Xavier Johnson will not return this season

[btownqb]

31 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

All I know is we had 5 guys that fit the 4/5 profile among our 13 scholarship players this year.  TJD, RT, MR, JG, and LD.

One, and only one, of those guys was healthy the entire season (MR).

Two others (TJD and RT) played hurt in multiple games out of sheer necessity.

When we only had 3 of those players available, it absolutely affected the team, and IU was extremely lucky that 1 of those 3 was an All-American.

That All-American wont be here next season.  I have no appetite for starting next season with MR being the only sure thing in the frontcourt.  

Adding 3 reliable new frontcourt pieces to what we have is critical.  If Banks bulks up and can end up playing 10-15 minutes a night at the 4, we'll just be that much better.

But, taking LD out of the mix since he never played, having just 4 pieces barely worked this year despite one of those pieces being TJD.

MR, JG, half of KB, and ??????.  This team needs 3 additional bigs that can contribute, especially if one of those 3 holdovers isnt available because of injury or other.

That's why I didn't comment to rest of your post. I only had interest in the KB part, I don't disagree with you on our needs in the portal. 

[dgambill]

7 hours ago, btownqb said:

5 idc about being big as much as I care about being skilled. Needing 4 big guys doesn't mean Banks can't play the 4. 

Kansas goes 6'7 225, 6'8 205, 6'8 215.. 

I prefer to create a mismatch, more than match the other team.  Banks skill development and weight room development will show us a lot.  If he comes back 6'7 220... I want him at the 4. 

Agree about the pressure we put on the other team. Our issues now stem from our 4 not being able to space the floor. A guy like Caleb playing minutes at the 4 is not a bad thing.

[dgambill]

I have no issue with the portal. I agree on another big that plays significant minutes but I don’t think we need multiple. All that does is take away minutes from guys that we promised a spot to. Geronimo has sat patiently two years behind guys like Race and Trayce. His development was limited because we didn’t have minutes for him on the court. He needs to play..and play a lot..else why did we recruit him. Now if Coach thinks the kid can’t play fine then replace him…but he is walking if that happens for sure. I think he can play. I even think he keeps working on his jumper he is a perfect stretch 4…but we won’t find out without putting him out there next year. Im fine with a rotation of Kaleb, Jordan, Reneau, and portal big. Kaleb isn’t seeing a ton of time at the 3…we will be going 3 guards all year to space the floor and have shooters and switch ability on defense.

[Inequality]

On the suspected roster for next season assuming everyone stays put but the seniors and Jalen, who is going to be the shooters next season? It’s not like there are an abundance of shooters on this years team. Who is a guy with the ability to create his own offense? I don’t see anyone left behind that has shown the ability to do either on a level to win big basketball games.

I’m going with Malik in the post because I think he can develop into a Trace style player. I’m taking Trey for his all around game, experience and leadership abilities. Who’s left that can help win games in this league? 

Even if X returns and I’d assume that’s already a given, I don’t see a bench that can give you 20 points and defensive stops let alone a starting 5 capable of competing at a high enough level to win games in the B1G.

Offensively, we have the best player in the country with arguably the best freshman in the country and it’s been tough to win the games they should. Both those guys are on their way out.

Defensively we have one of the most experienced starting 5 in the league. None of which will be here next season.

Still post season basketball to be played but just some thoughts floating around. I think the portal door should swing both ways for this club if next season is to be on the upward trajectory.

[Kdug]

1 hour ago, dgambill said:

I have no issue with the portal. I agree on another big that plays significant minutes but I don’t think we need multiple. All that does is take away minutes from guys that we promised a spot to. Geronimo has sat patiently two years behind guys like Race and Trayce. His development was limited because we didn’t have minutes for him on the court. He needs to play..and play a lot..else why did we recruit him. Now if Coach thinks the kid can’t play fine then replace him…but he is walking if that happens for sure. I think he can play. I even think he keeps working on his jumper he is a perfect stretch 4…but we won’t find out without putting him out there next year. Im fine with a rotation of Kaleb, Jordan, Reneau, and portal big. Kaleb isn’t seeing a ton of time at the 3…we will be going 3 guards all year to space the floor and have shooters and switch ability on defense.

