him in the 2nd half. It wasn't that we didn't go to him, it was that he made no adjustment to his game and would either barrel in to try and get to the left side, or just pass it back out to the wing who entered it to him who wasn't really all that open. 

The other aspect was that the coaching staff made zero adjustments to get him the ball in better situations and TJD still doesn't have a reliable jumper. Take that midrange/post jumper Durr hit in the 2nd half, if TJD has that in his repertoire he would be a completely different player.  

But his shot attempts do not tell the story of what really happened. 

[IUCrazy2]

1 hour ago, Coach Robby said:

Jeepers, glad I waited until this morning to read all this.... I'm sad, pissed, mad, etc just like the rest of you. Some things:

1. We won't win many games this season where TJD attempts 10 or less shots. Just won't happen.

2. The fact that CMW didn't even think about putting KL in the game tells me he won't be here next season. Just my opinion.

3. A lot of calls didn't go our way when they obviously should have...Geronimo's dunk attempt, Durr, XJ, etc.

4. Indiana has had 2 golden opportunities for quality road wins. We'll get some this year.

5. Last night was game 9 of the CMW resume. While the result isn't a shock, what position would we have been under Archie at Syracuse or at Wisconsin?

 

Trying to be positive. It's been too sad for too long, and I'm not going to let the 2nd half of last night's road game defeat my outlook for the rest of the season.

I am still on board with this coaching staff but to point 5, I think Miller would probably have the same record now to be honest or maybe 1 more loss to be 6-3. The losses may have been worse, but at the end of the day, a loss is a loss.  St. John's is the only real team we have a win against at this point.

[BGleas]

While most of the talk has centered around the poor second half performance on offense, something we're not talking enough about is the horrendous defensive performance in the 2nd half. The defense was terrible in the 2nd half and that directly led to the offense not being able to get out into transition for easy baskets and open transition 3's. 

[btownqb]

14 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

I am still on board with this coaching staff but to point 5, I think Miller would probably have the same record now to be honest or maybe 1 more loss to be 6-3. The losses may have been worse, but at the end of the day, a loss is a loss.  St. John's is the only real team we have a win against at this point.

Why would anyone not be? 

[btownqb]

17 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I'm not buying the narrative that I'm seeing a lot that TJD didn't get the ball enough. We spent most of the 2nd half going to him on the right block on almost every possession. 

The issue was that TJD allowed himself to get pushed off the block and was receiving the ball almost out to the wing, he was very slow to recognize the double team (where in the 1st half he recognized it quickly), and he made absolutely zero adjustments to how Wisconsin was defending him in the 2nd half. It wasn't that we didn't go to him, it was that he made no adjustment to his game and would either barrel in to try and get to the left side, or just pass it back out to the wing who entered it to him who wasn't really all that open. 

The other aspect was that the coaching staff made zero adjustments to get him the ball in better situations and TJD still doesn't have a reliable jumper. Take that midrange/post jumper Durr hit in the 2nd half, if TJD has that in his repertoire he would be a completely different player.  

But his shot attempts do not tell the story of what really happened. 

His counter moves were absolutely non existent last night, as well. He made a "move" late in the game to the middle of the court and shot a baby hook over his rt shoulder (shocker) that was quite possibly the laziest move I've ever seen late in a crucial game. Absolute complete lack of focus. 

[KoB2011]

1 hour ago, 13th&Jackson said:

This tied the largest comeback in WI history and it’s the largest comeback in D1 this season. That just can’t happen. 
 

Given the opportunities, these two road losses were very costly. As of today, this isn’t a NCAA tournament team. It’s very difficult to find winnable road games remaining that will move the needle. IA may be best chance and maybe MN. MD isn’t looking like an impactful potential win at this time. Don’t see road wins at PU, MSU or OSU. We will likely be home dogs to PU, MI and maybe IL. 
WI was a great opportunity because they are mid pack at best as far as talent and they had a short bench last night. It was a wasted opportunity. This team can’t afford more “learning opportunities”

If the tournament started today we would absolutely be in the field.

