HoosierFaithful

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/29/1032169566/the-u-s-has-a-long-precedent-for-vaccine-mandates We've had vaccine mandates for over a century without much fuss

No basis in science... for vaccines? This whole conversation has gotten a bit warped.

People are allowed to get the vaccine or not, but I'm fully entitled to have my own views on their decision - it obviously impacts me too. If anyone doesn't think it does, I'm not sure they've been paying attention for the past 18 months or the past 279 pages of this thread . Public health crisis impacts all of the public! I didn't make the graphic I posted, but I imagine the designer had a simple goal: show that the US, standing relatively alone among developed countries, has a vastly lower vaccination rate. In turn, we also have significantly more deaths per capita right now with the surging Delta variant. We can parse those two relatively simple statements all we want, but at the end of the day, this isn't complicated: we have a large portion of the population unwilling to take the vaccine and we're really the only major, developed country to have such a problem at such a scale. It appears likely that it is leading to a significantly higher number of deaths. This is preventable.

I am not an expert in public health and I am not on the front lines, and the challenges to lower income and minority vaccination are absolutely true, but I would bet most public health experts would currently say vaccine dropoff is about willingness, not availability.

I mean, COVID doesn't care about how big our country is. And it's not like our ability to vaccinate or our supply is the limiting factor on our vaccination percentage right now, so that is a bit moot IMO. Broadly speaking, that's just a list of the developed world.

One of my favorite follows on Twitter from this terrible time, a brilliant scientist: tl;dr: He estimates, based on the raw number of cases, that we might be exactly at the Delta peak. Delta is the dominant strain globally and "may displace other variants [including Mu] in the coming weeks" It will have taken 1yr for Delta to basically encompass the entire world, whereas it normally takes the seasonal flu 2-5 years He says it is "highly likely" that the next impactful variant will be a sub-variant of Delta and recommends immediate updating of vaccines to be prepared. He says this would be an "easy win"

Who knows if they’re right or not, but this seems to be the first example (if true) of what people have been warning about: a potential variant that evades antibodies. The longer this runs, it seems like we approach when and not if that such a variant occurs. people can make whatever decisions they want, but this is why some people are passionately pro-vaccine and pro-masking. We are letting a dangerous disease stick around. This affects me too, even though I’m already vaccinated. I am genuinely not trying to convince people of anything - i am just explaining my frustrations.

Look, life is intersectional, and we can't simply ban all COVID discussion. That's not realistic. In the OT board, for those who post there more frequently, we've built up a bit of a muscle reflex on sensitive topics. I know that I type posts and delete them sometimes. I'd encourage others to take the same discretion. At the end of the day, try not to view this forum to be about convincing others to think how you do. It's not a game, you don't win any points. Share your POV, that's fine, but if someone else doesn't agree with how you view COVID, either engage in respectful dialogue (publicly or privately) or just move on.

Just awful. Sorry for your loss.

damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Tread carefully all - a sad and tense situation, but we're all regulars here and know the rules.

Not trying to change anyone's opinion, but I find stories can be impactful and break through the noise of data and news articles. He mentioned later down in the replies they were not vaccinated, fwiw.

y'all sound like some scorned lovers in here IUFB on to bigger and better. PU can have our table scraps.

aw geez - terrible, sorry flynn.

I totally get why people are mad at IU - if you don't want the vaccine but you want to attend IU, I can see why that would be frustrating. At the end of the day, attendance at IU via in-person classes is not a constitutional right.

I think if anyone says it's risk free, they're being foolish with their messaging. It is, though, quite clearly a significant risk reduction compared to not having it. Additionally, this is a situation where our actions impact those around us. Getting the vaccine makes our entire community safer, which is why institutions like IU are mandating it. I just answered your question of why other vaccines take longer to get to market - drug companies, driven largely by motivations of profit, don't want to waste the billions of dollars for potentially invalid vaccines. The government, faced with a pandemic, didn't have those cares. If this were a "normal" situation and a "normal" company like Pfizer were to have spent those billions on manufacturing/et al for a vaccine they weren't even sure worked, their CEO would have been fired on the spot. That's why this was different.

The vaccine was able to get to market quickly because we threw cost out the window and spent billions that, in a normal environment, wouldn't be spent. That the "vaccine is untested" is a myth that we cannot seem to shake. It fits people's worldview, and that's fine, but they had the base of this vaccine developed before COVID even hit. From there, it was plug and play. https://news.uchicago.edu/story/how-were-researchers-able-develop-covid-19-vaccines-so-quickly

Danger, Will Robinson. Nothing inherently wrong here, but keep it above the belt.

Olsontex, you always have tremendously well thought posts. A welcome addition.

I'm a Twitter news junkie (professional hazard, I blame work) and I started following a ton of new people during COVID. A ton of smart scientists and other people who tweet interesting things, like this guy who does incredible data visualization: It was always going to be like this, but still shocking to see just how good we have it (in relative terms).

In decent position - appreciate the generosity of those who have chipped in. I’m up in the mountains but will try to update with actual numbers soon.

Heck, I'm not here to short anything, I'm here to make profit off of what other people shorted vbg