Hoosier4Life53 Posted January 18 Report Share Posted January 18 (edited) 16 hours ago, jefftheref said: Sorry but I agree with Steub. I have been an Indiana fan for over 60 years through thick and thin and not wanting to see trash basketball and coaching has nothing to do with character. That is a cheap shot and totally unwarranted. I happen to believe that this program deserves better than what we have given by an incompetent administration that has ruined what was once a blue blood program. I don't have 20 years left to wait for a winning program and my time is much more valuable than to waste it on the crap that was on display last night! Couldn’t have said it better. I was a teenager during the 1970-71 season when Hoosier basketball really started to take off with George McGinnis and Steve Downing. Knight followed shortly thereafter, and we all know that story. Some will say we’re “old timers” and we need to stop living in the past, and maybe so, but I’ll be a Hoosier forever, and will never lose faith that our time will come again. In today’s world with a mix of good recruiting and the right moves in the portal, you can turn a team into a contender overnight. Let’s hope that happens sooner rather than later. Unfortunately, it doesn’t look like it’s happening this year, so I’ll try to enjoy the wins rather than letting the loses ruin my day. Edited January 18 by Hoosier4Life53 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyhoosier29 Posted January 18 Report Share Posted January 18 1 hour ago, KoB2011 said: The starting 5 with Cupps is actually one of the best lineups in the country. We can change our roster, we can make little changes that would likely be the difference in a number of games down the stretch. Playing that 5 man lineup ~20 minutes and rotating the few subs who do play with multiple starters, as well as cutting out long 2s, would make a huge difference for this team. Those changes are 100% on Woodson to make IMO. That’s only on one end though. Blocking out and guarding the perimeter on the other end is kind of necessary too… or at least I thought it was. 😂 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted January 18 Report Share Posted January 18 22 minutes ago, kyhoosier29 said: That’s only on one end though. Blocking out and guarding the perimeter on the other end is kind of necessary too… or at least I thought it was. 😂 100%, I just don’t think we are going to learn how to boxout or change our defensive scheme mid season. I would like us to rethink how we guard in the offseason and put in a lot more work on the glass. The fact that we have the size and length we do and can’t rebound well, and aren’t more disruptive defensively is honestly mind boggling. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted January 18 Report Share Posted January 18 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13th&Jackson Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 1 hour ago, KoB2011 said: If I was a big NIL contributor, I’d be furious with the product 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUCrazy2 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 12 hours ago, 13th&Jackson said: If I was a big NIL contributor, I’d be furious with the product I would be mad if I was a guy who kicked in for that Archie buyout only to feel like we are heading back there after 3 years... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC2345 Posted January 19 Author Report Share Posted January 19 14 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said: I would be mad if I was a guy who kicked in for that Archie buyout only to feel like we are heading back there after 3 years... Most of those people were probably on board with the hire at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC2345 Posted January 19 Author Report Share Posted January 19 (edited) This season is frustrating but I fully expect IU to go all out in the portal this year. Woodson knows he needs to get this roster fixed and there will need to be several additions. He is running out of time to get this roster and program to were he wanted it before riding off into retirement. Edited January 19 by DC2345 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUCrazy2 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 1 hour ago, DC2345 said: Most of those people were probably on board with the hire at the time. At the time. I mean, I guess I don't understand the mentality of super rich people because I have never been there, but the school coming to ask me to light a few million on fire every few years would get really old, really quick for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUCrazy2 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 1 hour ago, DC2345 said: This season is frustrating but I fully expect IU to go all out in the portal this year. Woodson knows he needs to get this roster fixed and there will need to be several additions. He is running out of time to get this roster and program to were he wanted it before riding off into retirement. That definitely needs to happen but we need a change in more than just the players. A whole bunch of our issues lay at the feet of Woodson and his staff that have next to nothing to do with recruiting. