5fouls Posted November 13, 2023 Report Share Posted November 13, 2023 Thought we could use this thread to do comparisons of players and teams throughout the season. Individual numbers can be misleading, but viewed in totality from a higher level, they are indicative of how a player/team is performing. I'll start with one of my favorite stats: Player Efficiency Rating (PER). Sample size is important, as evidenced of end-of bench guys sometimes having great numbers. But, over time, the bet players will end up with the best PER. Happens in both college and in the NBA. IU through two games compared to IU from last season. The numbers certainly indicate that the team and several individual players have struggled so far. This season through 2 games Last Season (in totality) 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 13, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2023 Again, it's early, so we will most certainly see movement towards the norm as the season progresses, but I would like to highlight the following from the above. - For reference, in the NBA, a PER of 15 is considered league average. Not sure if the same assumption can be made for college, but it does provide a reference point. - The stat tends to favor bigs over guards. Not really sure why, but comparisons are more meaningful when done big vs big or guard vs guard. - That said, All-Americans and All-Conference level players historically have the highest PER among players who play meaningful minutes. - Those that have expressed disappointment in X so far, the numbers do not support that, especially considering what I mentioned above about the stat favoring bigs.he's been as solid as could be expected. - The numbers so far this year indicate the players with best PER are getting the most minutes. Whether or not that is by design is unknown to me, nor do we know if it will continue. That said, it bears watching. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iuthruandthru Posted November 13, 2023 Report Share Posted November 13, 2023 As a stats guy I love this, thanks for posting. I will be really interested in the treads as the season plays out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 13, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2023 Here is 'Usage' through the first two games, and again I added last year's full season for reference. Usage represents an estimate of the percentage of possessions per 40 minutes that a player 'uses' (is involved in the ultimate outcome). Mgbako ranks higher than I expected, but still may not be as high as many would like. Otherwise, not a lot of surprises given the style of offense that Indiana plays. The comparison to last season also reflects a significant reduction in possessions so far this year. This year through 2 games. Last season. No surprise to see TJD and JHS on top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 13, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2023 (edited) Adding to the reference above that the # of possessions seemed to be way down from last season, IU is currently ranked 303rd in adjusted tempo by KenPom. They finished last season ranked 140th. Edited November 14, 2023 by 5fouls 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Common Sense Posted November 14, 2023 Report Share Posted November 14, 2023 Though he was a good leader, Kopp was not very productive statistically the last two years. Less than at NW. Wonder if there is any correlation to MM's struggles and how we use the 3 in our offense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 14, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2023 25 minutes ago, Common Sense said: Though he was a good leader, Kopp was not very productive statistically the last two years. Less than at NW. Wonder if there is any correlation to MM's struggles and how we use the 3 in our offense. Could definitely play a part. But, I also think it's what a player does with the opportunities he gets. And, we can't forget that MM is a freshman. Probably never had to deal with this kind of adversity before either. Above all else, he needs to listen to Coach Woodson and he will be fine. Remember Oladipo as a freshman? It takes some guys a little while. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 15, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2023 (edited) Keep this in mind as I present these next numbers. There are 362 D1 teams. Indiana ranks 327th in 3-point FGS made. Only 35 teams worse Indiana ranks 356th in 3-point FG attempts. Only 6 teams worse Indiana ranks 359th in total field go attempts. Only 3 teams worse Indiana ranks 342nd in offensive rebounds per game. Only 20 teams worse Indiana ranks 322nd in total rebounds. Only 40 teams worse Indiana ranks in the bottom half in both Assists and Steals Indiana ranks 357th in 3-pointers allowed per game. Only 5 teams worse Indiana ranks 359th in 3-point attempts allowed per game. Only 3 teams worse. Our opponents have the 35th best number of steals per game On the positive side, we have a darn good FT defense. Edited November 15, 2023 by 5fouls 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 15, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2023 Further evidence of an alarmingly anemic offense. Being negative in this stat is.......not good. Ware is the only rotation player not negative. Last year. Gunn was the only rotation player that was negative. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted November 15, 2023 Report Share Posted November 15, 2023 1 hour ago, 5fouls said: Keep this in mind as I present these next numbers. There are 362 D1 teams. Indiana ranks 327th in 3-point FGS made. Only 35 teams worse Indiana ranks 356th in 3-point FG attempts. Only 6 teams worse Indiana ranks 359th in total field go attempts. Only 3 teams worse Indiana ranks 342nd in offensive rebounds per game. Only 20 teams worse Indiana ranks 322nd in total rebounds. Only 40 teams worse Indiana ranks in the bottom half in both Assists and Steals Indiana ranks 357th in 3-pointers allowed per game. Only 5 teams worse Indiana ranks 359th in 3-point attempts allowed per game. Only 3 teams worse. Our opponents have the 35th best number of steals per game On the positive side, we have a darn good FT defense. The MM debate aside, our style of play is not conducive to winning in thos day and age of basketball. Albeit just two games, those are worse than Archie Miller era numbers. