Lostin76 Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 39 minutes ago, 5fouls said: I think a lot of the issue in the U.S. is the number of Americans that feel some sort of sense of entitlement. When I see pictures 3rd world countries where everyone has a mask on, it disheartens me that we cant get there in the U.S. That said, I think the U.S. is reporting differently than many countries, Some countries likely don't have the capacity to count their dead. Others like China and Russia obviously under-report. And, finally, it's possible that the virus simply hits certain populations harder. The U.S and Eastern European cultures are very similar, and both of those have been hit very hard. Meanwhile, places like Japan are coming through very well. Could be that cultural factors, even down to something like diet, are playing a part. I think you are onto something - I'm afraid it's that American exceptionalism that's biting us in the a**. This thing can be beat, but it takes a united front. 2 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said: Talk about a misleading statement. You saying Malta and Gibraler are testing better than us? Our testing is obviously not where it should be. But we are testing at a volume nobody else is even approaching. The test volume is high. The organization, distribution etc is still sketchy at best. Tests per million is just not anywhere near a fair measuring approach. We can manipulate numbers all day doing that. On the flip side, we have tested 4 times as many people as India has. They have 5 times our population. That does not mean we are doing great. Just as The Cayman Islands aren't doing better because they are beating us per million. Our testing is not some shining beacon on the hill. Nothing about our response suggests that we can beat this. Although some states have had success (NY has flattened the hell out of the curve after being the epicenter. But that was not easy) And I don't see AZ, TX, of FL willing to do what NY did to turn it around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 1 hour ago, Reacher said: Care to comment on what the Houston area hospital CEOs had to say? Are they pushing some narrative when saying people are overhyping things? You assume death rates today are the same as they were in March / April. Good for you. I have seen enough to believe the possibility that death rates have fallen due to younger, healthier people being diagnosed, better treatments, more preparedness by hospitals and Drs, etc . The fact is there were 2500 deaths/ day at the peak. That has fallen by 90%. If cases are actually up substantially, then the death rate has fallen more than that. Are you going to measure deaths in absolute numbers, a percentage, a trend? Please don't going saying I told you so when the deaths increase later this week, as I imagine they will off an all time low, but acknowledge that there will be ebbs and flows and look at the 7 day, 14 day, 30 day trend lines. Lastly, when the CDC announces that Covid is no longer a pandemic, will that satisfy your requirement that Covid is no longer a national emergency? For the second and last time, I am done "discussing" this with you. You are blatantly pushing a false message. I'm more than tired of it. As should be beyond obvious, bed capacity itself has NOTHING to do with the simple irrefutable (except that you will refuse regardless of reality) fact that the number of cases, daily and overall, and hospitalizations have re-spiked, including to record levels, including of course here in Texas where I live and understand what's actually going on, clearly, far better than you. You do not engage in actual discussion. Your gig is clear, and I'm done with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lostin76 Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 32 minutes ago, IUFLA said: Do you have a source for that? I'm showing the US at 6th per million... Sorry, didn't see your response. I always use this for counts. Which is another issue altogether, we are all using different sources! https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Lostin76 said: Nothing about our response suggests that we can beat this. Although some states have had success (NY has flattened the hell out of the curve after being the epicenter. But that was not easy) And I don't see AZ, TX, of FL willing to do what NY did to turn it around. We're not going to "beat" anything, particularly Mother Nature...That's the very definition of tilting at windmills... New York has almost 32,000 deaths because of this pandemic...Texas isn't even a 10th of the way there...I'm not trying to be mean or smart-assed here, but I kinda doubt anyone in this state wants to follow the NY model... Edited July 6, 2020 by IUFLA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 18 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said: Talk about a misleading statement. You saying Malta and Gibralter are testing better than us? Gibraltar is usually rock solid in what they do. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 4 minutes ago, IUFLA said: We're not going to "beat" anything, particularly Mother Nature...That's the very definition of tilting at windmills... New York has almost 32,000 deaths because of this pandemic...Texas isn't even a 10th of the way there...I'm not trying to be mean or smart-assed here, but I kinda doubt anyone in this state wants to follow the NY model... Not sure anybody thinks we're going to 'beat' this. Quite the contrary. That said, while we aren't going to beat a hurricane, we can board up windows, build houses on stilts, evacuate population, etc. to minimize the damage. