Gordon vs. Langford

[KoB2011]

We had some debates before the season about EJ vs Romeo, I thought it might make sense to revisit it after. Who do you think was the better freshman two guard?

For me, it was Gordon by a long shot. He was an absolutely dominant player and the most well-rounded scorer I've seen at IU in my lifetime. 

[BenZIU]

Gordon was certainly used more effectively than Romeo was by their respective coach's.  

[Zlinedavid]

Gordon established himself as a legitimate #1 scoring option on a team that featured the B10 player of the year, and numerous other scoring options. 

Romeo showed flashes of being able to be a #1 scoring option, but didn't ever establish himself as such, despite being on a team without a clear cut #1 scoring option.

Only real advantage Romeo has....he's taller.  Romeo may have a slight edge in pure athleticism, but it's negligible.  EJ has/had the better shot and could move to both sides equally well (before he banged his wrist up). 

EJ, and it isn't even close. 

Edit: All the more reasons why I'd love to see Romeo spend another year in BTown. 

[Zlinedavid]

6 minutes ago, BenZIU said:

Gordon was certainly used more effectively than Romeo was by their respective coach's.  

While that may be true, there are fundamentals where EJ was clearly better, regardless of how they were used/what system they were in.

[Zlinedavid]

Some more facts to digest....

EJ: Lead the B10 in scoring, set the B10 and IU's freshman scoring record (IU's still stands), B10 freshman of the year, 1st team all B10, 3rd team All American, candidate for the Naismith and Wooden awards.

Romeo: 2nd team all B10, B10 all freshman team. 

 

[Inequality]

Both players - a tremendous talent and huge asset to the program. I would say Gordon. The kid had fire in the belly. Over the top energy & confidence. A complete scoring machine. 

Side note: I get a kick out of those that think the coach’s remotely control the players. Cool concept.

[BADGERVOL]

EJ by a MILE

[Zlinedavid]

3 minutes ago, Zlinedavid said:

Some more facts to digest....

EJ: Lead the B10 in scoring, set the B10 and IU's freshman scoring record (IU's still stands), B10 freshman of the year, 1st team all B10, 3rd team All American, candidate for the Naismith and Wooden awards.

Romeo: 2nd team all B10, B10 all freshman team. 

 

Like there was much doubt left, but the above should prove that Dan Dakich is an idiot.  A record setting freshman guard, who doesn't miss very often, but when he does......you just have the B10 player of the year in the paint to grab it for a putback. 

I could have coached that team to a 3-4 record by handing the ball to EJ/DJ, saying "You two figure it out", sitting down on the bench, getting drunk and passing out.  In hindsight, maybe that's what Dakich should have done.

[IU Scott]

Gordon because he was way more physically ready for the college game.  Also it is ironic that both was hindered by wrist injuries that effected their shooting.

[FW_Hoosier]

15 minutes ago, Inequality said:

Both players - a tremendous talent and huge asset to the program. I would say Gordon. The kid had fire in the belly. Over the top energy & confidence. A complete scoring machine. 

Side note: I get a kick out of those that think the coach’s remotely control the players. Cool concept.

So now the coach doesn’t even “remotely control the players”... Lol

[HoosierJax]

Gordon,not even close...Gordon could stroke it from 25' in your face or drive down the lane and dunk in your face...Romeo not so much

[IUFLA]

My personal opinion is yes, Gordon, but a little closer than some people here are saying.

Romeo didn't exactly suck in the scoring department, and he is a better rebounder. He may have gotten lost a few times on defense, but overall, I think he's a good defender. Eric was decent the defensive end, but I know he wasn't a Joe Dumars.

As far as how coaches used them, no slight to EG, but that stain left by his coach, I'd rather not repeat regardless of the record.

[Stlboiler23]

1 hour ago, KoB2011 said:

We had some debates before the season about EJ vs Romeo, I thought it might make sense to revisit it after. Who do you think was the better freshman two guard?

For me, it was Gordon by a long shot. He was an absolutely dominant player and the most well-rounded scorer I've seen at IU in my lifetime. 

Gordon no question. He had a much better all around game than Romeo. 

[Zlinedavid]

25 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

My personal opinion is yes, Gordon, but a little closer than some people here are saying.

Romeo didn't exactly suck in the scoring department, and he is a better rebounder. He may have gotten lost a few times on defense, but overall, I think he's a good defender. Eric was decent the defensive end, but I know he wasn't a Joe Dumars.

As far as how coaches used them, no slight to EG, but that stain left by his coach, I'd rather not repeat regardless of the record.

Is Romeo a better rebounder, or did he simply have more opportunities?

Romeo was 2nd only to Morgan with 5.4 per game.  EJ averaged 3.3 per game, but had DJ grabbing 10 per game and Ellis grabbing 7. 

Overall, I'd say you're probably right, but this is another area where the team they were on has an impact. 

[Fiveoutofsix]

1 hour ago, BenZIU said:

Gordon was certainly used more effectively than Romeo was by their respective coach's.  

Totally disagree with that.  It is an easy comment to say though.  One, they were different players and two they had different personal around them.  Having the ability to be a lights out shooter changes things and then having the other support opened up a lot.  The coaches played to Romeo's strengths.  His weakness were exposed at times.  

You cant run the same set every single time.  You also can't change a personality.  I'm a big fan of Romeo's; however the myth of him not being used properly is poor.  

[Danomatic]

Gordon was a phenomenal player in his one and only season at IU. He was as tenacious defensively  and aggressive offensively as any freshman that I can remember playing at IU. EJ’s all around game was elite. 

