IU_Realist

41 minutes ago, Fkfootball said:

Is true that Quinn Buckner is the reason Steve Alford has never been hired?

Steve Alford is just a mid major coach.  He is better at that level where he has failed at two P5 programs. He also has the baggage of two GF beaters that he stuck up for and won’t be given the job.  Would be a bad hire and would cause a lot of friction again which this program doesn’t need.  

2 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

That’s what happens in the NFL. Coaches fire their coordinators to get another year, then the head coach gets fired the next year. 

We did the same thing with Allen.  

2 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Breaking news Edey got two fouls in the first 6 minutes of the game

 

Painter put him back in though.  Who know a coach could play their center with two fouls in the first?

12 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

And another B1G team playing their way out of the tournament 

B10 is just god awful this year 

17 minutes ago, Drroogh said:

So is Caitlin Clark 23pts 4 assists in the 1st quarter and oh by the way took the record with a shot from the logo!

She has a 44.6 PER this year.  Don’t think there has ever been a basketball player as efficient as she has been and be a guard.  

2 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

Very much disagree with this paragraph.

This is kind of like saying you need 3 things to make the best chocolate chip cookie in the world: eggs, brown sugar and chocolate chips. Sure, you need those items, but you also need other ingredients, measurements, oven temperature and most importantly: the baker. 

Good coaches can do more with less. Plain and simple. 

Or have a system in place where they can make tweeks with personnel, etc and continue to be successful.  We don’t have that.  We have a coach running a shitty offensive system and doesn’t realize in the NBA you have playmakers all over.  

8 minutes ago, cybergates said:

A) and B) in the sense that his overall body of work combined with the record this year is trending in the wrong direction. Overall body of work is averaging a ranking of 50 which is mediocre at best. .617 winning percentage overall isn't terrible but .509 in B1G isn't acceptable to me for an IU coach barring a massive rebuild that wasn't the case here.

My main reasons would be that we can't be trending in the wrong direction with a 66 year old coach and hope if he's given enough time he'll turn it around. Even if he does then he'd be ready or close to leaving anyway. I would much rather turn it around with someone else who can be here long term. Year 1 for Woodson and Year 4 for Archie are incredibly similar. JHS & TJD combined to get us a 2 win improvement in Year 2 and now in Year 3 any way you look at it it is the worst season of Woodson's tenure and arguably the worst season since 2010 (debatable vs. 2021 (Miller fired), 2011 (Crean 3rd season of massive rebuild)). The offense is as bad at it ever was w/ Archie and his defense has dropped 30-40ranks each year thus far. 

Personally, it feels like we are losing the state to Turdue and if we don't get an energetic leader with an appealing style of play soon it will take a long time to recover on the upcoming recruiting misses that are likely to happen with Woodson in place and a cloud of uncertainty hanging over him (performance and/or age related, take your pick).

Lastly, I was watching the IU/Turdue game, my 6 year old son who has become a big IU fan and Turdue "hater". After the game started getting away from us he said to me, "Dad, my brain is telling me I should be rooting for Purdue. I "hate" Purdue and don't want to root for them. Why is my brain telling me to root for them?" Makes me sad that my son hasn't gotten to experience much reason to root for IU at all other than he likes them because I do.

Sad right?  Purdue from just a basketball standpoint is so much more enjoyable to watch.  It’s sad as an IU graduate to say that.  I made the joke to someone that Woodson actually makes me miss Crean.  

20 minutes ago, IUJoe said:

X is an enigma.  I’ve seen him in warmups where, even with that broken shot, he’ll take a couple dozen three-pointers and hardly miss any.  Next game he can’t hit the broad side of a barn.  Floor game is the same way.

Yeah and he shouldn’t have rolled him out here because he is a huge part of the problem.  He isn’t a leader, never has been.  He is chaotic, volatile, inconsistent, etc.  Everything you don’t want in a leader.  That’s his decision on the players he has been bringing into the program.  The wrong ones.  However that’s not the only issue. 
 

Our offensive system is archaic and not a fit for modern day basketball.  It’s been throw down in the post and everyone watching.  We got away with it because we had a AA at center the last couple of seasons but it also limited us.  We had zero to limited movement off the ball.  The better college teams have movement.  Watch Painter.  It’s a beauty to watch.  He will roll out the ball next year and be successful because he has a defined system and recruits players to that system.  Watch Tennessee.  Watch Gonzaga. And the list goes on.  
 

