Nebraska Postgame Thread

[hoosier_exotics]

Man to man wont work when our guards cant stay in front of any one.

Inability to stop the dribble will kill any defense.  You will be late on your assignment when you are having to dive all the way down to try and stop a layup, that your teammates are about to give up.

The offense is fine when we can throw it in the ocean.

Two basic things are killing us, man to man D and a repeat of none shooters.

 

[jblaz13]

1 hour ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

My take, right or wrong. I don't think it's effort, really at all. What I see is the pack line and sometimes implementing it well, and sometimes not, and rather than effort, sometimes it's who you have on the floor, as in athleticism, mobility, the ability to close out quickly etc. Our big lineup is not very effective. 

Awareness  and timing are just as important as effort, and ability and those have had several moments of being been far less than desirable.

IU has often appeared to be surprised that teams are doing the same thing over and over to score.. What , I ask , should be surprising about it if they are actually seeing everything in front of them develop.

Just my opinion. I haven't kept close track of whether or not their heads have stayed up but I saw enough replays of opponent highlights and scoring sequences to make me wonder how nobody saw several of those plays coming.

The thing with awareness is issues with it show up on both ends.  Issues with failing to catch passes or appearing unready to receive entry passes points to it too.

The raw rebounding numbers last night would suggest nothing is wrong there, but some of the boards the Huskers(as well as prior opponents) have turned into 2nd chance points also looked like IU had an edge to secure rebounds or possession of loose balls yet lost it. Are we really THAT slow. Maybe I just need a closer look than from a TV or computer screen though.

Over the past few games they have been so inconsistent from one 10 minute stretch of game play to the next , but I generally speaking think some guys are still waiting until the shot goes up to look up.

[NotIThatLives]

Question.  Do all pack line ds send their super slow big men way out like 30 feet from the basket on a hard hedge?

I honestly don't think we are doing the pack line correctly.  Sometimes we have guys putting a lot if ball pressure way out and then other times everyone seems packed into the 3 point line, not extended enough and give guys really easy in rhythm jump shots.  

Chemistry can and should improve.  Defense can and should improve.  Spacing can and should improve.  And im watching michigan rally and notice how hard and fast they move the ball.  Eventually Jerome and Demezi are going to barry shots.  

[rico]

Was gonna respond earlier but had things to do this morning.  

First of all, we got the win.  Always a plus, especially coming against a conference foe.  I would rather sulk about an ugly win than be pissed about a loss.

I could go in depth about what I would do differently but at the end of the day Archie is still the coach.  

Let's just take the W, learn from it and get ready for the next game.

P.S.  The IU flag is flying full staff at "Rancho Rico."

[jblaz13]

2 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

Question.  Do all pack line ds send their super slow big men way out like 30 feet from the basket on a hard hedge?

I honestly don't think we are doing the pack line correctly.  Sometimes we have guys putting a lot if ball pressure way out and then other times everyone seems packed into the 3 point line, not extended enough and give guys really easy in rhythm jump shots.  

Chemistry can and should improve.  Defense can and should improve.  Spacing can and should improve.  And im watching michigan rally and notice how hard and fast they move the ball.  Eventually Jerome and Demezi are going to barry shots.  

Good thoughts. Chemistry is always a big part and guys have to play together enough to mesh well together more times than not. 

They look like a defense that doesn't always play as if they understand how everyone elses'(that they are on the floor with at a given time) roles fit together with their own. Some nights it comes together for longer than others , but reverting to bad habits just when they appear to be in the rearview mirror looks relevant to understanding - to me. Once something is understood progress usually starts to take hold on a more consistent basis.

I also mentioned questionable floor awareness above,  but focus might've  been a better word.

[BADGERVOL]

1 hour ago, jblaz13 said:

Good thoughts. Chemistry is always a big part and guys have to play together enough to mesh well together more times than not. 

They look like a defense that doesn't always play as if they understand how everyone elses'(that they are on the floor with at a given time) roles fit together with their own. Some nights it comes together for longer than others , but reverting to bad habits just when they appear to be in the rearview mirror looks relevant to understanding - to me. Once something is understood progress usually starts to take hold on a more consistent basis.