I disagree that we shouldn’t add talent because players were promised minutes. Minutes should be earned, not just given because someone has been on the team for x number of years. And if we’re able to get a transfer that fits the culture and is good enough to earn minutes, we should do it. We saw how quickly this years IU team went from a “deep” team to one who gets very little production outside of the starters.

I personally think we need to add at least one impact guard and one impact big in the portal, and potentially more mid-level transfers if anyone transfers out. The only players who have proven to be consistent Big Ten caliber starters on next years team are XJ and Galloway. We need to add as much talent as possible, and the minutes will sort itself out.

[5fouls]

12 hours ago, dgambill said:

I have no issue with the portal. I agree on another big that plays significant minutes but I don’t think we need multiple. All that does is take away minutes from guys that we promised a spot to. Geronimo has sat patiently two years behind guys like Race and Trayce. His development was limited because we didn’t have minutes for him on the court. He needs to play..and play a lot..else why did we recruit him. Now if Coach thinks the kid can’t play fine then replace him…but he is walking if that happens for sure. I think he can play. I even think he keeps working on his jumper he is a perfect stretch 4…but we won’t find out without putting him out there next year. Im fine with a rotation of Kaleb, Jordan, Reneau, and portal big. Kaleb isn’t seeing a ton of time at the 3…we will be going 3 guards all year to space the floor and have shooters and switch ability on defense.

In your scenario, let's say Reneau gets hurt and your portal big steps in and starts at the 5.  Who backs up the portal big when he gets in foul trouble or needs a rest?  

One front court addition is not enough.

[btownqb]

10 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

In your scenario, let's say Reneau gets hurt and your portal big steps in and starts at the 5.  Who backs up the portal big when he gets in foul trouble or needs a rest?  

One front court addition is not enough.

As the roster stands? Logan. 

[btownqb]

12 hours ago, dgambill said:

I have no issue with the portal. I agree on another big that plays significant minutes but I don’t think we need multiple. All that does is take away minutes from guys that we promised a spot to. Geronimo has sat patiently two years behind guys like Race and Trayce. His development was limited because we didn’t have minutes for him on the court. He needs to play..and play a lot..else why did we recruit him. Now if Coach thinks the kid can’t play fine then replace him…but he is walking if that happens for sure. I think he can play. I even think he keeps working on his jumper he is a perfect stretch 4…but we won’t find out without putting him out there next year. Im fine with a rotation of Kaleb, Jordan, Reneau, and portal big. Kaleb isn’t seeing a ton of time at the 3…we will be going 3 guards all year to space the floor and have shooters and switch ability on defense.

JG needs more than just an open 3 to be a good stretch 4. The whole skill set has to improve top to bottom. 

The bold, The staff knows now or will know by the time April 1(generally when we start seeing a high number of transfers) rolls around whether or not JG is contributor moving forward.. it's not going to be a trial and error type thing though... What we see in games is a drop in the bucket compared to what the coaches have seen of these guys. 

Edited March 8, 2023 by btownqb

[tdhoosier]

Just a couple of things regarding this….

- There was a stat I saw (bear with me because I’m going off of memory). This past year, 60% of transfers were double digit scorers. Of freshman, only something like 15% were double digit scorers. I only to say this to remind that scoring help is much easier to come by than in the past. 

- I also heard that last year we had a couple of high level transfers wanted to come here. Some of which, were big name guys that ultimately didn’t even end up transferring out of their programs. BUT with Race and TJD unexpectedly choosing to stay and Woody wanting to remain loyal to some guys, we had no room. I wish I could remember the podcast they were talking about this on….but Woody’s sense of loyalty in last year’s situation was because he felt he owed players on our roster loyalty in return for their decision to stick with the program when Woody was announced head coach. If true I could understand that feeling of moral obligation.

All that said, and correct me if I’m wrong, with JHS and TJD leaving we’ll have 2 open spots for transfers. I just think that with the NlL opportunities at IU and based on last year’s rumors, we can be in a really good place. I don’t think it’s a stretch to think that we can get two transfer who could start, or at least contribute major minutes. 

 

[IUFLA]

11 hours ago, Kdug said:

if we’re able to get a transfer that fits the culture

And there lies the rub... 

Chemistry is important to any team... We don't need/want problem children or locker room lawyers... 

