BobSaccamanno

46 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

Perhaps that was the problem. CMW was so focused on advanced scouting of the portal that there wasn't any time to teach fundamentals like dribbling, blocking out, protecting the basketball, defensive rotations, ball movement, transition defense, free throw shooting, passing out of double and triple teams, taking short threes instead of long twos, moving feet and not reaching or committing silly fouls 60' from the basket**takes a breath**, understanding screens and how to get around them, communicating, properly executing entry passes...

You missed teaching big men to go up straight instead of reaching with their hands and committing fouls. 

I agree that I’m not in favor of NET relative to head to head.  Having said that, as a program it’s your obligation to play the rules as they are set up.   Get your efficiencies way up.   Learn your lesson.  

7 minutes ago, Drroogh said:

How did those All Everbody Ivy League transfer players last year fair this year?

I’d have to look at their stats but alot of those guys really know how to play and we have not had enough of those guys.  IMO

9 hours ago, NCHoosier32 said:

yeah.  i keep saying it is super tough to think Woodson will get less heralded players and play them in a system to get the most out of them.  my only hope is that he gets crazy talent this offseason and almost can't mess them up.  

No doubt.  IU doesn’t run a well schooled system where you can take savvy guys who can come together like Hoiberg or Chris Collins or even Underwood does.  That’s the opposite of IU.   Throw it into the post and never see it again, no ball or player movement, etc etc.  

The hope is just fielding a team that’s respectable in terms of Ws and Ls even if the metrics are bad.  My main hope, barring a miracle, would be for the program to build up enough talent that it’s easier for the next staff.  

It would be nice if we landed a core for the ‘25 class.  

31 minutes ago, Kdug said:

I don’t know much about any of these guys, but a lot of them have impressive numbers. Any guard who can shoot is a yes for me.

What’s the deal with the first 3 guys? None of them seem very impressive outside of being bench players on power conference teams

 

 

Yeah the first thing I’m looking at is 3 PT and FT shooting and then you have to make sure they can defend.  Some of these guys who can rebound from the wing would be nice.  

As teams drop out of the tourney, more winning players will become available. 

12 minutes ago, Indykev said:

this is the kid the other team always has that kicks our head in every game.

He’d kick XJ’s ass 9 out of 10 times.  

2 hours ago, FritzIam4IU said:

It pains me to admit this, but if I were a high level D1 player coming out of high school this year, I would go to Purdue and play for Painter over IU/Woodson...no question...and I say that as a kid who grew up rooting for IU.

Not just that, unless they are a lifetime fan having it ingrained into them, you’d have to question the priorities of anyone choosing IU.  These are the types of guys we’d roll in the past and now that’s us.  

1 hour ago, Parakeet Jones said:

If we’re going down the portal hole, I hope we take the Cignetti approach. Get productive guys from a lower level rather than  guys who are disgruntled or didn’t play much on P5’s. I suppose Foster fits that bill. 

I agree at certain positions but it will be heavily dependent on scouting.  You don’t want Parker Stewart but you do want the right guys but the staff has to dig deep.  Personally I would not compromise on defense.  

Presumably we already have very detailed analysis on anybody who was a possibility for the portal so that we wouldn’t need to scramble.   With an excellent process we are set right now to be decisive on who we pursue hard and in the right order.  

We need everything but high end point guard is mandatory.  No shot without that. 

Why didn’t IU look at Heidbreder when he hit the portal?  Is it too late now that he’s at Clemson?  Doesn’t he look like exactly what we need?   If I’m right about any of this, add him to the list.   

If Meyer can defend at this level, he looks like he would be a very good get.  I’m glad our staff is finally digging a little deeper in their scouting.  15 points a game on 40% from 3 as a freshman.  I would want to be reassured on defense but if you bring in 3 guards and he is one of them, that could work.  We need a high end point guard though.  

9 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

My fear….

Next year we play a similar style and squeak into the tournament. Then what? 

Not enough to be fired.