I also mentioned questionable floor awareness above,  but focus might've  been a better word.

Ok I get what you’re saying and largely I agree with you. Here is my contrary thought I’d like your input on (and anyone else’s).

Archie has been working on instilling this complex defense for three years now. I get that at the beginning of each season there’s new guys that have to learn it and such. So every season there is going to be at least somewhat of a learning curve.

HOWEVER, we can’t have such a huge learning curve that every single season that we can’t even play good defense as a team for 10-20 games at the start of every season. That’s my problem with this notion. At some point here we need to get our crap together and know what the heck we are doing out there so we can actually SEE how this defense works.

i still have deep philosophical concerns about the pack line. I agree with others who have stated that when you have every piece and the players all get it, it can be stifling, but if we dont have all of that in place it allows people to tear us up from outside. That “sounds like” Crean’s offense ya know? “Hey if I have great wings, a great PG that can get on the hip of any player in the country, and great post players our offense is AMAZING!” Well duh any offense would be with all of that. Wouldn’t we just have a great defense even apart from the pack line if we had a bunch of guys with length, effort, unity, and IQ? What’s so special about the pack line?

[Artesian_86]

4-4 Alabama giving (home team) Penn St. 8-2 all they can handle right now. Former Hoosier, Curtis Jones looks like Penn States best player....however, Tide up 6 at half. The Lions just knocked off #4 Maryland, and are playing very similar to IU vs. Nebraska.....Goes without saying.....you better  be prepared for a dog fight with ANY B1GTEN team....

 

[rico]

33 minutes ago, BADGERVOL said:

Ok I get what you’re saying and largely I agree with you. Here is my contrary thought I’d like your input on (and anyone else’s).

Archie has been working on instilling this complex defense for three years now. I get that at the beginning of each season there’s new guys that have to learn it and such. So every season there is going to be at least somewhat of a learning curve.

HOWEVER, we can’t have such a huge learning curve that every single season that we can’t even play good defense as a team for 10-20 games at the start of every season. That’s my problem with this notion. At some point here we need to get our crap together and know what the heck we are doing out there so we can actually SEE how this defense works.

i still have deep philosophical concerns about the pack line. I agree with others who have stated that when you have every piece and the players all get it, it can be stifling, but if we dont have all of that in place it allows people to tear us up from outside. That “sounds like” Crean’s offense ya know? “Hey if I have great wings, a great PG that can get on the hip of any player in the country, and great post players our offense is AMAZING!” Well duh any offense would be with all of that. Wouldn’t we just have a great defense even apart from the pack line if we had a bunch of guys with length, effort, unity, and IQ? What’s so special about the pack line?

I am leery of anything set in stone.  Personally I disdained RMK's defensive philosophy.  There is more than one way to play it.  I liked my HS B-ball(HoFer) coach's take.  Don't be predictable on defense.  Give the opposition wrinkles the whole game.  Keep them unbalanced and unsure what they are looking at.

[Zlinedavid]

6 minutes ago, Artesian_86 said:

4-4 Alabama giving (home team) Penn St. 8-2 all they can handle right now. Former Hoosier, Curtis Jones looks like Penn States best player....however, Tide up 6 at half. The Lions just knocked off #4 Maryland, and are playing very similar to IU vs. Nebraska.....Goes without saying.....you better  be prepared for a dog fight with ANY B1GTEN team....

 

CuJo isn't an All American, but the boy can play. He worries me when we play PSU. Not that he left under bad circumstances, but there's always a little extra motivation playing a former team.

[Indykev]

Great win last night, loved the offense in the first half i thought it was great. The D was fantastic the whole way. I really loved not fouling at the end of reg. up 3 just so we all got to watch more basketball. Lookout for that Neb. team, kenpom says 0-20 in big ten, they are will cause some damage this season. Well a win is a win, 10-1, on to the next.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rico]

30 minutes ago, Indykev said:

Great win last night, loved the offense in the first half i thought it was great. The D was fantastic the whole way. I really loved not fouling at the end of reg. up 3 just so we all got to watch more basketball. Lookout for that Neb. team, kenpom says 0-20 in big ten, they are will cause some damage this season. Well a win is a win, 10-1, on to the next.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Shouldn't you be stalking?

