Fred Glass

[Seeking6]

4 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Am I the only one concerned that Glass felt the need to give Archie a vote of confidence publicly?

Concern....probably not yet. Just something to file in the memory bank for down the road.I'll keep banging the same drum. So important Archie and IU makes the tourney this year. If he does we can continue to build, recruit,etc....if not he's dead on recruiting front for upper echelon guys.

[Hoosierhoopster]

Not sure this really fits in this thread, but it's a great quote from Doc Rivers that really applies to CAM:

"This group is new. This is our creation. I feel like that college coach, when you first get the job and you take all the recruits that are there and try to win with them. And then you get your recruits. That's how I feel. This is our team. ... And we feel really good about it."

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27252200/kawhi-paul-george-present-second-chance-doc-rivers

I don't have an issue with a public comment geared towards assuring fans. We're headed towards season 3, CAM's been getting his recruits, things do not happen over night, generally, that's where we are.

[Brass Cannon]

40 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

Not sure this really fits in this thread, but it's a great quote from Doc Rivers that really applies to CAM:

"This group is new. This is our creation. I feel like that college coach, when you first get the job and you take all the recruits that are there and try to win with them. And then you get your recruits. That's how I feel. This is our team. ... And we feel really good about it."

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27252200/kawhi-paul-george-present-second-chance-doc-rivers

I don't have an issue with a public comment geared towards assuring fans. We're headed towards season 3, CAM's been getting his recruits, things do not happen over night, generally, that's where we are.

Never been a big fan of saying Archie didn’t have the right players last year. Seems like a cheap way to blame the players. 

Those players were able to start 11-2. The talent and ability to win was clearly there. 

[Billingsley99]

Most people here including myself feel that 4 years is an adequate time to give a head coach to see if we made the correct hire. There are 2 factors in play that could force the decision to be made after 3. Missing the NCAAT again will not make the too hot but couple that with a bad 2020 class and no one of significance signed in 21 at that point could force a decision for a change.

I have some more to add after lunch

[Hoosierhoopster]

17 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Never been a big fan of saying Archie didn’t have the right players last year. Seems like a cheap way to blame the players. 

Those players were able to start 11-2. The talent and ability to win was clearly there. 

And I didn't say otherwise, it was a good group last year which, as I have said multiple times on here, went through obvious chemistry issues that started 12-2,  not 11-2, before the wheels came off, and also went through multiple key injuries and concussion protocols etc. That doesn't change the fact that CAM is still bringing in his recruits including to replace Morgan.  

[IowaHoosierFan]

1 hour ago, milehiiu said:

Gonna counter this. WIth some thoughts. Wilson had issues from the day he arrived on campus. Shortly thereafter.  One was serious.  Involved the Indiana State Police.  Mr. Glass, being an attorney,  worked on Kevin's behalf, to avoid any record. Based on agreement, that Mr. Glass would work with Coach Wilson, on his issues, by attending classes. Which Coach Wilson to his credit fulfilled . It was a completely different issue which caused Mr. Glass to let Coach Wilson go. And by all accounts that I learned.... totally justified.

In terms of Coach Crean. Let us not forget what he did for IU.  Some say he was extended too soon. However, IU was working on probation, and had lost scholarships. Even volunteered to give one up due to low APR scores caused by Sampson's miscreant who failed to go to class. And raked up something like 17 to 19 F's ( I forget which) Crean made sure Sampsongate did not crop up. And improved the APR, early on, while taking IU to a sweet 16.

No doubt in my mind. Coach Crean got burned out at the end. And I hold some fans responsible for this. And can understand the reason why. Crean's daughter had to sit in a class where the professor berated her father in front of the entire class. And Crean's wife got to the point where she stopped attending games. I was ready for a change. And can only think that Coach Crean and his family were ready as well.

Not playing the NIT game, is something that still sticks in my craw.  However, a refresher as to what was going on at that time, gives some understanding behind the decision.

Having said all that.  I would rather have an administrator who is in my corner, from the beginning, than not.  And that's what Mr. Glass did with both Crean and Glass.  He gave them both a chance.  It was different circumstances that in the end caused Mr. Glass to pull the plug on both coaches. 

I agree Crean did good things.  But he was extended too soon and for too long.  He wasn't even close to being done with his first contract and it wasn't like we were national contenders to get a 10 year contract with a large buyout.  It was poorly handled and left IU with no leverage whatsoever from a AD who is an attorney and should know better.