That being said, I believe that Romeo has the higher ceiling and will make some NBA organization very happy for years to come. Romeo kind of reminds me of an Evan Turner type of player. Romeo’s length and athleticism should help maximize his potential. His inability to drive and finish with his left, along with his poor outside shooting are by far his biggest flaws. Those can be fixed with time. He could develop into one heck of a 2/3 at the next level and could potentially guard 1-3 at the next level. Romeo has to “want it” though. He needs to make sure that his motor is redlined while he’s on the court. 

Im sure that nobody is more disappointed in Romeo’s freshman season than Romeo himself. Maybe he comes back? I believe that he’s gone, but if he doesn’t like what he’s hearing at the combine, a return isn’t out of the question... and yes, I know that he could develop quicker at the next level, however, he might want to improve his draft stock if he feels that he’s too low.

[Zuckerkorn]

Gordon, hands down. Also, he was more suited to go pro because of his physical maturity.

[Danomatic]

9 minutes ago, Fiveoutofsix said:

Totally disagree with that.  It is an easy comment to say though.  One, they were different players and two they had different personal around them.  Having the ability to be a lights out shooter changes things and then having the other support opened up a lot.  The coaches played to Romeo's strengths.  His weakness were exposed at times.  

You cant run the same set every single time.  You also can't change a personality.  I'm a big fan of Romeo's; however the myth of him not being used properly is poor.  

Completely agree about EJ’s supporting cast around him. Romeo has nowhere near the talent around him that EJ had. Rob was good and Juwan is outstanding... but that 07 team was a title contender and very well could’ve won it all, had the text/talk debacle not have taken place.

[Zlinedavid]

16 minutes ago, Danomatic said:

That being said, I believe that Romeo has the higher ceiling and will make some NBA organization very happy for years to come. Romeo kind of reminds me of an Evan Turner type of player.

I can buy the Romeo/Turner comparison, but from the NBA perspective, is being "an Evan Turner" more valuable than being "an Eric Gordon"? They've had pretty comparable careers so far.  Probably depends on the makeup of the roster. 

[BGleas]

In terms of college, I would say Gordon by a pretty wide margin. I love Langford, he's a fantastic player and will most likely have a long, successful NBA career, but for me this season there was just something missing about him. It's hard to critique him because the numbers were there, but I just don't feel like the impact was. 

Outside of a few performances, it was like he logged his 35 minutes, put up his 17 points, but I didn't really remember any of it. They were just numbers that didn't really impact the outcome. Other than him being a great kid, there just isn't much all that memorable from his season. I didn't go into games thinking, "we have Langford, no way they're stopping us." There isn't a standout performance where I'll look back and say, "that was the Romeo game!" 

This is not me bashing Langford. Like I said, he's a fantastic kid and player. I just think guys like Gordon, Zeller and even Thomas Bryant made bigger impacts to their teams as freshmen. To be fair though, Langford has the worst talent around him compared to those other guys I mentioned. 

[Hoosierhoopster]

Just my take, I think people's view of Romeo's impact gets colored by his demeanor, somewhat similar to OG.

Romeo does not often demand the ball, his scoring is deceptively smooth somewhat like a Tracy McGrady. He isn't fire and brimstone like T Bryant, not an emotionally inspiring kind of player like a Vic, and at times he is unselfish to a fault, which is kind of like OG both in demeanor and in game approach. Another season would probably develop more leadership-type attributes, but the kid led the team in scoring and for the most part did it efficiently. He's a very fluid scorer. And OG ended up just fine, I'm sure he will as well, regardless of his choice.

[FW_Hoosier]

54 minutes ago, BGleas said:

In terms of college, I would say Gordon by a pretty wide margin. I love Langford, he's a fantastic player and will most likely have a long, successful NBA career, but for me this season there was just something missing about him. It's hard to critique him because the numbers were there, but I just don't feel like the impact was. 

Outside of a few performances, it was like he logged his 35 minutes, put up his 17 points, but I didn't really remember any of it. They were just numbers that didn't really impact the outcome. Other than him being a great kid, there just isn't much all that memorable from his season. I didn't go into games thinking, "we have Langford, no way they're stopping us." There isn't a standout performance where I'll look back and say, "that was the Romeo game!" 

This is not me bashing Langford. Like I said, he's a fantastic kid and player. I just think guys like Gordon, Zeller and even Thomas Bryant made bigger impacts to their teams as freshmen. To be fair though, Langford has the worst talent around him compared to those other guys I mentioned. 

The thing that’s always going to bug me is that Romeo never had a 30 point game.  How??

[Danomatic]

1 hour ago, Zlinedavid said:

I can buy the Romeo/Turner comparison, but from the NBA perspective, is being "an Evan Turner" more valuable than being "an Eric Gordon"? They've had pretty comparable careers so far.  Probably depends on the makeup of the roster. 

I think Gordon is the better pro. The Romeo/Evan Turner comparison is what Romeo’s current game reminds me of... I think he’s. Capable of much more, but that’s up to his individual development.

[13th&Jackson]

1 hour ago, Danomatic said:

Completely agree about EJ’s supporting cast around him. Romeo has nowhere near the talent around him that EJ had. Rob was good and Juwan is outstanding... but that 07 team was a title contender and very well could’ve won it all, had the text/talk debacle not have taken place.

No doubt. Armon Bassett, Jordan Crawford, DJ White, Jamarcus Ellis, DeAndre Thomas would punish this team

[Zlinedavid]

4 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

No doubt. Armon Bassett, Jordan Crawford, DJ White, Jamarcus Ellis, DeAndre Thomas would punish this team

Yep, the first 5 plus EJ would punish them on the court, then DeAndre would punish the post-game buffet.