[IU878176]

36 minutes ago, Indykev said:

Great win last night, loved the offense in the first half i thought it was great. The D was fantastic the whole way. I really loved not fouling at the end of reg. up 3 just so we all got to watch more basketball. Lookout for that Neb. team, kenpom says 0-20 in big ten, they are will cause some damage this season. Well a win is a win, 10-1, on to the next.

 

You willing to share your combo of meds?

[Indykev]

8 minutes ago, rico said:

Shouldn't you be stalking?

no more, waste of time since we dont sign anyone who takes a visit.

[HoosierJax]

4 minutes ago, Indykev said:

no more, waste of time since we dont sign anyone who takes a visit.

Wow...now thats a Slam...better change that avater to Duke or Kentucky 

[Zlinedavid]

17 minutes ago, IU878176 said:

You willing to share your combo of meds?

A Prozac the size of a semi tire, 3 Oz of moonshine, 2.5 sheets of acid and just a pinch of bath salts.

[Zlinedavid]

55 minutes ago, Indykev said:

Great win last night, loved the offense in the first half i thought it was great. The D was fantastic the whole way. I really loved not fouling at the end of reg. up 3 just so we all got to watch more basketball. Lookout for that Neb. team, kenpom says 0-20 in big ten, they are will cause some damage this season. Well a win is a win, 10-1, on to the next.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I haven't seen such blatant, outright positivity since my last syphilis test.

[Proud2BAHoosier]

1 hour ago, Indykev said:

Great win last night, loved the offense in the first half i thought it was great. The D was fantastic the whole way. I really loved not fouling at the end of reg. up 3 just so we all got to watch more basketball. Lookout for that Neb. team, kenpom says 0-20 in big ten, they are will cause some damage this season. Well a win is a win, 10-1, on to the next.

 

Ummmm….. We did foul at the end of regulation to send it to OT.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jblaz13]

3 hours ago, BADGERVOL said:

Ok I get what you’re saying and largely I agree with you. Here is my contrary thought I’d like your input on (and anyone else’s).

Archie has been working on instilling this complex defense for three years now. I get that at the beginning of each season there’s new guys that have to learn it and such. So every season there is going to be at least somewhat of a learning curve.

HOWEVER, we can’t have such a huge learning curve that every single season that we can’t even play good defense as a team for 10-20 games at the start of every season. That’s my problem with this notion. At some point here we need to get our crap together and know what the heck we are doing out there so we can actually SEE how this defense works.

i still have deep philosophical concerns about the pack line. I agree with others who have stated that when you have every piece and the players all get it, it can be stifling, but if we dont have all of that in place it allows people to tear us up from outside. That “sounds like” Crean’s offense ya know? “Hey if I have great wings, a great PG that can get on the hip of any player in the country, and great post players our offense is AMAZING!” Well duh any offense would be with all of that. Wouldn’t we just have a great defense even apart from the pack line if we had a bunch of guys with length, effort, unity, and IQ? What’s so special about the pack line?

I was more supporting the continuity and health needed to play any system in a general sense and hope I didn't come off as a proponent of the pack line.Lol    

I favor old school straight up unconfined man to man as opposed to any specific variation(s) of it being a staple. To me variations are better situational wrinkles that a  defense should be able to execute in specific circumstances. The perception that ANY system implies about it's own weaknesses is not my favorite, and it seems too susceptible to being devastated by a good opposing combo guard who can get the ball to the blocks and kick out too fast for it to contain the perimeter - for my preference. .

If one is regularly coaching physically overmatched teams, I am sure it could be viewed as a Godsend, but that is my personal stance on the pack line itself to be clear  . 

