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Where do you stand & what do you do?

KoB2011

By KoB2011
in General Basketball Discussion

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IU Scott

IU Scott

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, DWB said:

Sorry Scott. In my book, that's not a change, that's a tweak. Sit Al & Rob, that would be closer to a change. Run some sets to get somebody other than TJD & Armaan multiple shots, that would be a change. 

I think TJD is very good, Armaan will be better than very good before he's done, but from what I've seen, Galloway's, Hunter's scoring is from option B in the offensive set, not the primary. Race gets a little, but if we really want to be tough to play against, we need more than 2 scorers. (Even though IL only had 2 yesterday)

Whatever you said you wanted to see Trey in the lineup and he was.

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Hoosierhoopster

Hoosierhoopster

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, tdhoosier said:

Now if everybody can take the Myers Briggs personality test and add their result to the responses above. 😁

....and your astrological sign. 

I am a Libra. My favorite ice cream is mint chocolate chip. I like taking walks on the beach, and hiking in pretty forests.
Oh snap, sorry, thought this was a dating site 

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Hoosierhoopster

Hoosierhoopster

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

Definitely not dismissing based on profession. I think we all have valid viewpoints. 

I'll use myself as an example, though, I don't deal with much "transactional" and quick on a day in and day out basis, so I'm more inclined to look for slow progress and building toward a goal over time, where as someone that has different things they do for work and are measured on they will look at it differently. 

Interesting and good point 

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tdhoosier

tdhoosier

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

I am a Libra. My favorite ice cream is mint chocolate chip. I like taking walks on the beach, and hiking in pretty forests.
Oh snap, sorry, thought this was a dating site 

Mint chocolate tells me everything I needed to know. Let’s just say, I had you pegged. 

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tdhoosier

tdhoosier

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said:

No man should ever admit to loving mint chocolate chip.  Some things are better left to ones self. 😁

I mean, mint or chocolate? Pick one. It only makes sense that would be the flavor of an indecisive Libra who likes hikes in both forests and on beaches. This further explains the internal struggle of how to feel about CAM and the future of IU’s program. 

I have a feeling @KoB2011 was onto something. @Hoosierhoopster, you can mail me the check for that psychoanalysis.

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13th&Jackson

13th&Jackson

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

I mean, mint or chocolate? Pick one. It only makes sense that would be the flavor of an indecisive Libra who likes hikes in both forests and on beaches. This further explains the internal struggle of how to feel about CAM and the future of IU’s program. 

I have a feeling @KoB2011 was onto something. @Hoosierhoopster, you can mail me the check for that psychoanalysis.

My wife is a Libra. She can see every side of an argument except mine. 

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IUFLA

IUFLA

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, BGleas said:

That's a good, though loaded question. 

Conceptually, IU sets are good. We run what pretty much every team in college basketball runs. Offense has actually lost a ton of creativity in college basketball over the years and pretty much every team runs the same dribble-drive and dribble hand-off pick and roll/pop actions. 

I also feel like when IU does run actual sets we score or at least get the shot we're trying to get. 

So schematically there isn't really anything wrong with the offense. 

So then we move to things like pace/tempo, and Archie's coaching temperment/philosophy. 

Our tempo has been slow and methodical the last three years, but you can see that changing with guys like Galloway, Franklin and Lander, as opposed to guys like Phinisee and Durham. 

So, has Archie changed? Did he just need 'his guys', is this what we can expect going forward? I know I like the tempo/pace much better with freshmen and sophomores on the court. 

Finally, how does Archie coach offense philosophy? We don't shoot a ton of 3's per game since he's been here and we lack confidence in shooting and as a group. So, does Archie rip them for missing shots? Is there something about how he reacts to missed shots that causes guys to be hesitant or do we just lack strong shooters from a personnel standpoint? Franklin seems confident, Lander seems confident, the young guys seem confident. 

I can tell you, I played in college for a coach that would lose his mind on the sideline when you missed and it absolutely impacted our offense some confidence as a team. 

A lot to unpack there, but again schematically there is nothing wrong with IU's offense. My questions are more philosophical and will Archie loosen the reigns with 'his guys'? It seems he is, which I like. 

Thanks for that...a plan is only as good as the people executing it and the execution itself...

I haven't seen Archie react to too many shots...I have seen him react to us not getting to loose balls (see @coachadragna film breakdown) or making boneheaded plays. 

I asked the initial question honestly... I see us with a lot of open looks that we just don't make... Conversely, I've seen 2 guys (Audige and Dosunmu) in a row hit shots mostly with our guys challenging it, and them making them. 

i guess you'd have to go back through the whole film to get an accurate count, but boy, it seems like we do miss a ton of open shots...and that's the point of the offense, at least go me...getting good looks...