Stuck In mediocrity for another year with another roster to rebuild. 

This is the worst case scenario, IMO. It’s not the bad that scares me - It’s the in between good and bad that scares me. . 

 

I don’t think it’s good enough.  He came in promising big ten championships and competing for National championships.  Those are his own words.  So next year will be his fourth year to get to that level.  That’s a fair period of time in the NIL era with his budgets.  If he doesn’t get there, then he will have failed at his own expectation. 

1 hour ago, John S said:

We probably need him to satisfy DEI goals.   

Lol that made my day 

2 hours ago, Danomatic said:

Going into the season, CJ’s development was going to be paramount in order for IU to have a successful year. I have watched from afar and don’t understand how Woodson hasn’t been able to help this young man. I was told multiple times heading into the new school year that the most improved player during the offseason was CJG. I mean, you can see the raw abilities, but he needs reps, and IU(now/portal era) is no longer in the development game. 

He will do better somewhere else, book it.  It wasn’t going to happen here and that is damning to player development here.  

3 hours ago, ForHumanity said:

Gunn enters the Portal.

Let’s clear the decks.  Hopefully 2-3 assistants are sent packing too.  The Admins.  Get them out.   Kenya Hunter has presided over a ton of mis-reads of talent across two head coaches.  Re-do the entire program. 

Foster. 29.7% from 3 with a large sample size. 

Let’s say we get six new players.  There should be no more than 2 juniors. The most logical would be to bring 2 juniors, 2 sophs, and 2 freshmen.   Dolson will need to micromanage the roster makeup so the new staff in 2025 has a chance.  
 

PG

SG

CG

SF

SF

Rim protector 

Free throw shooting is a prerequisite.  Player skills should be complementary and not redundant. 
 

4 minutes ago, Husker Fan said:

Love the passion of Hoosier BB fans.  You’ll be back.   Huskers have just had one of those seasons that only come around once every 20 years.  Look forward to your resurgence in the coming years.  

Class.  Love Tominaga.  My favorite player. Go get ‘em. Very likable team. 

4 minutes ago, Andrew said:

Some of yall are aiming way too low. Wait for the portal to open, there’s going to be some huge names and we have the money.

Guys like Domask and Ace Baldwin and many others have proven that good mid major players can fill very good roles up here.  I hope our staff has a much better handle on good, productive college players instead of the Anthony Walkers.  We were not involved with some of these guys but our competition was running circles around us in player identification.   

51 minutes ago, Maedhros said:

I have a theory that Archie Miller - perhaps overwhelmed by the Indiana job - knew at least that Indiana fans wanted players from the state, so he pulled up the rankings at 247 or Rivals and just went down the list. To be fair, he landed all those guys, but he couldn't fill in with anyone out of state, and they didn't make for very good teams.

Woodson seems to be stuck in an NBA comfort zone, thinking only guys with length and athleticism similar to what he's coached his whole will be able to help him win. You need players like Ware to hang banners, but you need to surround them with players like Leal to keep your team floating along in the regular season. Purdue bringing in 3-star, 328th ranked 6'1" Lance Jones from Southern Illinois might be why they get to their first Final Four in over 40 years.

With the availability of the portal, and the yearly turnover of rosters, I really do think any serious college program needs a GM role, to scout available talent, identify priorities, and make sure the pieces fit.

Agree.  On the NBA issue, we would all like to have some of that talent.  But since the beginning of time there have been dominant college players who aren’t high level NBA players.  I haven’t gotten over Luke Harangody and Matt Howard.  Great college players.  We might have been happy that we signed Noah Vonleh but he wasn’t as good in college as those guys by comparison.  I want the right mix.   We have lacked that smart, tough, savvy Indiana boy.  We produce them like it’s an assembly line yet they aren’t being recruited by IU.  Sounds like Benter is in that mold.   It’s sheer insanity.  

9 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I would argue we haven't developed those players and or taylored the team to fit the players we have gotten.  We keep trying to take high level square pegs and pound them in round holes.  Good coaches adjust to the talent they have.  