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lostin76 Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 (edited) 30 minutes ago, IUFLA said: We're not going to "beat" anything, particularly Mother Nature...That's the very definition of tilting at windmills... New York has almost 32,000 deaths because of this pandemic...Texas isn't even a 10th of the way there...I'm not trying to be mean or smart-assed here, but I kinda doubt anyone in this state wants to follow the NY model... Other countries have flattened it. We have not. This is a fact. We are losing the battle and most of our leadership has given up. I'm not sure why people are okay with that or feel the need to defend our horrible response to this, but I can't and won't. And yeah, no one wants to be NY, but there's no way around the reality that we were hit harder than anyone else, have had more loss, and have managed to come out on the other side of it. I'd feel much safer walking around NY right now over FL, TX, or AZ. Edited July 6, 2020 by Lostin76 politics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 8 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: Not sure anybody thinks we're going to 'beat' this. Quite the contrary. That said, while we aren't going to beat a hurricane, we can board up windows, build houses on stilts, evacuate population, etc. to minimize the damage. Of course we can...and some of the boarded up houses aren't going to make it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrassIU Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 42 minutes ago, Lostin76 said: I think you are onto something - I'm afraid it's that American exceptionalism that's biting us in the a**. This thing can be beat, but it takes a united front. Our testing is not some shining beacon on the hill. Nothing about our response suggests that we can beat this. Although some states have had success (NY has flattened the hell out of the curve after being the epicenter. But that was not easy) And I don't see AZ, TX, of FL willing to do what NY did to turn it around. I do not disagree. Just saying the testing per million is not the way I would determine if we are the best or not. As for New York, I think we may be dealing with recency bias. It is premature to say they did a good job at flattening the curve and others are not. They are no longer the hot spot. But when this horrible thing is finally over, I am thinking them and New Jetsey will still lead the pack in cases and deaths in realtion to population. Even with the blow ups in Texas, Florida, California etc, they have a very long way to go to get to New York or New Jersey numbers. I think we do agree, lets hope they do not approach those numbers. It can still be avoided if people start using basic common sense and follow simple protocols. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrflynn03 Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 (edited) I really need a break from earth right now. If aliens abducted me tonight and took me on their ship to do experiments on me im not sure I'd care. It's really hot out and I'm sure their ship is cool, plus no corona. Edited July 6, 2020 by mrflynn03 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 1 minute ago, mrflynn03 said: I really need a break from earth right now. If aliens abducted me tonight and took me on their ship to do experiments on me im not sure I'd care. From personal experience, I would not recommend that to anyone. The things they did to me..... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 33 minutes ago, 5fouls said: From personal experience, I would not recommend that to anyone. The things they did to me..... And yet you still married one of them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reacher Posted July 6, 2020 Author Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 From the attached chart, it is quite obvious NY is at the other end of the spectrum from AZ. NY and NJ used almost 50% of available beds at their peak. AZ is climbing. As is TX. TX is currently around 7?% of available beds. You can see there are a few states worse than the prior week and/ or at the top of their ranges Covid as a percent of beds.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lostin76 Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 1 hour ago, bluegrassIU said: I do not disagree. Just saying the testing per million is not the way I would determine if we are the best or not. As for New York, I think we may be dealing with recency bias. It is premature to say they did a good job at flattening the curve and others are not. They are no longer the hot spot. But when this horrible thing is finally over, I am thinking them and New Jetsey will still lead the pack in cases and deaths in realtion to population. Even with the blow ups in Texas, Florida, California etc, they have a very long way to go to get to New York or New Jersey numbers. I think we do agree, lets hope they do not approach those numbers. It can still be avoided if people start using basic common sense and follow simple protocols. I'm not sure how much flatter you can make the curve than in NY. It's like textbook curve flattening up until now. Including IN cases as a marker. NY, unfortunately b/c of who we are and how many people travel here, got jacked by this before we even realized it was a thing. And then we had to shut everything down and listen to sirens 24/7 as the deaths piled up. Like you, I hope when this is all over that we still lead the pack in cases and deaths. We've had enough of both as a nation. We should be going back to work and school at this point, not rolling back reopenings b/c of surging cases (see Miami/Dade today). