BGleas

Robert Williams would be an interesting piece for Boston to throw in. Celtics fans lover him. He's a young guy with tons of potentiall, though can be a little spacey.

Looks like Galinari is going to Atlanta, essentially taking the Hawks out of the Hayward sweepstakes. Sounds like Charlotte is potentially in play though. Like I've said, the Celtics, Pacers and Hayward all have some leverage here and also lack some leverage here. End of the day, I bet they get something done that meets in the middle.

Hayward is probably 2nd on that list after Ingram, especially in today's NBA. but again most of those guys aren't actually available and the ones could be available would also be sign and trade so you're going to give pieces there too.

Ainge isn't fleecing anybody. He's negotiating. We all know the Pacers aren't trading Turner and Oladipo for Hayward. Heck, we don't even know if that request is even accurate. The Pacers might be giving the Celtics what they need, but the Celtics would be giving the Pacers and Hayward what they want and the best player in the deal.

They can lose him for nothing but its in everyone's interest to work it out. I doubt the Knicks are signing him and I doubt he'd want to go there. The Hawks are the only other team that can sign him without giving anything up. If fans of other teams hate Danny so much, it tells me as a Celtics fan that he's doing a pretty great job. He makes tons of trades, so doesn't seem like other teams/GM's mind dealing with him. His job is to get the best possible outcome for his team.

Who's better than Hayward? It seems to me most non-Celtics watchers view Hayward as the guy with the broken ankle that struggled two seasons ago. He averaged 19ppg last year shooting 38% from 3 as the 4th option on his team. He was basically back to the guy that Miami, Boston and Utah were fighting over in free agency 4 years ago.

I agree Oladipo doesn't fit. Hayward opted out to sign one last huge deal. With his ankle injury a couple years ago I'd be surprised to see sign a 1-year deal to gamble next year as a free agent again. Next years free agent class is massive and this year he's the best player, so can demand more. The Knicks and Hawks are the only teams with the room to sign him outright. I think this deal gets done. The Pacers will throw in more than Turner/McDermott, but it also won't be Warren or VO. My guess is a first round pick highly protected or Holiday.

In a typical season I believe something like December 15th is the first time a team can trade a player they signed in the previous off-season. Obviously that timeline is different this year. But, there's no chance the Knicks would sign him just to flip him later, they're preserving cap space. On the 3-team deal thing, that would rely on Hayward wanting to go to Atlanta. He's made it pretty clear he wants to go to Indiana, and the Pacers seem to really want him. Its a weird situation, all three parties have some leverage. The Pacers could also walk away, they don't have to do this, though they'd then be stuck trying to find another team that really want Turner and they'd be losing a chance at an all-star caliber player.

Only the Celtics can sign and trade him.

Agree on the Holiday part, I think that's who Ainge wants. Disagree on the Celtics losing Hayward for nothing, since there are only two teams that can sign Hayward outright. I'd be stunned if he went to the Knicks, so then that only leaves the Hawks. I guess its possible Hayward signs with the Hawks outright, but that would surprise me as well.

Its a possibility, but not a great one. The only two teams with cap space are the Knicks and the Hawks. He's not going to the Knicks. Apparently the Hawks had some interest, but I think they've moved on. Apparently Charlotte is interested but that would be a sign and trade too, and Hayward has made it clear he wants Indiana. The Celtics have used most of the picks, but Ainge is always moving things for future picks. They still have a few.

Definitely a possibility, though those deals always get tricky. They could also meet in the middle. Heck, Ainge could be pushing for Warren/Oladipo simply to squeeze a pick out of the Pacers or something in exchange for relenting.

First, this is a different market. Every year is different. Second, Hayward wants to play in Indiana and the Pacers want Hayward but don't have cap space. There's only one team in the NBA that can give those two sides what they want.

Probably draft picks and some end of the roster stuff.

