A Couple of Polls

[KoB2011]

16 hours ago, BGleas said:

A bit of a mixed bag for Ware too. Still playing really well, but his offense has fallen against the better competition. 

Good news is his rebounding has gotten better!

With Reneau and Ware not being as efficient against better competition, it's even more imperative that Mgbako continues to improve, that we get consistent offense from Galloway, and perimeter contributions from beyond the arc. 

 

 

One big difference in Ware and Reneau is that Ware is still impacting the game with defense and rebounding when his offense struggles.

Malik is a bit of a one trick pony in terms of how he impacts the game, so that one trick needs to be really good all the time. He’s getting 30% of our possessions, we can’t afford for him to struggle because of our style of play.

 

[kyhoosier29]

1 minute ago, IU Scott said:

The thing is that last year we weren't sweating it out of selection Sunday. It is to early this year to know if we are sweating it out on that Sunday 

It’s not though. Look at ALL of the metrics from last year at this time vs this year. There IS real reason for concern. We have zero quality non-conference wins (including taking two beatdowns) and the Big10 is definitely down this year making it harder to get quality wins the rest of the way. The numbers don’t just magically change. 

[bluegrassIU]

54 minutes ago, kyhoosier29 said:

It’s not though. Look at ALL of the metrics from last year at this time vs this year. There IS real reason for concern. We have zero quality non-conference wins (including taking two beatdowns) and the Big10 is definitely down this year making it harder to get quality wins the rest of the way. The numbers don’t just magically change. 

I get the concern. But we have like 75% of the season to play out.

We also don't have any bad losses, which somewhat balances out the no big wins part of the equation.

Just play well in conference and things should work out just fine. 

Play mediocre, we are screwed.

Play poorly, go ahead and put me in a straight jacket.

[IUFLA]

1 minute ago, bluegrassIU said:

But we have like 75% of the season to play out.

Now you've done it! 😉

[IU Scott]

1 hour ago, kyhoosier29 said:

It’s not though. Look at ALL of the metrics from last year at this time vs this year. There IS real reason for concern. We have zero quality non-conference wins (including taking two beatdowns) and the Big10 is definitely down this year making it harder to get quality wins the rest of the way. The numbers don’t just magically change. 

We are leading the conference so we could just get the automatic bid.  I am not going to bent out of shape in December about the tournament 

[kyhoosier29]

1 hour ago, bluegrassIU said:

I get the concern. But we have like 75% of the season to play out.

We also don't have any bad losses, which somewhat balances out the no big wins part of the equation.

Just play well in conference and things should work out just fine. 

Play mediocre, we are screwed.

Play poorly, go ahead and put me in a straight jacket.

But I guess my realist (no offense) or pessimistic view, however you’d like to view it is that we’ve played just as poorly (more times than not) so far as we have like we did against Kansas. The Kansas game can give us hope, but it’s not hard to see that there’s a lot less room for error with this team in numerous areas than there was last year (and we weren’t great last year, but we did have more higher end talent that could cover up deficiencies more easily). Hope I’m wrong and that this team takes off and finds their footing. 

Edited December 19, 2023 by kyhoosier29

[bluegrassIU]

20 minutes ago, kyhoosier29 said:

But I guess my realist (no offense) or pessimistic view, however you’d like to view it is that we’ve played just as poorly (more times than not) so far as we have like we did against Kansas. The Kansas game can give us hope, but it’s not hard to see that there’s a lot less room for error with this team in numerous areas than there was last year (and we weren’t great last year, but we did have more higher end talent that could cover up deficiencies more easily). Hope I’m wrong and that this team takes off and finds their footing. 

If XJ gets fully healthy, I actually think this team has a higher ceiling than last year's team.

The fact that we don't have a TJD also means we have a lower floor.

So I see both sides of the pessimist/optimist debate with this team.

I am still currently on the optimistic side. 

[Hoosier987]

If we could just somehow get consistency in a positive way  from either Gunn or Banks that would help tremendously…however, I won’t be holding my breath. Frankly, the lack of development between these two will ultimately hinder this team from where we want it to be.

I doubt Woody would do it, but when X comes back…considering a 7 man rotation may not be a bad thing.