BTW, I was really surprised at the confidence Geronimo showed when he hit the corner 3 (and it was a good, open look)...I think that kid will be a good one really soon...

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Hoosierhoopster

Hoosierhoopster

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Thanks for that...a plan is only as good as the people executing it and the execution itself...

I haven't seen Archie react to too many shots...I have seen him react to us not getting to loose balls (see @coachadragna film breakdown) or making boneheaded plays. 

I asked the initial question honestly... I see us with a lot of open looks that we just don't make... Conversely, I've seen 2 guys (Audige and Dosunmu) in a row hit shots mostly with our guys challenging it, and them making them. 

i guess you'd have to go back through the whole film to get an accurate count, but boy, it seems like we do miss a ton of open shots...and that's the point of the offense, at least go me...getting good looks...

BTW, I was really surprised at the confidence Geronimo showed when he hit the corner 3 (and it was a good, open look)...I think that kid will be a good one really soon...

The clip where Geronimo is pointing to where Rob should be to defend was pretty telling. 
On offense we made some really bad decisions in the game per those clips. But for once, at least from the clips, the bad decisions on defense and the odd lack of effort from TJD repeated over several plays allowed Ill to get back in front. Highly doubt we see that again. 

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Bowhunter

Bowhunter

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, IU Scott said:
2 hours ago, IU Scott said:

Might be right but I disagree that we could have hired anyone who was that much better. Most candidates who are available are not the sure fire home run hire so anyone we would have hired would be a risk.

————————————————-The right amount of money would have got us more looks from other coaches.  Money talks.

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IowaHoosierFan

IowaHoosierFan

Posted
Posted

Technical/systems analyst

I would let CAM go at the end of the year. Pay the buyout, he will get another job so it gets offset. 

I don't like his inability to change his offense or defense when things don't go his way.   Almost no second half adjusted in offense or defense

I don't like him saying one thing but never following though

I don't like his demeanor or attitude on or off the floor.

I don't think we're getting better fast enough to compete. We are getting better but so is everyone else and our conference standing reflect that.

I love our defense but not at the expense of the offense. 

But I love IU basketball. I will root for us to win every single game, unless a loss screws Kentucky or Purdue, then maybe I will hope we lose lol.  But I will forever want what I think is best for IU to be great again. 

And it's ok if you think CAM is the next HOF coach and I don't. I will respect your opinion as long as you respect mine

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IUFLA

IUFLA

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

The clip where Geronimo is pointing to where Rob should be to defend was pretty telling. 
On offense we made some really bad decisions in the game per those clips. But for once, at least from the clips, the bad decisions on defense and the odd lack of effort from TJD repeated over several plays allowed Ill to get back in front. Highly doubt we see that again. 

Didn't Leal have to tell Hunter what offensive play we were running once in Coach Tony's breakdown?

Bodes well for the future, but kinda embarrassing for a freshman to have to school a redshirt soph where he should be on offense...

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Hoosierhoopster

Hoosierhoopster

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Didn't Leal have to tell Hunter what offensive play we were running once in Coach Tony's breakdown?

Bodes well for the future, but kinda embarrassing for a freshman to have to school a redshirt soph where he should be on offense...

Didn’t Adragna point out Leal’s defensive mistake leading to a bucket? Yep. 

Hunter made mistakes but so did several other guys, that was kind of the point to me. Adragna devoted his whole review to mistakes, and poor effort, bad rebounding effort, bad effort from TJD, and poor decisions at the rim, several mistakes by Rob - a veteran point guard, a lot to critique.

What I hope is CAM loosens up and uses the mistakes to teach, not to bench and limit guys, they need to be playing and getting better. 

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IUFLA

IUFLA

Posted
Posted
24 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

Didn’t Adragna point out Leal’s defensive mistake leading to a bucket? Yep. 

Maybe it's me, but I think that's more excusable than a player in his 3rd year in the program having to be told where to go on an offensive set...

I expect mistakes from all of the kids...but I expect less mistakes from the veterans...

I think you believe I have it in for Jerome...nothing could be further from the truth...I see what he can bring if he can work out some of them kinks to his game... Just has to be there mentally...

 

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dgambill

dgambill

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, tdhoosier said:

I’m so torn. There’s things he does when I think to myself ‘he’s the guy’ and then other things he does which make me think to myself: ‘he’s not the guy’.