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosier987 Posted November 15, 2023 Report Share Posted November 15, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, BGleas said: The MM debate aside, our style of play is not conducive to winning in thos day and age of basketball. Albeit just two games, those are worse than Archie Miller era numbers. Any idea why you think Woodson isn’t changing style up to date? The offensive scheme is awful with our personnel. I think we were all under the impression he was going to go back to a more modern style offense once TJD left and the likes of Ware and MM commitments (length that can shoot). Edited November 15, 2023 by Hoosier987 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted November 15, 2023 Report Share Posted November 15, 2023 36 minutes ago, Hoosier987 said: Any idea why you think Woodson isn’t changing style up to date? The offensive scheme is awful with our personnel. I think we were all under the impression he was going to go back to a more modern style offense once TJD left and the likes of Ware and MM commitments (length that can shoot). I don't know. I guess it's personnel again since our guard depth is so light and even overall not high-end. Probably also because while super early, it doesn't look like Banks or Gunn are going to make a big leap this season. So, we've kind of gone from centered around TJD/Race to centered around Ware/Reneau. So you have to wonder why we weren't able to attract interest from more guards and wings in the portal? Good news is Woodson said after Sunday that he wants/needs IU to play faster. I also happen to think we need to play smaller and quicker and put an emphasis on shooting more 3's. Fortunately or unfortunately, I think Banks and Gunn are the key to being able to go smaller, more perimeter oriented. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purdue7 Posted November 15, 2023 Report Share Posted November 15, 2023 Fran is a psycho but damn Iowa runs good stuff on offense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 15, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2023 If you had said Mgbako had the worst Defensive Rating on the team through 2 games, you would be.....wrong. He actually has one of the best (lower is better), and is considered to be better than average (100 is average). Now, on Offensive Rating, where higher is better, he has some work to do. Sorted by Defensive Rating Sorted by Offensive Rating. Not to pick on CJ, but I have never seen that rating before. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyhoosier29 Posted November 16, 2023 Report Share Posted November 16, 2023 The offensive numbers meet the eye test, but the defensive definitely don’t. Broken system …. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2023 20 minutes ago, kyhoosier29 said: The offensive numbers meet the eye test, but the defensive definitely don’t. Broken system …. They say we aren't guarding well on the perimeter, which we are not. The Mgbako number is odd, but I can get behind the others. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2023 In the last 20 years, there have been only two occasions where IU finished the season with a higher poll rating than it started. In the 20 years prior to that (84-85 through 03-04), the Hoosiers accomplished that feat 7 times and tied it once. 2011-2012 the Hoosiers were unranked in teh preseason poll and finished off the year ranked 16th. 2015-2016 the Hoosiers started the year ranked 15th and finished it ranked 14th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FKIM01 Posted November 16, 2023 Report Share Posted November 16, 2023 3 hours ago, kyhoosier29 said: The offensive numbers meet the eye test, but the defensive definitely don’t. Broken system …. I thought the same. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2023 11 hours ago, kyhoosier29 said: The offensive numbers meet the eye test, but the defensive definitely don’t. Broken system …. 8 hours ago, FKIM01 said: I thought the same. Granted, 2 games is a small sample size. But, the bottom line is you are not going to be an elite team with half your players in the rotation having a below average defensive rating. Here's UConn's year-end defensive ratings from last year. Only one rotation player below average. If all individual parts of a defense perform, then the defensive performance of the complete entity will reflect that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted November 16, 2023 Report Share Posted November 16, 2023 Also concerning is if they focused most of the preseason on defense. And it's this bad, still. With the length and size of the team, come on man. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 17, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2023 Malik Reneau is averaging 4 assists per game, which leads the team. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 17, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2023 (edited) Many will look at that highlighted personal foul stat and think those are pretty darn impressive number after 3 games. I look at it and see a team that is not aggressive enough on defense, one that's not being physical enough to stop dribble penetration, and one that is not fighting hard enough on the boards. Edited November 17, 2023 by 5fouls 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted November 17, 2023 Report Share Posted November 17, 2023 6 hours ago, 5fouls said: Malik Reneau is averaging 4 assists per game, which leads the team. To me with Reneau, it's not the passes he makes, those are typically good (hence leading the team in assists), it's the ones he doesn't make. Obviously he's incredibly talented in the post, has great footwork and touch, etc. I get it, he's really good down there. But there are just a lot of times where the defense collapses on him and there are open shooters all over the place and he forces it up anyways. He's great at the big-to-big passing, but it feels like the kick-out passing is a last resort. Again I get it, he's scoring down there and is efficient so its hard to argue, and it's not like we have Steve Alford spotting up, but it just feels like he's reluctant to kick it out. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 18, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2023 Turnover Percentage. This one will likely surprise some people, and it probably should create some discussion, especially if X is out for a few games. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 18, 2023 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2023 Conference standings for Offensive and Defensive ratings. Offensive Rating - 5th. Defensive Rating - 12th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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