[HoosierDom]

42 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

Just a couple of things regarding this….

- There was a stat I saw (bear with me because I’m going off of memory). This past year, 60% of transfers were double digit scorers. Of freshman, only something like 15% were double digit scorers. I only to say this to remind that scoring help is much easier to come by than in the past. 

- I also heard that last year we had a couple of high level transfers wanted to come here. Some of which, were big name guys that ultimately didn’t even end up transferring out of their programs. BUT with Race and TJD unexpectedly choosing to stay and Woody wanting to remain loyal to some guys, we had no room. I wish I could remember the podcast they were talking about this on….but Woody’s sense of loyalty in last year’s situation was because he felt he owed players on our roster loyalty in return for their decision to stick with the program when Woody was announced head coach. If true I could understand that feeling of moral obligation.

All that said, and correct me if I’m wrong, with JHS and TJD leaving we’ll have 2 open spots for transfers. I just think that with the NlL opportunities at IU and based on last year’s rumors, we can be in a really good place. I don’t think it’s a stretch to think that we can get two transfer who could start, or at least contribute major minutes. 

 

I only know of the transfer rumors from what I have read here, but I was very much left with the impression that Woodson made it known that he was unlikely to turn away such players in the future. Assuming TJD and JHS are gone (I don't think either of those things is a certainty, but both are more likely than not), I don't see next year's roster as one that has a legitimate chance of being where we are now. Obviously Woodson has more information than I do, so perhaps he sees it differently, but if he doesn't, then I think he clearly has to add pieces to try to put us in that spot. We at least need a big, and probably need a wing scorer. I like guys like Bates and Geronimo, I hope they stay. But, they have not had the kind of careers thus far that cause you to count on them as more than back-ups. Bates is getting 20 minutes a game this year and Geronimo is getting 13. I'm all for giving them the chance to earn more, but I wouldn't want to go into a season depending on them to play more.

[Zuckerkorn]

One major factor, IMO, is how patient CMW is with some of our current guys. Personally, I think JG & TB have had a great opportunity to show their talent but have not really seized upon it.  Duncomb? Maybe he's the one long term project, IDK there's not a lot of evidence to know where he stands.  It appears Woodson is more patient than what I'd be and that's probably a good thing. 

Another factor is which players, if any, will transfer out.  It's almost expected that one freshman will statistically.

Erring on the cautious side, I don't know how much contribution to expect from the 2 incoming recruits.  It's a big transition.  Also, I'm somewhat concerned with Newton having missed so many games, but maybe he'll return like Calbert did.

[IUFLA]

Woody said Tamar "earned his stripes tonight" in the Michigan post game regarding his defense on Bufkin...

That means a lot to Woody if he can get Tamar to be consistent on the DEFENSIVE end...

I think some of you sell Tamar short...He's shown he can get hot and hit 3 or 4 in a row...He just has to develop consistency on BOTH ENDS...He currently IS a 40% 3 point shooter (39% in conference play) with the 3rd most attempts on the team behind JHS and Kopp...And he's 96% from the line...We just need him to get there more...

I think he's going to be a big part of what we do going forward...

[MoyeCowbell]

4 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Woody said Tamar "earned his stripes tonight" in the Michigan post game regarding his defense on Bufkin...

That means a lot to Woody if he can get Tamar to be consistent on the DEFENSIVE end...

I think some of you sell Tamar short...He's shown he can get hot and hit 3 or 4 in a row...He just has to develop consistency on BOTH ENDS...He currently IS a 40% 3 point shooter (39% in conference play) with the 3rd most attempts on the team behind JHS and Kopp...And he's 96% from the line...We just need him to get there more...

I think he's going to be a big part of what we do going forward...

Players need to have something that gets them on the floor, and work on other elements that keep them there. I have zero problem with Bates being a defense-first player who finds offensive opportunities as a byproduct.

Like you said, he's got a great stroke... if he can make himself absolutely indispensable on the defensive side of the ball (which will naturally elevate his overall confidence), he'll get plenty of opportunities to find shots on the other end. And through those reps and minutes, he'll be able to work on creating better shots for himself and others as well.

[btownqb]

29 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Woody said Tamar "earned his stripes tonight" in the Michigan post game regarding his defense on Bufkin...