Just like everybody, my concern is the offense. I don’t like these trends: shooting percentage, free throw percentage, and bouts of stagnation. We can only blame the personnel for so long before we can blame the coach. At some point ‘potential’ of players, coaching, program, etc. can no longer be used as an excuse. If we don’t make the tournament this year (or are a bubble team sneaking in) then next season is do or die for Arch.....and by “do” I mean top 3 in the Big Ten. I don’t care how good or bad the B1G is, but a middle of the pack 6th place finish will be a failure IMO. 

On another point, Galen Clavio had a good point last night in regards to playing time and Freshmen that I think ultimately impacts recruiting. CAM runs a defense that is looking great but has taken 4 years to develop. The pack line is not easy and is a system that young/new players will need to adjust to; it caters to CAM’s philosophy of “get old, stay old”. That said, it’s becoming increasingly harder to ‘stay old’ in CBB with the new transfer rule, not to mention the early entrants into the draft. Also, if a successful defensive requires 4 veterans to be on the floor in order to be ran correctly then underclassmen will not be seeing much playing time (even to help break an offensive drought). Is this where higher ranking recruits are going to want to go? Furthermore, if 1/4 of the roster doesn’t have a decent chance of seeing the floor then how does it make sense we continue to leave empty spots open on the roster? Without proper depth, one significant injury will likely dismantle an entire season. (Doesn’t that sound familiar?)

In theory this philosophy can be great, but given the reality it seems like CAM will constantly be swimming against the tide and so will our program. I fear this will only yield mediocre results. Year by year this seems to be coming to fruition. 

...i own a promotional products (swag) distributorship and moonlight as a head coach for a swim club. 

This is one of the best posts I’ve ever seen on this board in relation to Archie. I think it deserves people to take a second read and think about what he is saying. Archie is so focused on his defense and it takes so long to get good at it that it seems to really set back the program. The fact we sacrifice so much offense to play guys like Al and Rob because they understand and know our defense is a liability. You hear so many kids say they fit other teams system and we all assume it’s offensively and maybe just maybe they don’t want to have to sit and learn the defense. It almost takes a perfect recruiting class/combo of classes to hit it big. I really really like what you said...I think there is a lot of truth. I feel like CAM is trying to do too much. Combine that with mediocre upperclassman...I’m sorry but 250s AL and 5”11 mid 150s Rob just isn’t going to cut it in the big. Maybe with enough time and the right recruits I can see Archie win big...but it looks far off right now.

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BDB

BDB

Posted
Posted

I have continued to think that Archie will right the ship.  In all honesty, IMO it is a matter of time before he is let go or leaves for another job.  The excuses are adding up and the product on the floor remains the same.  Really hope I am wrong; however, the inconsistency of effort between game to game pretty much sums up his time at Indiana.  

Master Scheduler

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Leathernecks

Leathernecks

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, dgambill said:

This is one of the best posts I’ve ever seen on this board in relation to Archie. I think it deserves people to take a second read and think about what he is saying. Archie is so focused on his defense and it takes so long to get good at it that it seems to really set back the program. The fact we sacrifice so much offense to play guys like Al and Rob because they understand and know our defense is a liability. You hear so many kids say they fit other teams system and we all assume it’s offensively and maybe just maybe they don’t want to have to sit and learn the defense. It almost takes a perfect recruiting class/combo of classes to hit it big. I really really like what you said...I think there is a lot of truth. I feel like CAM is trying to do too much. Combine that with mediocre upperclassman...I’m sorry but 250s AL and 5”11 mid 150s Rob just isn’t going to cut it in the big. Maybe with enough time and the right recruits I can see Archie win big...but it looks far off right now.

I've thought about this with our basketball team, and with our football team when we had Wilson.  If you're an offensive or defensive coach, why not try to recruit people who are already good at what you struggle at?  For the football team, Wilson was a mastermind on offense, but he didn't care nearly as much about the defense.  He could turn average into great on offense.  Why not spend 80% of your time and effort trying to recruit a great defense since you can't develop it?  For Archie, why not recruit players who are already great offensive players, and teach them to play defense?

I get that there are 10 million things that go into it, and it isn't as simple as that, but you'd think somewhere we could find some great shooters and teach them to play defense.  Maybe those shooters see how we play and aren't interested in playing here?  You'd still think we'd be able to find a lights out shooter somewhere.

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Steubenhoosier

Steubenhoosier

Posted
Posted

I am a full time dog pooper scooper. I am also an errand runner, yes dear guy, and jack of all trades for my wife. I am a counselor, confidant, shoulder to cry on, sage, and whatever else my kids need from me. I am beloved Pappoo to my grandkids. When I have some extra time, I am a successful financial advisor with clients who have been with me for over 25 years.

As far as where I stand.... all of the above takes total precedence over whether my team can put a ball in a hoop. If nothing else, this year of covid has helped me realize what really matters and what is just fluff 

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