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reacher Posted July 6, 2020 Author Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 20-44 year olds now make up the largest group of cases. Yet only 3.1% end up in an ICU (vs 20% of those age 75-84).With a fatality rate of 0.2% it is easy to see that deaths are not going to skyrocket if the young continue to get infected. Fatality rate is almost 19% for those over 85. Key is protecting our seniors! Covid Outbreak summary.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reacher Posted July 6, 2020 Author Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 5 minutes ago, Lostin76 said: I'm not sure how much flatter you can make the curve than in NY. It's like textbook curve flattening up until now. Including IN cases as a marker. NY, unfortunately b/c of who we are and how many people travel here, got jacked by this before we even realized it was a thing. And then we had to shut everything down and listen to sirens 24/7 as the deaths piled up. Like you, I hope when this is all over that we still lead the pack in cases and deaths. We've had enough of both as a nation. We should be going back to work and school at this point, not rolling back reopenings b/c of surging cases (see Miami/Dade today). Attached is summary for NYC showing breakdown by ages. NYC Summary.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrassIU Posted July 6, 2020 Report Share Posted July 6, 2020 36 minutes ago, Reacher said: 20-44 year olds now make up the largest group of cases. Yet only 3.1% end up in an ICU (vs 20% of those age 75-84).With a fatality rate of 0.2% it is easy to see that deaths are not going to skyrocket if the young continue to get infected. Fatality rate is almost 19% for those over 85. Key is protecting our seniors! Covid Outbreak summary.pdf 180.59 kB · 0 downloads Important to note, that is reflecting cases in February and March where the vast majority of resources were geared towards the elderly and health care workers. This is reflecting only cases resolved 4 months ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted July 7, 2020 Report Share Posted July 7, 2020 (edited) Before some eager beaver in the media tries to point to the huge spike of new cases in Kentucky today, please note that the state did not report anything on either day of the holiday weekend. Today's number is 3 days' worth. Edited July 7, 2020 by 5fouls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jv1972iu Posted July 7, 2020 Report Share Posted July 7, 2020 Lost in all the numbers, graphs, guesses and speculation are the frontline fighters, who are getting pissed off because people...young and old etc aren't taking the situation seriously, which makes the frontline folks lives extremely hard, stressful and painful. I just think we need to not lose sight of the fact that these folks are doing the very heavy lifting and asking us to help with the easy work. It's easy to forget them in this discussion. Thanks! 😐 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWatShot Posted July 7, 2020 Report Share Posted July 7, 2020 Bluffton Street Fair in September cancelled. The rednecks who flock to that annual grease fire are already losing their minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveS Posted July 7, 2020 Report Share Posted July 7, 2020 On 7/5/2020 at 7:25 PM, Reacher said: https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30534-8/fulltext This was kind of lost in news over the holiday weekend. Basically, a peer reviewed study published in the Journal of Infectious Diseases says hydroxychloroquine reduced deaths by 60-70%. Might be partially why deaths are decreasing despite the increase in cases. Could be a game changer Here is an interview with an ER doctor regarding HCQ. It’s about an hour long, but worth it. TMR 246 : Dr. Simone Gold : On the Politicisation of HCQ I think the reality is that HCQ and zinc is the cure but big pharma can’t make any money on that. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted July 7, 2020 Report Share Posted July 7, 2020 More good news... Herd immunity may not be feasible with COVID-19 😟 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted July 7, 2020 Report Share Posted July 7, 2020 1 hour ago, IUFLA said: More good news... Herd immunity may not be feasible with COVID-19 😟 I'll balance that out with some hopeful news: https://www.bbc.com/news/health-53248660 🙂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierFaithful Posted July 7, 2020 Report Share Posted July 7, 2020 AZ posts a record daily death total, a 33% positivity rate (!!), and a 1.8% mortality rate 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reacher Posted July 7, 2020 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2020 Death rates by state- https://www.statista.com/statistics/1109011/coronavirus-covid19-death-rates-us-by-state/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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