That means a lot to Woody if he can get Tamar to be consistent on the DEFENSIVE end...

I think some of you sell Tamar short...He's shown he can get hot and hit 3 or 4 in a row...He just has to develop consistency on BOTH ENDS...He currently IS a 40% 3 point shooter (39% in conference play) with the 3rd most attempts on the team behind JHS and Kopp...And he's 96% from the line...We just need him to get there more...

I think he's going to be a big part of what we do going forward...

He's developed a ton since this time last year. Most don't want to admit how far behind he was to begin with.... that ranking out of HS was laughable. 

[tdhoosier]

You can see the potential in Scoop. It just always seems like he needs to drain a shot early to get his head in the game - on both sides of the floor. With more minutes, hopefully he'll get those early shot opportunities more often. That said, I'm not sure he'll be a consistent player we'll be able to rely on next year (at least early on). I think the obstacles he needs overcome will result from game experience - not off-season development. 

[KoB2011]

41 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Woody said Tamar "earned his stripes tonight" in the Michigan post game regarding his defense on Bufkin...

That means a lot to Woody if he can get Tamar to be consistent on the DEFENSIVE end...

I think some of you sell Tamar short...He's shown he can get hot and hit 3 or 4 in a row...He just has to develop consistency on BOTH ENDS...He currently IS a 40% 3 point shooter (39% in conference play) with the 3rd most attempts on the team behind JHS and Kopp...And he's 96% from the line...We just need him to get there more...

I think he's going to be a big part of what we do going forward...

I agree that we need him to be and it isn't unreasonable to think he can be more consistent, but until he proves otherwise he's still a pretty big question mark. 

[IUFLA]

I wish I could find an article I read over the off season last year...

It was about Tamar working with a coach (maybe his high school coach) on a defensive technique that he wasn't quite picking up...But he made the coach keep running it until he fully got the concept, then he executed it flawlessly every time after that...

He's a hard worker, he's got a ton of confidence in himself, and he's coachable...You can't ask for much more than that...

It's a progression...Just like anything else in life...you're always better with more experience...

I get a little frustrated during the game threads at some of the comments on our players, and Tamar seems to garner a lot of criticism...Some deserved, but some not, and to me the "I wish he'd transfer" stuff is nonsense...In the Michigan game thread, I was hoping he would make some playsdown the stretch to help us win, and he did...

Edited March 8, 2023 by IUFLA

[Steubenhoosier]

1 minute ago, IUFLA said:

I wish I could find an article I read over the off season last year...

It was about Tamar working with a coach (maybe his high school coach) on a defensive technique that he wasn't quite picking up...But he made the coach keep running it until he fully got the concept, tehn he executed it flawlessly every time after that...

He's a hard worker, he's got a ton of confidence in himself, and he's coachable...You can't ask for much more than that...

It's a progression...Just like anything else in life...you're always better with more experience...

I get a little frustrated during the game threads at some of the comments on our players, and Tamar seems to garner a lot of criticism...Some deserved, but some not, and to me the "I wish he'd transfer" stuff is nonsense...In the Michigan game thread, I was hoping he would make some playsdown the stretch to help us win, and he did...

I have been critical of Bates in the past. To me, the biggest concern is that when he gets in the game, he always seems to want to try to get up shots in a hurry, not within the context of the offense. It's like he thinks that he doesn't know how long he's gonna be on the floor, so he's gonna try to get on the stat sheet somehow. It has not been just one, but multiple games where this has happened, to the point where it appears he's a "me first" kind of guy. Once he does stay on the floor for a while, he does tend to play more within the flow of the offense, and he can hit shots as a spot up three shooter. I don't trust his handle yet, and I think the game still needs to slow down for him. An illustration of that would be the put back that he missed at the end of regulation in the Michigan game. He was right there and missed it. Appeared as though he hurried things.

He could be a valuable component of future Hoosier teams, but he is going to have to pick up on his development to be an asset.

 

[BobSaccamanno]

1 hour ago, IUFLA said:

Woody said Tamar "earned his stripes tonight" in the Michigan post game regarding his defense on Bufkin...

That means a lot to Woody if he can get Tamar to be consistent on the DEFENSIVE end...