As for the Wilson, he go fired for doing things you just can't do anymore.  But he had the chance to go out and find a big name coach to come in and change IU football.  instead he hires the Defense Coordinator who by my account wasn't that good at defense.  We didn't lose game after game because we couldn't put up numbers, we just couldn't stop anyone from doing whatever they want.  So we put him in charge without even doing a true search, unforgivable.   And now IU football is still the laughing stock it has been for 20 years. 

Just my opinion, i could be and usually am wrong

[5fouls]

IU football is not a 'laughingstock'. They are mediocre.  Laughingstocks go 1-11 or 2-10, not 5-7.

[milehiiu]

19 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I agree Crean did good things.  But he was extended too soon and for too long.  He wasn't even close to being done with his first contract and it wasn't like we were national contenders to get a 10 year contract with a large buyout.  It was poorly handled and left IU with no leverage whatsoever from a AD who is an attorney and should know better.

As for the Wilson, he go fired for doing things you just can't do anymore.  But he had the chance to go out and find a big name coach to come in and change IU football.  instead he hires the Defense Coordinator who by my account wasn't that good at defense.  We didn't lose game after game because we couldn't put up numbers, we just couldn't stop anyone from doing whatever they want.  So we put him in charge without even doing a true search, unforgivable.   And now IU football is still the laughing stock it has been for 20 years. 

Just my opinion, i could be and usually am wrong

Appreciate your input. Can't say I disagree with most of all  you posted here.

In terms of Wilson's replacement. And I have not one iota of information here. Other than most, if not all AD's keep udated lists of potential replacements in their desks at all times.  Just speculation here. On my part. What's to say that Mr. Glass did not put feelers out early on ? Seeing as how Coach Wilson was an issue from day one. He may have been doing his homework early on, and had a pretty good idea, that there were no big name coaches willing to take the position ?  Just saying. Knowing there was a concerted search for a head BB after Sampson.  Another question.  In all sincerity. What big name coach would be willing to give up his position to take on a project in Bloomington ? 

[Billingsley99]

Nothing earth shattering by any stretch of the imagination. I just got off the phone with a friend who I get some info from but he is not one that talks in absolutes just passes along what he hears and then adds his own thoughts in mix. 

The interview did sound like a public vote of confidence for CAM. Which says that maybe some fans are getting to some of the people that can make things happen. Most believe that Glass is tied to CAM and this like others have already said if CAM is gone a new AD will be the one making the next hire. He also thinks that the type of player that is being discussed by Glass fits the mold of the players that we are most likely to get a commitment from and not those that have already passed on us. He feels this is an attempt to shield CAM by saying these are the kids we want not like they are second options. (Not worded well, sorry I am ALL in for Galloway and Leal more so than others) Also those comments about the type of players was used to shift blame away from CAM and directly on the players from last years team. He stresses my thoughts about a bad season coupled with weak classes could spell the end of CAM at IU and if that happens by doing it after year 3 Glass has a better chance of saving his position or at least buying some time. Last thing he was said he expected to see CAM back next year but if CAM, and Allen and Glass were all let go he would not be surprised either. 

Like I said nothing major and just 1 guys thoughts based on what has recently been talked about. 

[IU Scott]

3 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

Nothing earth shattering by any stretch of the imagination. I just got off the phone with a friend who I get some info from but he is not one that talks in absolutes just passes along what he hears and then adds his own thoughts in mix. 

The interview did sound like a public vote of confidence for CAM. Which says that maybe some fans are getting to some of the people that can make things happen. Most believe that Glass is tied to CAM and this like others have already said if CAM is gone a new AD will be the one making the next hire. He also thinks that the type of player that is being discussed by Glass fits the mold of the players that we are most likely to get a commitment from and not those that have already passed on us. He feels this is an attempt to shield CAM by saying these are the kids we want not like they are second options. (Not worded well, sorry I am ALL in for Galloway and Leal more so than others) Also those comments about the type of players was used to shift blame away from CAM and directly on the players from last years team. He stresses my thoughts about a bad season coupled with weak classes could spell the end of CAM at IU and if that happens by doing it after year 3 Glass has a better chance of saving his position or at least buying some time. Last thing he was said he expected to see CAM back next year but if CAM, and Allen and Glass were all let go he would not be surprised either. 

Like I said nothing major and just 1 guys thoughts based on what has recently been talked about. 

To me if we let Archie go after 3 years it would do way more harm than good if you ask me.  It is not like we have been having big time coaches knocking down our door the last few times we had an opening.  If we let him go after 3 years are pool of candidates would be even less since it would appear we are very inpatient with coaches.  Another thing is that he has made some good end roads with the Indiana coaches and with the 2021 class being so good it would hurt our chances with all of those players in that class.