Culture.  What is it?  Not defense as we get worse every year at it.  This is worse than Tom Crean defensively.  No idea what it is.  Not toughness as Edey and others are diving for loose balls and we aren’t. 
 

Defense.  It isn’t getting better but worse.  Maybe he should have kept Fife.  I don’t buy the BS Woodson and others were pushing.  It’s just people covering their asses.  
 

Player Development - don’t see it 

8 minutes ago, IUJoe said:

I am not going to be here clamoring for a firing, but if Dolson were to consider it, my short answer to your question would be both.  After all, this season is a good chunk of his overall body of work.

Personally, I can live with the first 2 seasons, although both were at the lower edge of my range of expectations.  The first season was, even though our metrics weren’t a whole lot better, an improvement over Archie’s years record-wise, and we made the tournament.  Second year, second in the Big 10.  Tournament performance was disappointing, but I cut him some slack because X was out.  Again, lower edge of my expectations but I could live with it.

This year is different for me, and it goes beyond the record, which is disappointing by itself.  And I still cut him a little slack because he couldn’t have known Newton and X would be out.  But still, why leave a scholarship open when guard play is such a question mark?  There had to be somebody that could have helped us, I would think.

The things bothering me this year are nonnegotiables like effort.  The lack of effort can be seen on TV and is glaring when you watch them in person.  I don’t know if or how Woodson has addressed it, but it hasn’t changed in 24 games.  Guys just standing instead of blocking out and getting the ball, etc.

I remember Woodson acknowledging in his introductory press conference that “ the 3 ball has changed the game.”  He has failed to recruit to that, and therefore can’t play to that.  And speaking of recruiting, he has failed to sign anyone from Indiana and is in danger of losing some big time Indiana recruits in upcoming classes who supposedly aren’t enamored with his system.  I’m not a proponent that all our kids have to be Indiana kids, but if we’re going to be elite again, we have to take full advantage of our fertile recruiting ground.

So I would just say, beyond the two choices you gave, there are some big red flags that might justify Dolson’s decision if he elected to make a change.

Newton wasn’t a difference maker.  He is a frosh. 
 

We sucked with X as well prior to all his injuries.

23 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Let me just ask this...

If Dolson were to entertain letting Mike Woodson go, would it be because of 

A) his overall body of work 

Or

B) the record this year

?

Overall.

His best ranking in Kenpom was 30th with an AA.  The other teams with an AA finished 2, 7, 8, and 9. His offensive is old and stale and horrible to watch.  His defense has gotten worse every year. It’s not like he has done anything great here.  He has been OK and now down right horrible.  

1 minute ago, BruceDouglas said:

Yep, those were the rumors. And it wasn't a certainty he'd get into Illinois either as the school generally does not allow 3rd year transfers as there's a minimum # of credit hours you need to graduate from Illinois. I think the AD may have had to get an exception there. But of course TSJ ended up staying 2 years anyway, so moot point.

Holtmann, Miller and Underwood. Brad stands alone. 😁

I still find Holtmann's career path to Ohio St to be so strange. Was head coach and a rising star at Gardner-Webb. Leaves that job to become an assistant at Butler. OK, whatever. But then Brandon Miller unexpectedly quits and now he's head coach there, essentially following Brad Stevens. A couple good seasons at Butler and he gets a Big Ten job. Fortunate to have KBD there to get him off to a great start but kind of a steady slide downhill from there.

Woodson is no different.  Had TJD then the decline.  Never changed.  His first two years he would just throw it in the block and hope for the best.  Our best runs were where he did pick and roll and was moving TJD around then he would go back to throwing down in the block with everyone watching and us getting our collective butts kicked.  Same story every year but doesn’t have TJD anymore to get him OK results.  

3 minutes ago, HoosierFaithful said:

PnR works so well and yet we go away from it for ages. Why?

IU did this under TJD as well.  It’s a Woodson thing.  Something I have been complaining about every season

8 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

Yeah I wasn’t excited.

I did like some of the initial moves and held out hope that he was doing his best to optimize what he had the first couple years, but it’s pretty clear this is just how he wants to play. Just isn’t good enough IMO. 

What guard would want to play for a team that doesn’t do much for them in relation to movement and is predominately running most things through the post.  The lack of movement in our offense is atrocious.  This has been the case even when we had TJD.  Offensive numbers scream bad.  I don’t see this getting fixed during the portal.  