[tdhoosier]

16 minutes ago, BGleas said:

While most of the talk has centered around the poor second half performance on offense, something we're not talking enough about is the horrendous defensive performance in the 2nd half. The defense was terrible in the 2nd half and that directly led to the offense not being able to get out into transition for easy baskets and open transition 3's. 

True. TJD got burned on the same play two times in a row; both resulted in easy lay ups. 

[13th&Jackson]

4 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

If the tournament started today we would absolutely be in the field.

Bubble team at best. #51 NET through yesterday. Quad 1: 0-1 Quad 2: 0-1 Quad 3: 1-0 Quad 4: 6-0, 0-2 on road

[NotIThatLives]

2 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

Bubble team at best. #51 NET through yesterday. Quad 1: 0-1 Quad 2: 0-1 Quad 3: 1-0 Quad 4: 6-0, 0-2 on road

Yeah that's probably not going to get you in

[btownqb]

3 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

It was 4 in the first half.  We were making a big run and extending the lead.  Bates, Rob, Durr and JG came into the game with Kopp.  Bates turned the ball over 2 or 3 times and i think hit a 3.  JG got a foul for having his legs to far out on a pick and well Rob did what rob does and that is nothing. 

We didn't lose alot of ground when they came in but we didn't continue to extend the lead like we were doing with the starters.

 

Yes, we did. We were up 12 when we started subbing, essentially. And we were up 18 when the starters started coming back in. 

[IowaHoosierFan]

16 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Yes, we did. We were up 12 when we started subbing, essentially. And we were up 18 when the starters started coming back in. 

You were right about the score

Edited December 9, 2021 by IowaHoosierFan

[btownqb]

2 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

You were right about the score

I think it's worked well the first two games. No idea if it's sustainable. Durr could really make that "go". 

[IowaHoosierFan]

Just now, btownqb said:

I think it's worked well the first two games. No idea if it's sustainable. Durr could really make that "go". 

i don't like the wholesale subs.  Bates, Rob, Durr and JG shouldn't be on the floor at the same time unless it's garbage time.  I am impressed with Durr and his calm demeanor and play.  He isn't flashy but he isn't a black hole.  Rob on the other hand, i wish wouldn't see the floor again.  Bates needs to slow the 'F' down and play within the game.  JG needs to just be smarter.  XJ, TJD, Race needs to be on the floor at all times.  They need to lead this team when we sub out for younger/less talented players.  Just my opinion. 

I am so very disappointed in this team, coaching staff and my own expectations at the moment.  

[13th&Jackson]

26 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

Bubble team at best. #51 NET through yesterday. Quad 1: 0-1 Quad 2: 0-1 Quad 3: 1-0 Quad 4: 6-0, 0-2 on road

 

23 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

Yeah that's probably not going to get you in

Remaining non-con: three quad 4 and one quad 3 (ND). The 2018-19 team that didn't get in was 9-2 non-con with two Quad 1 wins (LVille & Marquette) and one Quad 2 win. They went 8-12 in conference. 

This team really needs to outperform in conference play. 

[KoB2011]

43 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

Bubble team at best. #51 NET through yesterday. Quad 1: 0-1 Quad 2: 0-1 Quad 3: 1-0 Quad 4: 6-0, 0-2 on road

Pretty early to look at the NET, and both our losses are Quad 1 losses.

We are 32 in KenPom, if the tournament started today we would be an 8-10 seed. We have plenty of time to go up or down, but if we keep playing like we have with no improvements that is probably where this team ends up. 

[btownqb]

2 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

i don't like the wholesale subs.  Bates, Rob, Durr and JG shouldn't be on the floor at the same time unless it's garbage time.  I am impressed with Durr and his calm demeanor and play.  He isn't flashy but he isn't a black hole.  Rob on the other hand, i wish wouldn't see the floor again.  Bates needs to slow the 'F' down and play within the game.  JG needs to just be smarter.  XJ, TJD, Race needs to be on the floor at all times.  They need to lead this team when we sub out for younger/less talented players.  Just my opinion. 

I am so very disappointed in this team, coaching staff and my own expectations at the moment.  

Seriously? That's crazy. 

But.. either way... that collection of 4-5 guys have been a net positive the last two games. So you can "not like wholesale subs", but in 2 of our 4 toughest games, so far, it has been a good thing.