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUJoe Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 8 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said: At the time. I mean, I guess I don't understand the mentality of super rich people because I have never been there, but the school coming to ask me to light a few million on fire every few years would get really old, really quick for me. While I'm far from super rich, the few that I've known generally love to use their money to get what they want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 1 hour ago, DC2345 said: This season is frustrating but I fully expect IU to go all out in the portal this year. Woodson knows he needs to get this roster fixed and there will need to be several additions. He is running out of time to get this roster and program to were he wanted it before riding off into retirement. There is not indication that this will happen. We hit it hard this year and didn't get anything and left a scholarship open. And each year we show were not a guard oriented offensive schema, and not very good in most factors of the game. Hard to sell that to high level guard talent. Also why we don't have any on the horizon from high school recruits also. Next year may very well look very similar to this. Given we keep Ware, Mbako and Reneau in place. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUCrazy2 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 58 minutes ago, IUJoe said: While I'm far from super rich, the few that I've known generally love to use their money to get what they want. I want to win. If they do to, their money hasn't been getting them that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWOHoosier Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 I agree that we have guard issues but maybe the orientation of the offense has to more to do with the quality of the guards as much as scheme. JHS in the last part of last season thrived. Galloway has shown glimpses and X has even (not remotely this year) been very good at different times. The quality of depth of the guards is completely on the staff but I think portal guards could possibly be given some evidence that guards can do well in this system. Again, not saying the system is great or even good but roster construction is the bigger problem IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC2345 Posted January 19 Author Report Share Posted January 19 55 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said: There is not indication that this will happen. We hit it hard this year and didn't get anything and left a scholarship open. And each year we show were not a guard oriented offensive schema, and not very good in most factors of the game. Hard to sell that to high level guard talent. Also why we don't have any on the horizon from high school recruits also. Next year may very well look very similar to this. Given we keep Ware, Mbako and Reneau in place. This isn’t accurate. IU was very focused on select individuals and backed off of many. They focused on Ware, Ledlum, and Knecht. They kicked the tires on some others but never went all in especially with the guards. They overvalued X and Galloway and that was a major mistake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyhoosier29 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 13 minutes ago, DC2345 said: This isn’t accurate. IU was very focused on select individuals and backed off of many. They focused on Ware, Ledlum, and Knecht. They kicked the tires on some others but never went all in especially with the guards. They overvalued X and Galloway and that was a major mistake. Either delusional and overconfident in their abilities to land who they want, or just not very smart. Which is it? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 3 hours ago, DC2345 said: Most of those people were probably on board with the hire at the time. How confident are you on that? My recollection is Woodson wasn’t the top choice of a lot of people, but Buckner pushed for it and there was that group that wanted an IU guy no matter what. Maybe the IU go no matter group skews heavily towards the folks with a lot of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BankShot Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 32 minutes ago, DC2345 said: This isn’t accurate. IU was very focused on select individuals and backed off of many. They focused on Ware, Ledlum, and Knecht. They kicked the tires on some others but never went all in especially with the guards. They overvalued X and Galloway and that was a major mistake. Assuming this is accurate, and it seems like it probably is, this is why so many (I believe) are done, or close to done with this staff. I think some/many have concluded that, if you could not see or properly assess the glaringly obvious roster need for guards (or could not land them) then, either way, you're not the answer going forward for this program. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 3 hours ago, DC2345 said: This season is frustrating but I fully expect IU to go all out in the portal this year. Woodson knows he needs to get this roster fixed and there will need to be several additions. He is running out of time to get this roster and program to were he wanted it before riding off into retirement. It isn’t just a roster issue. Anyone who thinks that is just wrong. We have enough talent on this team to get a lot more out of it than we have. We had more talent last year to get more out of it than we did. There are fundamental issues with the approach this staff takes that they need to change. I am not Scott Dolson, but if I was I would be just as interested to hear from Woody how he adapts his shortcomings as I am how he fixes the roster. