Hoosierdave

Mike Woodson on Valentine’s Day: ”You’re a hump I’ll never get over, babe”

I was saying I hope the reason we ended up with a coach like Woodson was because the rest of the better coaches (Drew, Beard, Few, Muss, etc) said no first.

Dolson: Do you like to use the phrase, “over the hump?” Coaching candidate #1: No *Slides blank check across table

Thanks. The article makes it sound like it was Stevens then Woodson but I would assume there were several other coaches before that that said no. At least I hope so lol.

Oh I completely agree, it would be inappropriate to publicize the order in which Dolson went to land a coach. I said I hoped it wasn’t a personal attack earlier because I was genuinely hoping those on this board that have connections to players/staff would maybe have some insight into who they were hoping for the first time around. I just wanted to see some names so I could gauge how optimistic/pessimistic I should feel going into the next coaching hire lol.

I really hope this doesn’t come off as a personal attack lol but does anyone actually have a list or know of coaches that Dolson reached out to before Woodson? I’ve seen several people say “we tried to get a good coach already and ended up with Woodson”. Maybe it’s just me but I’m skeptical that every single D1 college coach said no to us and simply by a process of elimination, Mike Woodson was our only option lol. A guy with zero college coaching or recruiting experience, 60+ years old and on his final coaching gig before retirement, and hasn’t been a head coach for an NBA team since 2014… I do give AD’s a bit of credit because these situations at times can be a “race to the finish” so you have to be intelligent about risking time and effort for the “home run hire” when another coach you could have landed instead gets swept up. Hence why I said I think Ohio St made the right choice to put themselves in a more favorable position to get these convos started and gauge interests.

For sure. Not getting my hopes up because if I understand this correctly, these kids can sign to a shoe company and still end up playing at school with a competing company. Rabby reposting that to me was a little eye opening though. Not sure if that was his way of hinting that maybe IU has or will gain traction as a result. I don’t subscribe to Peegs so maybe he explained himself today lol

I agree that I don’t see him leaving for Ohio St but I think if I were an Ohio St fan I would be thrilled to know we are at least reaching out and being told no first. Plus, Ohio St did the intelligent thing and ripped the band aid off so they could get a head start over other programs that are waiting because of fan/media backlash. That choice could be the difference in getting a guy like Oats because they have more time to establish a relationship and negotiate and could always go back to boosters with a number Oats had in mind to secure his commitment. If I had to guess, I think they end up with either Sean Miller or Lamont Paris.

https://basketballrecruiting.rivals.com/news/decision-dossier-five-star-mikel-brown FWIW, Rabby retweeted a post today from Adidas saying they signed this kid. Based on latest intel, we are the only Adidas school listed that he was planning on taking a visit too.

Lists like this give me hope IU can land a good coach. If schools like Ohio St and Louisville think guys like Muss, Oates, and McDermott can be plucked, I don’t see why we should think we have no chance and are wasting time even considering. IIRC, weve had a better previous 2 seasons than both.

I don’t have anything meaningful to post but I just remembered that time that Maryland fans literally were crying and saying that our coaching staff was paying Joe Tipton under the table to host an IG live with DQ and Liam. Good times.

I guess they didn’t care enough to update. But he’s paid $4.2 million currently. Based on those links, he’d be 1) Tied for 8th with Brad Underwood 2)9th in front of Bob Huggins 3) 9th in front of Huggins agaiN.

I get what you’re saying but I think as KDug just mentioned, there’s a difference between recruiting and roster construction. Woody has landed 3 talented players and established a relationship with the best high school in the country (Liam, Malik, Fino, maybe Queen). Liam is Woodsons third burger boy. We had more top 50 players visit campus this year than we have this decade. According to Trilly, we had Fland ready to announce IU until he had to push his formal announcement date back because of his high school coach. Yes, Woody is paying the price with the 2024 class with his “go big or go home” approach. I also just looked at the offers though and I don’t see any that we were in the lead for and screwed our selves with. I know the staff wanted Schwartz and Boeteng but they never got on campus and had others schools prioritizing them more. Maybe you could argue Mustaf but I know schools like NC State, Georgia Tech, and Maryland felt they were serious contenders too. Guys like Flory, Newell, and Harper got on campus but we all knew for a while wouldn’t end up here. I wouldn’t personally say his recruiting and landing talent to be a weakness as much as his ability is to have said talent complement each other and compile a roster that makes sense.

Since you seem to have good connections, I’ll consider Beard/Pearl/Drew/Oats/Few etc as no shots. In addition to May/Shrews, do you think any of these guys would be possibilities: Shaka Smart, TJ Otzelberger, Greg McDermott, Mick Cronin, Porter Moser, Jerome Tang, Randy Bennett, Jamie Dixon, Mike White.

Understand and respect your opinion, I think it’s fair to say Gallo doesn’t get the love or credit he deserves. I just think we have one of the worst backcourts in conference and I think it’s rather clear we need upgrades. Also, a guy coming off the bench doesn’t automatically mean he’ll have a much smaller roll or impact than a starter. Just like Kentucky, you can bring big impact guys off the bench (Dillingham, Sheppard) because they bring that extra juice and energy you need. I think pretty much anyone would agree that Queen/Reneau is a better combo than relying on guys who barely see the floor and make little to no impact already lol.