I disagree with a few things Archie does on both ends of the floor , just like I did with Crean. Archie's system doesn't yet have near what Crean was able to build  from the continuity standpoint. I honestly hope it doesn't take that long either.

 I just don't think Miller has had enough time + fortune with injury to have built that vital chain of player succession established where more experienced guys can impart a high degree of intricate knowledge and wisdom to help integrate the new faces into the system each year. Normally I would have thought this year should be the year,  even with new faces as starters  However hard to ignore the rules committee moving the 3 point line backward seeming a bit untimely as effects on the learning curve for the pack line may go. This rule basically rewrites the curve itself.  For a system designed on such specific floor based(3 point line related) spacing,  adjustments to it have likely came which makes everyone learning from a reset point of sorts.

Just my speculation as to what might be at the root of IU's ongoing an inconsistency despite Miller's frustration that it is not better right now. He should expect the D to play his method better since the team showed flashes of looking so good in it at times.

There really isn't anything special about it other than allowing a team to compenstate for being less athletic on defense which might allow a strong offensive player with defensive limitations to factor into the gameplan heavier. I just know that with IU talent - and without requirements of landing a one and done every year for it to work -  it can be played more effectively than anything at Dayton. Conditions have not cooperated with  the timetable most of us hoped for initially. However, times, and perception of the bare minimum on how fast a given system should take hold has shortened. What I believe to be enough time (between years 3-5)  isn't viewed as being so mainstream anymore.  

 

[hoosier_exotics]

57 minutes ago, Indykev said:

no more, waste of time since we dont sign anyone who takes a visit.

Just curious,  but the guys who are close/ semi close to the players and coaches. Do you actually voice your opinion to the staff?  Or act chummy then come on the boards and talk smack?  

[GoshenFan84]

Something else worth noting: IU didn't get home from MSG until 5:00 am Wednesday morning. Nebraska's previous game was last Saturday.

Also Purdue plays at Nebraska Sunday. Purdue's last game was last Sunday (12/8). A well rested Purdue will blow the doors off a tired Nebraska team.

[Beowulf50]

7 hours ago, hoosier_exotics said:

Man to man wont work when our guards cant stay in front of any one.

Inability to stop the dribble will kill any defense.  You will be late on your assignment when you are having to dive all the way down to try and stop a layup, that your teammates are about to give up.

The offense is fine when we can throw it in the ocean.

Two basic things are killing us, man to man D and a repeat of none shooters.

 

Our lack of defense is making our opponents look like champions!! What is going on Archie???! Very troubling in year three!! Get it right and win out December!! Go IU!!

[BGleas]

39 minutes ago, GoshenFan84 said:

Something else worth noting: IU didn't get home from MSG until 5:00 am Wednesday morning. Nebraska's previous game was last Saturday.

Also Purdue plays at Nebraska Sunday. Purdue's last game was last Sunday (12/8). A well rested Purdue will blow the doors off a tired Nebraska team.

As critical as I was of the performance last night, this matters. IU absolutely had tired legs and Nebraska came in rested and ready to play. 

[OGIUAndy]

Let’s see what happens in the next couple of weeks. We can all agree (and so did Archie and the players at the press conference) that they need to play better. But this team is deep and showing some toughness that’s been lacking in past seasons. I will say it comes down to Green. He plays well, the team does well. 

[IUguy]

I saw the game and heard Archie's comments.  All I know is that the guards and whoever else wants to shoot from the outside had better gain some confidence and start making their threes.  When (not if) this happens, IU will be very, very difficult to defend.  Other than this, I hope Green recovers quickly, as he and Rob are still our best guard combination.  Al is good and getting better, and Damezi is rapidly improving.  Finally, Archie needs to design defenses based on who we play and then the team needs to execute.  Should not lose if they score 80 points.

[Beowulf50]

5 minutes ago, OGIUAndy said:

Let’s see what happens in the next couple of weeks. We can all agree (and so did Archie and did the players at the press conference) that they need to play better. But this team is deep and showing some toughness that’s been lacking in past seasons. I will say it comes down to Green. He plays well, the team does well. 

Apparently Green is hurt again......