The problem for Hayward is while opting out gave him some leverage, he still doesn't have a ton. He wants Indiana, but Indiana has to do a sign and trade. The teams with cap space are the Knicks and Atlanta, but Hayward isn't going to the Knicks, and Atlanta would seem like an odd fit. Apparently the Hornets are interested l, and that is a spot Hayward signed several years ago but then Utah matched. Its a weird situation, because each party (Bos, Ind & Hayward) sort of has leverage but sort of doesn't as well.

That actually works in Boston's offense. The Celtics don't really post up bigs, Horford before him and Theis last year spent most of their time on the perimeter. The Celtics want the lane free for their wings and guards to get to the basket.

That's who Theis struggles with too. He's great in terms of positioning and battling and he's really good on the PnR, but when a legit center like Embiid takes him to the block he just doesn't have the size to defend them. Luckily, most bigs in the NBA think they're Steph Curry, so it's not always a problem. Plus, Theis is a solid (for a big) 3pt shooter, but unlike what it's sound like with Turner, Theis is selective in taking the 3.

Daniel Theis was the starter pretty much the entire year. He's one of the better defensive bigs in the NBA, but the issue is he lacks size. I'd say Theis is actually a better defender than Myles Turner, but he lacks size and isn't the shot blocker Turner is (though he did average 1.3 per game), but he's a great positional defender and really good defending the PnR. We also still have Robert Williams who is a developing young player, who during much of the playoffs played ahead of Kanter as the first big off the bench. He had some excellent playoff games. He's long, athletic and bouncy, while developing an offensive game. But yes, for Boston to be a true title contender, we need another big, preferably a starter.

That's my takeaway from this trade. The Celtics must be close to swapping Hayward for a big in a sign/trade.

I don't think he's going to be a bust. But the question remains on whether he'll blossom into a legit NBA starter/top end rotational guy, or is he going to hang around as a journeyman/trade fodder guy that you almost don't even realize is in the league.

Completely agree. I think the Celtics really like Langford. Like you said, they did work to get him minutes when he was healthy and he played really well at times. I'm glad he's on the C's and am pulling for him to realize his potential. I don't think he's a bust or anything, I just think he has a lot to work on offensively. He's got to find a way to become a semi-reliable perimeter shooter, regain his offensive confidence and develop his left hand dribble. He played some phenomenal defense last year and sometimes even defended stars when he got time. But, he was almost a zero offensively. He would literally just run to the corner and stand there, barely ever move and when he did get the ball he would fire to a teammate like a hot potato. Now, you could say that was his role as a rookie on a team with some stars, but guys like Jevonte Green and Semi Ojeleye would be far more aggressive offensively when they got chances in that role. Stevens loves guys that can play D, so Langford will get more chances. My comments are more regarding if a guy like Nesmith can come in and shoot at a high level and play even respectable defense, then he may pass Langford by. Edit: I think the Kanter deal is a sign the Celtics are close to a sign/trade with Hayward that is bringing a legit big to Boston. I would guess probably something the Pacers involving Turner.

This is where I'm at as well. I completely understand and appreciate the injuries. Heck, I've used them in defense of the team Langford's year at IU. But again, we're going on 2 years of bad shooting. It's not like shooting where you can see he's close or the form is there but there's one thing wrong. His shot looks completely broke and his confidence is in the gutter. I watched him last year and his misses were bad and his makes from the perimeter typically caught a lot of rim before going in. Nothing is pure at all. He's going to have to completely rebuild his jump shot. He can certainly do it, but IMO this isn't just a matter of getting healthy. The shot is broken and his confidence is completely gone.

Yeah, people forget, Grant Hill was a 7-time all-star and was one of the greats of the game. Not just a fringe guy, he was a lock all-star for 7 years before injuries completely derailed his career.

No, I haven't seen him healthy, but we're going on two years here. So with that much data I have to assume that playing through years of hand/wrist injuries has messed up his shot. He's not just off a little, he's been a bad shooter.