I think some of you sell Tamar short...He's shown he can get hot and hit 3 or 4 in a row...He just has to develop consistency on BOTH ENDS...He currently IS a 40% 3 point shooter (39% in conference play) with the 3rd most attempts on the team behind JHS and Kopp...And he's 96% from the line...We just need him to get there more...

I think he's going to be a big part of what we do going forward...

His defense IS better and so is his passing.  He sees the floor way better than last season.  It’s possible he could erupt next year at least in theory. 

[BobSaccamanno]

3 hours ago, btownqb said:

As the roster stands? Logan. 

I may be one of the last ones standing but I have hope for Logan and I hope he’s back.  He’s been sick and had vets in front of him.  I think he’s eligible for a redshirt too which would leave him 3 years left.  I don’t know what his work ethic and makeup are like, but assuming they are good, he can be a developmental big man who can be a nice rotational piece his last three years.

There is a physical nature to his game and he can face up and pop on some short jumpers. I hope he stays and gets in the rotation next year.  His 4th and 5th years here, he can be very solid and pay off the investment in him.  

Edited March 8, 2023 by BobSaccamanno

[IUFLA]

11 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

I have been critical of Bates in the past. To me, the biggest concern is that when he gets in the game, he always seems to want to try to get up shots in a hurry, not within the context of the offense. It's like he thinks that he doesn't know how long he's gonna be on the floor, so he's gonna try to get on the stat sheet somehow. It has not been just one, but multiple games where this has happened, to the point where it appears he's a "me first" kind of guy.

I've never gotten that feeling about him. He's a shooter, so he's out there to score...I don't think he's a "me first" kid at all...If he was, I kinda doubt he'd have the standing he has with both his teammates and coaches...

17 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

the put back that he missed at the end of regulation in the Michigan game. He was right there and missed it. Appeared as though he hurried things.

Appeared to me he tried to put it back with his left (strong) hand rather than go with his right on the right side of the basket...Maybe something to work on in the off season...

I just think with another off season of progress, he's going to be a big part of our team next year...

[SawatchHoosier]

2 hours ago, IUFLA said:

And there lies the rub... 

Chemistry is important to any team... We don't need/want problem children or locker room lawyers... 

So your saying we should go all in on any New Mexico State men's basketball player?

[KoB2011]

40 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I wish I could find an article I read over the off season last year...

It was about Tamar working with a coach (maybe his high school coach) on a defensive technique that he wasn't quite picking up...But he made the coach keep running it until he fully got the concept, then he executed it flawlessly every time after that...

He's a hard worker, he's got a ton of confidence in himself, and he's coachable...You can't ask for much more than that...

It's a progression...Just like anything else in life...you're always better with more experience...

I get a little frustrated during the game threads at some of the comments on our players, and Tamar seems to garner a lot of criticism...Some deserved, but some not, and to me the "I wish he'd transfer" stuff is nonsense...In the Michigan game thread, I was hoping he would make some playsdown the stretch to help us win, and he did...

To clarify my position on him, and I don't think the last paragraph was directed at me, but I really hope he stays and am a fan of his. I think he has a ton of potential and I like him as a person. I think earlier this year when it looked like things might be clicking for him he showed a lot of leadership in at least one game deferring his shots to guys that didn't play as much, because we were blowing someone out. I definitely noticed that.

If you told me that he develops into what he is capable of, along with XJ, Galloway, and Reneau, I'd feel pretty dang good about the starting point we have on next years team. Tamar is just the biggest question of those four in my mind heading into next year, but he has perhaps the highest ceiling. 

[SawatchHoosier]

42 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I've never gotten that feeling about him. He's a shooter, so he's out there to score...I don't think he's a "me first" kid at all...If he was, I kinda doubt he'd have the standing he has with both his teammates and coaches...

Appeared to me he tried to put it back with his left (strong) hand rather than go with his right on the right side of the basket...Maybe something to work on in the off season...

I just think with another off season of progress, he's going to be a big part of our team next year...

Next year this team's offense will be completely different IMO. Without TJD anchoring the offense I believe next years team with XJ coming back becomes more fast break/run and gun offense. I believe XJ, Trey, Bates, Banks, Geronimo and Gunn thrive in an offense like that. Our defense however...

Edited March 8, 2023 by SawatchHoosier