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parakeet Jones Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 37 minutes ago, DC2345 said: This isn’t accurate. IU was very focused on select individuals and backed off of many. They focused on Ware, Ledlum, and Knecht. They kicked the tires on some others but never went all in especially with the guards. They overvalued X and Galloway and that was a major mistake. Do you get the feel they will broaden the focus this time, or will it be the same approach? I know IU was linked in a tweet one time with Quincy Olivary that ended up at Xavier. Do you know if there was ever any serious pursuit there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 39 minutes ago, DC2345 said: This isn’t accurate. IU was very focused on select individuals and backed off of many. They focused on Ware, Ledlum, and Knecht. They kicked the tires on some others but never went all in especially with the guards. They overvalued X and Galloway and that was a major mistake. I do think this is accurate, and you’d certainly know better than most. But it also shows why the excuses we’ve heard about how they tried last offseason fall flat. This staff completely failed putting together the roster and fails schematically. It’s giving us a season that may wind up one of the worst in program history if something doesn’t change for the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BankShot Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 2 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: It isn’t just a roster issue. Anyone who thinks that is just wrong. We have enough talent on this team to get a lot more out of it than we have. We had more talent last year to get more out of it than we did. There are fundamental issues with the approach this staff takes that they need to change. I am not Scott Dolson, but if I was I would be just as interested to hear from Woody how he adapts his shortcomings as I am how he fixes the roster. Agree with this too. I should have said above that roster failures are ONE reason why many have concluded that this staff isn't the answer. There are other reasons too...rebounding, playing hard, playing smart, free throws, etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 2 minutes ago, BankShot said: Agree with this too. I should have said above that roster failures are ONE reason why many have concluded that this staff isn't the answer. There are other reasons too...rebounding, playing hard, playing smart, free throws, etc. We take long 2s at an alarming rate and have every year Woodson has been here, that’s a coaching issue. We help one pass away on defense, that’s a coaching issue. We have been a bad rebounding team, especially relative to our front court skill, every year Woodson has been here. That’s a coaching issue at this point. We have under utilized the three every year he has been here, but have actually had some pretty good shooters. That’s a coaching issue. And lastly, we have been beaten by 15+ more times in the past 2.5 years than Archie’s entire tenure or Crean’s last 7 seasons. That’s an issue that starts at the top. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 35 minutes ago, NWOHoosier said: I agree that we have guard issues but maybe the orientation of the offense has to more to do with the quality of the guards as much as scheme. JHS in the last part of last season thrived. Galloway has shown glimpses and X has even (not remotely this year) been very good at different times. The quality of depth of the guards is completely on the staff but I think portal guards could possibly be given some evidence that guards can do well in this system. Again, not saying the system is great or even good but roster construction is the bigger problem IMO. I agree, but I think if we're talking about what is salvageable this season....we can't do anything about roster construction. And while those who aren't as quick to blame our problems on Woody would say: we can't just change the scheme in the middle of the season, I'd argue that he can tweak his scheme to get better results. I was listening to Assembly call this morning and they had a pretty productive/realistic conversation about this. Andy was saying (and I'm paraphrasing) that some schemes are built with the intention of shooting the 3. Our 3 point shots are used with the primary intent of creating space. So, if that is the intent of the scheme, we can make certain tweaks like stop shooting low percentage 2's (be more aware of where they are on the floor). Or we can implement more shot fakes on the perimeter, get defenders to bite, get them off balance and create a little more space. Again, these are just examples of things we currently don't do well on offense and don't require drastic schematic changes to implement successfully. By getting a little 'sharper' with our intent to create space on the interior and using better lineups can lead to some incremental improvements. At this point, I just want to see steady and consistent progress. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosier987 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 13 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: And lastly, we have been beaten by 15+ more times in the past 2.5 years than Archie’s entire tenure or Crean’s last 7 seasons. That’s an issue that starts at the top. Tonight could be another tally to this abysmal statistic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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