Not sure what Kopp has to do with any of this because next year is a completely different roster build lol but I don’t think it’s contradictory to want Gallo to be a 6th man so that we can upgrade our perimeter scoring, ball handling, athleticism, and basketball IQ via the portal. Rabby apparently said himself Gallo told the staff earlier this season he would be fine with assuming said 6th man role next year if we got some dudes around him. Also, Chris on BTB said Mac’s family doesn’t want him returning or transferring this off-season , just moving on to play pro. So I personally don’t want to see us struggle again out on the perimeter if we have to watch bully ball with Queen/Reneau for season 4.

What concerns me the most about Woody is that everyone thought the biggest issue would be recruiting but he’s actually done quite well there (Ware, Mac, Fino, Reneau, Liam). Instead, the worst parts are his schemes and roster construction- things that you would assume he was brought here for due to his experience handling that at a higher level. I would feel better about the future if I knew for a fact Reneau and Liam were staying, Gallo was fine with being a 6th man if need be, and our staff was attacking the portal for guards. Also, adjusting our schemes to prioritize perimeter scoring and a balanced attack with speed and movement. I just struggle with having confidence in Woody that he can do that. We as fans have bitched and moaned for like 8+ years now about shooting and yet Archie, his leftover assistances (Hunter, Walsh) and Woody haven’t seen its importance until it’s been too late. Woody also talked about his former NBA teams and how much they shot beyond the arc and said we would do a 4 out 1 in once TJD left because we only played bully ball as a result of his skill set. Instead, we’re doing it just as frequently and we’re again getting exposed for our lack of balance and perimeter threats. I know some people say the fan base is toxic by asking for a new coach every 4 years or less. But it’s not the fans who decided to hire a mid major coach who made a couple deep tourney runs or a guy who has NBA coaching experience but none in college. If we had listened to the national media and allowed their opinions to form our decisions so we don’t look “toxic”, we would have ended up struggling with Archie for 2 more years and hired Alford afterward and been in a similar situation. Woody knew himself he was brought here as a short term hire and said he came here to “win championships”. To me, short term hires are made because of the confidence you have that someone can come in quickly and improve the situation. Not the case with Woody. Would have been interesting with Matta had he passed his physical. I would be more patient and understanding if we weren’t top 15-20 in game attendance, NIL donations, revenue, and social media presence. Objectively, we have way too many pieces for a coach to be successful. We’re also paying Woodson a top 10-15 salary. If it weren’t for us fans and our patience through all the ups and downs, we’d be a Georgetown/DePaul/Louisville. The only objective reason Woody should get another year is to reduce the amount of $ in his buyout so you can throw a Brad Stevens type offer for the next dream coach. If Woody and Dolson want to talk about how much they love this program, then they would honor that by having some self awareness and doing what we did with Allen and pull the plug before it gets even worse.

Went to last nights game

If I understand an athletic directors role correctly, it’s Dolsons ultimate decision where that money goes. I would have been urging caution with throwing all that $ at Woody because the next future coach and their agent will now be asking for that and more because they’ll argue they’ve accomplished far more than Woody and have far more collegiate coaching experience. Getting that “home run hire” now becomes more difficult than it already is… I would have told the people donating $ that let’s use a portion of that money towards Woody (like a 100-150k bonus) to show support and confidence. But getting toasted in the round of 32 and 64 the year before shows how far we have to go, and our buck as a result, should go towards the collective good instead of an individual already being compensated appropriately for his accomplishments. Use that remaining $ towards NIL, upgrading equipment/facilities, etc. Then when we’re at a stable place and actually a contender with a proven concept, feel free to throw a top 10-15 salary Woodson’s way.

Sorry, I guess some some of these sites don’t update the numbers then. I definitely saw 4.1 or 4 for Muss. Regardless, 4.2 million still gets him within or near top 10 highest salaries. We’re not getting those types of results. The rest of those coaches are at least winning conference title(s) or going to the second weekend in March. It may not be your $ but it makes it easier for a booster to say “I’ll pass” on giving up their money for the next coach/buyout when they don’t have confidence Dolson can properly manage funds and make accurate evaluations.

If you wanna vomit, here’s a list of coaches apparently getting paid less than Woody: Eric Mussleman, Nate Oats, Scott Drew, Tommy Lloyd, Greg Gard, Matt Painter, Kelvin Sampson, Mark Few, Shaka Smart, Rick Pitino, TJ Otzelberger, Jerome Tang, Porter Moser, Jim Larranaga, Leonard Hamilton, Greg McDermott, Dana Altman.

Gotcha, thanks. I personally would be fine with adding him and still going for an experienced PG/CG from the portal. Point guard to me is the most important position. Especially when I have PTSD from X from the past couple seasons with injuries/erratic play. Examples like this are why I’m always impressed with a guy like Cal and his recruiting. Not everyone can be “the guy” yet he finds a way to convince 5-6 they can be or that they should bet on themselves and take the risk.

Mind elaborating? I was under the impression the hesitation around this was the monetary demands.

Not sure if there’s been any update since

Per BTB poster ”Apparently the door hasn't totally been closed on Davis. Raby reports Coach Ya watched him last Thursday.”