Edited December 19, 2023 by Hoosier987

[MoyeCowbell]

2 minutes ago, Hoosier987 said:

If we could just somehow get consistency in a positive way  from either Gunn or Banks that would help tremendously…however, I won’t be holding my breath. Frankly, the lack of development between these two will ultimately hinder this team from where we want it to be. I doubt Woody would do it, but when X comes back…considering a 7 man rotation may not be a bad thing.

Woodson won't shorten the bench to just Cupps and Walker. Both Gunn and Banks have to play -- now when and under what circumstances -- that's where it gets nuanced. I don't think this team is strong enough to go 7. It needs 8 or 9 for fatigue and boosts of energy here or there.

[jv1972iu]

20 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said:

If XJ gets fully healthy, I actually think this team has a higher ceiling than last year's team.

The fact that we don't have a TJD also means we have a lower floor.

So I see both sides of the pessimist/optimist debate with this team.

I am still currently on the optimistic side. 

I’m skeptical that we’re going to see a fully healthy XJ again.  JMHO

[tdhoosier]

I'm holding out hope, but I think the reality is that we haven't put ourselves in good shape to make the tournament. Is anybody who is putting up red flags now, with 75% of the season left to play, wrong to say we'll have to over-perform to make the tournament? 

Nobody can predict the future, but I'm just giving my honest assessment of where we sit right now. It doesn't mean that we can't make the tournament. It doesn't mean I'm needlessly freaking out. But we do have an uphill battle. This is not going to be a season when we can finish a game or 2 above .500 in conference play and squeak in. Based on the results/quality of wins, the B1G is just too weak this year. 

[tdhoosier]

20 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

Woodson won't shorten the bench to just Cupps and Walker. Both Gunn and Banks have to play -- now when and under what circumstances -- that's where it gets nuanced. I don't think this team is strong enough to go 7. It needs 8 or 9 for fatigue and boosts of energy here or there.

While the bench minutes may be limited to 7 on a given night, I think those 7 will be chosen from 9 guys throughout the season. Cupps (6) will get minutes every night. The 7th player will come from either Walker, Gunn and Banks.....depending on match ups, foul trouble and who is playing well. 

[MoyeCowbell]

1 minute ago, tdhoosier said:

While the bench minutes may be limited to 7 on a given night, I think those 7 will be chosen from 9 guys throughout the season. Cupps (6) will get minutes every night. The 7th player will come from either Walker, Gunn and Banks.....depending on match ups, foul trouble and who is playing well. 

That's a very fair way of putting it.

[13th&Jackson]

1 hour ago, IU Scott said:

We are leading the conference so we could just get the automatic bid.  I am not going to bent out of shape in December about the tournament 

We would have to win the BTT for the auto bid, which would be great for the first time

[KoB2011]

2 hours ago, bluegrassIU said:

I get the concern. But we have like 75% of the season to play out.

We also don't have any bad losses, which somewhat balances out the no big wins part of the equation.

Just play well in conference and things should work out just fine. 

Play mediocre, we are screwed.

Play poorly, go ahead and put me in a straight jacket.

Two years ago we were one of the very last teams to make the field - what was the bad OOC loss that year?

 

[IUFLA]

23 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

I'm holding out hope, but I think the reality is that we haven't put ourselves in good shape to make the tournament. Is anybody who is putting up red flags now, with 75% of the season left to play, wrong to say we'll have to over-perform to make the tournament? 

Nobody can predict the future, but I'm just giving my honest assessment of where we sit right now. It doesn't mean that we can't make the tournament. It doesn't mean I'm needlessly freaking out. But we do have an uphill battle. This is not going to be a season when we can finish a game or 2 above .500 in conference play and squeak in. Based on the results/quality of wins, the B1G is just too weak this year. 

But is the Big Ten that down? Here are the current NET metrics for conferences...

 

[KoB2011]

41 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

Woodson won't shorten the bench to just Cupps and Walker. Both Gunn and Banks have to play -- now when and under what circumstances -- that's where it gets nuanced. I don't think this team is strong enough to go 7. It needs 8 or 9 for fatigue and boosts of energy here or there.

I agree that Woody probably won't shorten the rotation to 7, but I don't agree that he can't. 