1 minute ago, KoB2011 said:

Not that it really matters, but that team was 82. 

I didn’t want Woodson in the beginning because he was a bad NBA coach.  His offense and defense is just so bad to watch.  I don’t understand how anyone can think anything he does is a positive.  

7 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

The loss to PSU drops us to 99 on KenPom from 88.

We are now predicted to lose all of our remaining games, but with the averages are projected to finish 16-15. Our two best shots at a win per KenPom are Northwestern and Nebraska, both at home. 

We are 101 now.  Worst Indiana team since Crean’s third year.  

2 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

This is the killer. Woodson inherited a pretty good defense and it has gotten worse YoY in Year 2 and again in Year 3.

His offense seems to be very dependent on having extremely talented personnel like TJD and JHS. What exactly is it that Mike Woodson is elevating for this team?

He lacks a system.  See Purdue.  It’s plug and play and all about developing kids.  He can throw out there two frosh guards who weren't ranked  high and win the Big Ten while we can’t. He develops shooters.  He has movement unlike us.  List goes on.  Woodson is way over his head because he can’t build a roster, doesn’t have a system without stars.  His best season has had 12 losses.  You are right.  Defense has gotten worse since Matta and Fife left.  Idiots run this program.  

3 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

I don't have an issue with Cupps.  He wasn't supposed to be a starting PG as a Freshman.  I also think he would do alright in a different type of systemic set up.  If we keep him around for 4 years, he will contribute.

No guard in the portal with a brain will choose to come play in our offense.  95, 28 and 105 rankings. The offense is just horrible overall and is not perimeter focused.   Woodson has ranked near the bottom in shooting 3s every year.  He hasn’t developed his players.  I have said this a million times.  If I had a kid who was a D1 talent I would tell Woodson from day one not to call.  If I was sending him to a Big Ten coach it would be Painter.  

15 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

Well, we had beat them 3 straight before today and took them down to the wire without our best player.

Let’s see. How many Nattys do they have?

 

When was the last time we contended?  Quit using our dusty banners.  They are in a better place than IU basketball.  Indiana basketball is nowhere close to being that.  

52 minutes ago, dgambill said:

If we keep losing southern and central Indiana kids to Purdue I’m not sure I’ll be able to handle watching us lose to them anymore. I know these things go in cycles sometimes but Purdue seems to have a coach and system that works well for local kids…depressing.

System with movement, constant top 10 rankings, constant top of the Big 10 and development programs?  Who would not want that?

2 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

That quote from Woodson is about the extent of what we know. A 7’er with a bad ankle never seems like a great thing though.

If he is out I really hope they play Malik at the 5 instead of Sparks, but I’m not confident we will do that. 

We already struggle defensively.  Putting Malik on Coleman would be a nightmare.  

Just now, Cbp4IU said:

Bye week…. Woodson should use this time to go recruit. The other time start laying out the plan for the team (players individually) what the future holds. 

This is a scheme issue. He lucked out with having TJD. He used that for two early exits. 
 

His offense is horrible to watch with very little movement off the ball.  It’s all drop it down and everyone watch.  
 

Just watching a game everyone can see why we struggle to recruit guards. 

If I was a recruit I would run for the hills because this coach and offense is a crap show. He was saved by an all American basketball player that was already there.  
 

Run McNeeley as fast as you can. 

6 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Fort Wayne?

This is the worst IU team since 2010.  

1 hour ago, IUFLA said:

Any coaches on there? 

Dude he has had three years to correct the 3 pt defense and perimeter D.  It’s not a player issue, it’s a scheme issue.  So he hasn’t been able to teach it to players for 3 years and it’s the players fault?  Come on.  That just doesn’t make any sense you know?  
 

Our scheme offensively is just bad in general as well.  I feel like we are back in 1980s with him and his other genius consultant helping out there.  But the 95th, 28th and 90th ranked O are something to call home about.  Again three years of data points.  
 

Defense has gotten worse every year from 24th, 45th and 106th.  3 pt D has been a major issue every year.  
 

2 minutes ago, Artesian_86 said:

Dude,… I’ve watched every game. Geeesh! 

I would send my kid to Painter before Woodson.  I would tell Woodson to quit calling and I am an alum.  It’s clear as day who the better coach and developer is.