[Brass Cannon]

4 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

To me if we let Archie go after 3 years it would do way more harm than good if you ask me.  It is not like we have been having big time coaches knocking down our door the last few times we had an opening.  If we let him go after 3 years are pool of candidates would be even less since it would appear we are very inpatient with coaches.  Another thing is that he has made some good end roads with the Indiana coaches and with the 2021 class being so good it would hurt our chances with all of those players in that class.

Firing a coach if they miss the tourney for 3 years straight is not going to look to prospective coaches like anything besides standards 

[IU Scott]

1 minute ago, Brass Cannon said:

Firing a coach if they miss the tourney for 3 years straight is not going to look to prospective coaches like anything besides standards 

Can't agree with you on this one because any top coaching candidate won't want to leave there current job if they know they will only get a few years to turn it around.  We will always be looking at some up and coming mid major coach who might or might not hit.  Any established coach who is winning and has great job security won't leave that to come to a place they now has a short leash.

[Moyeneeded]

10 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

To me if we let Archie go after 3 years it would do way more harm than good if you ask me.  It is not like we have been having big time coaches knocking down our door the last few times we had an opening.  If we let him go after 3 years are pool of candidates would be even less since it would appear we are very inpatient with coaches.  Another thing is that he has made some good end roads with the Indiana coaches and with the 2021 class being so good it would hurt our chances with all of those players in that class.

Agreed...and those who can't see this are freaking lost and blind to how the rest of those in College BB view us.

[IU Scott]

also it appears that well establish coaches are not moving from their mid level job to hiring profile jobs any longer.  You haven't seen guys like Few, Marshall or Wright leave for the higher profile jobs.  Look at UCLA and who they have had to hire since Wooden left because they have not really been that high of a profile except for Larry Brown.

[Brass Cannon]

14 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Can't agree with you on this one because any top coaching candidate won't want to leave there current job if they know they will only get a few years to turn it around.  We will always be looking at some up and coming mid major coach who might or might not hit.  Any established coach who is winning and has great job security won't leave that to come to a place they now has a short leash.

Established coaches don’t really leave anymore. So don’t really see your point. 

Coaches understand expectations. If they are wanting to be allowed to fall flat on their face for four years without repercussion they aren’t going to amount to much anyway. 

And nothing is going to hurt 2021 recruiting more than going into it with a lame duck coach. 

[BGleas]

3 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

also it appears that well establish coaches are not moving from their mid level job to hiring profile jobs any longer.  You haven't seen guys like Few, Marshall or Wright leave for the higher profile jobs.  Look at UCLA and who they have had to hire since Wooden left because they have not really been that high of a profile except for Larry Brown.

I hate that I'm contributing to this conversation, because at least to this point I'm a "Archie guy" and I think a lot of the handwringing over last season is out of hand. If even just half of the injuries don't happen then IU walks into the NCAA Tournament last season with ease and this is all moot. 

But with that said, should IU miss the tournament next season the elephant in the room will be in OKC. I have no idea how accurate any of the Billy Donovan rumors were last time, I tend to think a lot of it was fake and made up, but with that said I'll be surprised if Donovan is still the Thunder coach at the end of this upcoming NBA season. OKC is in full rebuild mode and the fans there already are very mixed on him.

It's a lot different asking him to leave an NBA team with two superstars for either IU two years ago or UCLA this past offseason, compared to if he's a free agent on the open coaching market. 

Again, I hate myself for stoking these flames and adding to the fuel for some posters, but if IU does miss again I think you'll see a lot of chatter about this scenario from fans. 

[IU Scott]

4 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I hate that I'm contributing to this conversation, because at least to this point I'm a "Archie guy" and I think a lot of the handwringing over last season is out of hand. If even just half of the injuries don't happen then IU walks into the NCAA Tournament last season with ease and this is all moot. 

But with that said, should IU miss the tournament next season the elephant in the room will be in OKC. I have no idea how accurate any of the Billy Donovan rumors were last time, I tend to think a lot of it was fake and made up, but with that said I'll be surprised if Donovan is still the Thunder coach at the end of this upcoming NBA season. OKC is in full rebuild mode and the fans there already are very mixed on him.

It's a lot different asking him to leave an NBA team with two superstars for either IU two years ago or UCLA this past offseason, compared to if he's a free agent on the open coaching market. 

Again, I hate myself for stoking these flames and adding to the fuel for some posters, but if IU does miss again I think you'll see a lot of chatter about this scenario from fans. 

If we would have a coach like Donovan or Stevens in line for the job then I would be all for it but not if we would have to hire another mid major coach.  I told everyone that you should be careful what you wished for when wanting a coaching change because I kept saying we were not going to get an established coach from a major school.