[KoB2011]

3 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

But is the Big Ten that down? Here are the current NET metrics for conferences...

 

Here is our current team sheet. We have 1 Quad 1 or Quad 2 win total and we are 0-3 in OOC Quad 1 games.

Yes, this team could rack up some quality wins during the course of Big Ten play, everyone gets that. I think some of us are confused why it's a problem to point out that 1) we need to rack up more wins, because we didn't have a good non-conference slate and 2) this team needs to play better to get enough of those quality wins. 

I don't get why any of that is contentious? 

 

[KoB2011]

Currently our only remaining Quad 1 home games, where I think we all agree are our best chances to pick up Quad 1 wins, are Wisconsin and Purdue.

Quads can and will change in the coming months, but this team as it stands today is going to have to pick up some really tough road wins. 

[tdhoosier]

4 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

But is the Big Ten that down? Here are the current NET metrics for conferences...

 

I think that there's 4-5 teams that will give us favorable wins and fewer that can give us quad 1 wins at home. This, and also our NET is currently ranked 12th amongst B1G teams. Again, we will have to over-perform to make the tournament. Do you not agree with that statement? 

[IUFLA]

21 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

Here is our current team sheet. We have 1 Quad 1 or Quad 2 win total and we are 0-3 in OOC Quad 1 games.

Yes, this team could rack up some quality wins during the course of Big Ten play, everyone gets that. I think some of us are confused why it's a problem to point out that 1) we need to rack up more wins, because we didn't have a good non-conference slate and 2) this team needs to play better to get enough of those quality wins. 

I don't get why any of that is contentious? 

 

It's not... I keep hearing the Big 10 is "down" but apparently not THAT down... That's all I'm pointing out... 

13 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

I think that there's 4-5 teams that will give us favorable wins and fewer that can give us quad 1 wins at home. This, and also our NET is currently ranked 12th amongst B1G teams. Again, we will have to over-perform to make the tournament. Do you not agree with that statement? 

I guess... But I can give a more solid answer after our next 4 conference games...

At this point, I know Purdue, Illinois, and Wisconsin seem to be the best teams in our league, but I think we can beat all 3...

With a young team it's hard to gauge how they're going to handle the grind of the Big 10 season... Just ask Ohio State... 

[IU Scott]

I just don't understand why some fans can't just enjoy the ride instead vof only looking at the destination. Just enjoy every twist and turn the season provide and worry about the destination when you get there. I know it isn't easy to do but for me I want to enjoy the whole season because the season will be over before we know it.

[BGleas]

30 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I just don't understand why some fans can't just enjoy the ride instead vof only looking at the destination. Just enjoy every twist and turn the season provide and worry about the destination when you get there. I know it isn't easy to do but for me I want to enjoy the whole season because the season will be over before we know it.

Why do you assume people aren't enjoying these conversations? 

I know I've said it, @KoB2011 has said it, and I'm sure many others feel the same way, but while we'd all prefer IU to be an elite team competing for National Titles, many of us come to HSN because we love talking IU basketball. The great, the good, the bad, and the ugly. 

While again it's more fun when the team is winning big, but we enjoy talking and debating about what's going on, how it's working, the 'why' behind how the team is performing, the future prospects of the program, etc.,etc.

These conversations are part of the journey and the twists and turns of the season for many of us. 

[go_iu_bb]

11 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I just don't understand why some fans can't just enjoy the ride instead vof only looking at the destination. Just enjoy every twist and turn the season provide and worry about the destination when you get there. I know it isn't easy to do but for me I want to enjoy the whole season because the season will be over before we know it.

You're often critical of the discussions on message boards and the fan base in general. Why do you come to the boards? Think about that answer and then realize it might not be the same for everyone. Also remember that even most (I won't say all) of the critical posters want the same thing that you do: for IU to win lots of games as well as both conference and national championships.

[Kdug]

1 hour ago, KoB2011 said:

Two years ago we were one of the very last teams to make the field - what was the bad OOC loss that year?

 

That team went 9-11 in the big ten and finished with four Q1 wins, two of those coming in the BTT. They also had an incredibly weak non-con schedule. I don’t think we’ll be able to make it with that big ten record, but that just shows that you can get in with a mediocre resume.