We could also just be unlucky a little in who we have selected (talent evaluation).  But more so i think we just have had good talent developing coaches..  

I think player development is 100% an issue and so is managing the trappings of being big man on campus which at IU is a special animal.  But we have consistently been mis-identifying in state talent for 20 years to the point that it’s not just luck or coincidence.  It’s not being handled right, and this far pre-dates Woody.

It’s not just in-state failures even though that’s the most acute issue.   Foreign talent acquisition is also a zero.  We need somebody in our player personnel group who needs to study Canada, Europe, Australia, etc   Heck, isn’t Tominaga literally from Japan?  I was reading about a 6’10 European kid in Canada.    Of course we aren’t listed with him.  We probably don’t know about him.   

 It’s a department failure.  Yes, we spend a ton on recruiting.  This year we have exactly zero recruits.  The process needs to be overhauled.  When the head coach doesn’t get out and look at players, doesn’t know the names of on-campus visitors, etc., you need a player personnel department that is out looking at talent, figuring out that Conwell is better than Gunn even if Kyle Neddenriep doesn’t know it.  He’s a writer, not a scout.

7 hours ago, btownqb said:

How did we not get Ryan Conwell in the portal last year? A PIKE GRADUATE!!! 

The more I think about this, the more I want to throw up. We seriously were just like "yeah-- Gunn, Banks you're good enough.. heck who cares if Newton has one knee and we leave a scholly open."

Absolutely fireable decisions. 

Conwell- 16ppg 6r 2a 40% from 3 on 7 attempts a game.... instead of watching him play, we get to see Gunn shoot arrows and change his hairstyle every game. 

Agree.  He and Gunn are both Sophs out of Indy.  We picked the wrong one.  We do that a lot.

  As a program, our scouting of in-state talent hasn’t been good enough.  If our coaching staff doesn’t have the energy to do the work or the eye to identify talent, then hire a personnel department who can evaluate talent get out there.  You can’t just let Matt Glenesk list the top 5 players in the state and then recruit off his list because the Indy Star anointed a few guys.

 This isn’t just Woody although he inherited some of the prior staff too.  Gotta roll up the sleeves and find the Desmond Bane, Jake LaRavia, Craig Porter types who are all in the NBA from in-state schools yet we overlooked them.  It’s Braden Smith.  Matt Howard.  Bryant McIntosh.  We keep getting it wrong.  

Bob Knight figured out that he wanted Tom Coverdale and Brian Evans.  He went out of state to find a little known recruit named Kirk Haston. Our recent coaches wouldn’t have recruited any of these guys.  Overhaul player personnel.   

XJ needs to go to work on D on their “little guard” who has been the best player on the floor.  Tominaga was just toying with the younger Cupps.  Maybe XJ can cover him but he is going to have to go out on him and not worry about the drive as our scheme normally is set up to do.  

I think there are problems with the NET but it’s basically the law.  I may disagree with a law that says I can’t rob a store just because I’m hungry, but it doesn’t change the fact that I have to follow the process and work within the rules to satisfy my hunger.

We need a head of analytics to study the “law” and translate it for the staff so we can optimize it as it stands.   The head of analytics can do a number of other things like study where players are maximized and weaknesses they can improve, combinations of players that succeed and don’t, how to maximize efficiency based on the data and certain plays, apply strengths vs weaknesses with the opponent, etc.  

54 minutes ago, Hoosier82 said:

People were making similar comments about Tamar Bates last year and all he did was go to Mizzou and average 14pts while shooting 50% from the floor, 39% from beyond the arc. Not to mention, 93% from the line. Not everyone is going to round into form as an underclassmen

We need better player development and management to get more out of these guys.  I will be shocked if we don’t get at least one new assistant and overhaul our basketball infrastructure.  It looks unwieldy and inept.  I don’t think Scott is going to let that stand.  It’s one thing he can control.