[dbmhoosier]

So if we miss the dance this season what is the rationale by giving Archie a 4th season?  The 2021 class will be an absolute bust as no top recruit would come here when they know Archie is likely getting fired soon.  It would be like failing to fire Tom Crean after year 7 all over again.  

[FW_Hoosier]

10 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I hate that I'm contributing to this conversation, because at least to this point I'm a "Archie guy" and I think a lot of the handwringing over last season is out of hand. If even just half of the injuries don't happen then IU walks into the NCAA Tournament last season with ease and this is all moot. 

But with that said, should IU miss the tournament next season the elephant in the room will be in OKC. I have no idea how accurate any of the Billy Donovan rumors were last time, I tend to think a lot of it was fake and made up, but with that said I'll be surprised if Donovan is still the Thunder coach at the end of this upcoming NBA season. OKC is in full rebuild mode and the fans there already are very mixed on him.

It's a lot different asking him to leave an NBA team with two superstars for either IU two years ago or UCLA this past offseason, compared to if he's a free agent on the open coaching market. 

Again, I hate myself for stoking these flames and adding to the fuel for some posters, but if IU does miss again I think you'll see a lot of chatter about this scenario from fans. 

I’ve had this exact same thought about Donovan being available in 2020 more times than I’d like to admit... Lol.  I do wonder if OKC entering rebuild mode reduces their urgency to get rid of him though.

[BGleas]

5 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

If we would have a coach like Donovan or Stevens in line for the job then I would be all for it but not if we would have to hire another mid major coach.  I told everyone that you should be careful what you wished for when wanting a coaching change because I kept saying we were not going to get an established coach from a major school.

Agree, I'm not moving on from Archie to hire the coach at  a mid-major, and I think Archie will get things rolling and would have them rolling now if not for some major injuries last season, but for discussion sake let's say he doesn't and Billy Donovan is on the open market then you almost have to explore that. 

[BGleas]

1 minute ago, FW_Hoosier said:

I’ve had this exact same thought about Donovan being available in 2020 more times than I’d like to admit... Lol.  I do wonder if OKC entering rebuild mode reduces their urgency to get rid of him though.

I think it increases it. He's the 7th highest paid coach in the NBA in a small market, coaching a rebuild team. That's really rare and he was brought on to coach a title contender. 99% of the time a team moves on from the established coach and brings in a cheaper, younger coach. 

I'll be surprised if he makes it through the season to be honest. 

[IU Scott]

11 minutes ago, dbmhoosier said:

So if we miss the dance this season what is the rationale by giving Archie a 4th season?  The 2021 class will be an absolute bust as no top recruit would come here when they know Archie is likely getting fired soon.  It would be like failing to fire Tom Crean after year 7 all over again.  

Because most people realize that a coach should get a least 4 years to prove what he can do.  Also the top recruits if they have a great relationship with the coaching staff would be more willing to come here than if we fired Archie.  We bring in a new guy from a mid major with no connections would totally ruin our chance to with any of the top talent in 2021.  Some of you guys seem like you want to be proven right more than wanting IU to succeed so you will do anything to trash the program.

[FW_Hoosier]

3 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I think it increases it. He's the 7th highest paid coach in the NBA in a small market, coaching a rebuild team. That's really rare and he was brought on to coach a title contender. 99% of the time a team moves on from the established coach and brings in a cheaper, younger coach. 

I'll be surprised if he makes it through the season to be honest. 

He’s also in the last year of his contract, so that won’t help either.  Justified or not, I agree that if we struggle again this season there will be all kinds of hype about Donovan to IU... Again.

[Brass Cannon]

1 minute ago, IU Scott said:

Because most people realize that a coach should get a least 4 years to prove what he can do.  Also the top recruits if they have a great relationship with the coaching staff would be more willing to come here than if we fired Archie.  We bring in a new guy from a mid major with no connections would totally ruin our chance to with any of the top talent in 2021.  Some of you guys seem like you want to be proven right more than wanting IU to succeed so you will do anything to trash the program.

That’s not even remotely true. Elite recruits regardless of a relationship would steer clear if Archie was a bad year from being fired 

[IU Scott]

3 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

That’s not even remotely true. Elite recruits regardless of a relationship would steer clear if Archie was a bad year from being fired 

I don't think that is true because those players have confidence that they could be the one to turn IU around and would be more willing to come than if we fired him next year.  They would think by adding them to the other players we already have they would think they would turn it around.  Losing seasons did not stop Cody and Yogi  coming to IU did it.