IowaHoosierFan

That MR foul was on mbako doing nothing on defender there

CJ gunn keeping us in it

1 minute ago, HoosierDom said:

C'mon, tell me coach didn't read my post!

I was just thinking that

Just now, Hoosier987 said:

Mgbako is the one guy on this team you can’t lose next year. 

I am not sure he sticks around. I think it's 50/50

Coach knows what he is doing. He can't make the shots or play defense for them

We will cut this to single digits. Not sure there's is enough time though

3 minutes ago, Stlboiler23 said:

You realize it’s not some big conspiracy right? The folks that claim he’s getting preferential treatment in conference play  either don’t realize or forget that they didn’t lose in non-conference against one of the hardest schedules in the country. We can win ugly if we have to. 

He definitely should get more fouls called against him than he does.  And unfortunately he will come Tournament time.  Not saying he isn't good.  He has a soft touch, knows his spacing and can shoot well within 12 feet.  He just gets away with alot of contact (B1G ref'ing issues for sure) and he takes advantage of it.  He won't get that consideration down the stretch.

28 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

By the very same metrics you are defending, before today's games MSU's Quad 1 record was the same as IU and their Quad 2 record was worse.  So, I'm not sure where you are coming up with the idea that they have 'better' wins than us. 

This all comes down to them beating Directional U by 25 in November and us beating them by 9.  

That may be how it's designed, but that's not the way it should be.

You're right on they handled worst competition better than we did.  But its not about them beating us by 9. Its Uconn beating us by 20, Auburn by almost 30, Nebraska by by 16,  Purdue twice by 20+, Wisc by 12,  PSU by 14, Nebraska again by 20.  And we had 5 double digit wins all year. 

While MSU lost 3 games all year by double digits and won 14 games won by double digits.

There is a difference in how they and we played all year and its showing up in the NET.  Regardless of the Quad wins/losses.  Some years, you barely keep your head above water.

my last opinion on this.  Not saying its right, but every single coach knows how the NET works.  Win better, lose better = Better NET

50 minutes ago, BobSaccamanno said:

Agree.  He and Gunn are both Sophs out of Indy.  We picked the wrong one.  We do that a lot.

  As a program, our scouting of in-state talent hasn’t been good enough.  If our coaching staff doesn’t have the energy to do the work or the eye to identify talent, then hire a personnel department who can evaluate talent get out there.  You can’t just let Matt Glenesk list the top 5 players in the state and then recruit off his list because the Indy Star anointed a few guys.

 This isn’t just Woody although he inherited some of the prior staff too.  Gotta roll up the sleeves and find the Desmond Bane, Jake LaRavia, Craig Porter types who are all in the NBA from in-state schools yet we overlooked them.  It’s Braden Smith.  Matt Howard.  Bryant McIntosh.  We keep getting it wrong.  

Bob Knight figured out that he wanted Tom Coverdale and Brian Evans.  He went out of state to find a little known recruit named Kirk Haston. Our recent coaches wouldn’t have recruited any of these guys.  Overhaul player personnel.   

I would argue we haven't developed those players and or taylored the team to fit the players we have gotten.  We keep trying to take high level square pegs and pound them in round holes.  Good coaches adjust to the talent they have.  

We could also just be unlucky a little in who we have selected (talent evaluation).  But more so i think we just have had good talent developing coaches..  

Just now, John S said:

This Leal Gunn discussion is interesting.  Many on this site asked for more Leal minutes several times in early season.  I don’t want to get into the “athletic” label because some people use it with a bias toward physical traits imo.  But, Leal clearly should have been utilized more by cmw all season, because AL shows a high bball IQ  more than anyone on the team.    He quickly knows what to do, where to be, gets there and performs.  His fundamentals are top notch.  I like his energy, positivity, leadership and unlike XJ, MR, MM et al, rarely wastes time pounding his chest or engaging with refs.  His game-saving plays were not flukes, imo, but resulted from being in the right spot.  I will enjoy him again next year.  

I hope we have enough talent in front of him that we don't need to use him.  If not, we won't be much better.

25 minutes ago, btownqb said:

I think he just is a midmajor player, like most that Archie recruited, I am not trying to take digs at him, but there needs to be a level of honesty here. 

Bates HEAVILY outplayed Gunn during their first two years in college, as well. 

 

Agree.. never right kids off. I'd be fine with Banks coming back, playing the 4, NOT the 3. 

I think both Leal and Gunn are Midmajor players.  But i agree at this point, Leal brings more to the table for IU than Gunn does.  The fact that we're counting on Leal to bring first off the bench or even starter level minutes says alot about where our program is

21 minutes ago, Drroogh said:

Well that loss ought to improve MSU’s NET🤷‍♂️

Losing close to the #3 NET team by 5 points on a neutral court, probably doesn't hurt them at all.

1 minute ago, 94hoosier said:

you say mediocre teams

Wisky and MSU both top 25 net. 
Again winning close games is what good teams do and teams that get in the tournament.  We are clearly playing better D than a month ago

I didn't say we weren't playing better.  Go look at MSU and Wisc last 10 games and tell me what you think. Maryland, Minn and PSU are mediocre for sure though.  We're playing better, but we're also barely winning most of the time.  Keep barely winning and we'll hang a banner.  I will be happy with that.  

23 minutes ago, ephul said:

With that logic, we could pull any athlete off the football team, stick them on the basketball team and say the same thing about them and their ceiling.

This isn't true and you know it.  I bet Leal would run circle around them all day long.  Doesn't change Leal's ceiling.  Every player has one and everyone knows it.  Should Leal have gotten more playing time, for sure.  Coach decided not to.  Doesn't change that Leal is a borderline P6 D1 player.  I get he is a fairly local kid and plays with his heart and passion for IU, doesn't change his ceiling though.

43 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Teams evolve over the course of the year.  Putting so much weight on Margin of Victory in November while discounting a head to head matchup last week is stupid.

Sorry but you know it works.  Whether you like it or not.  The numbers don't lie.  5 games don't change the whole body of work.

33 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Teams evolve over the course of the year.  Putting so much weight on Margin of Victory in November while discounting a head to head matchup last week is stupid.

We're still barely winning most of our games and losing by larger margins when we lose.  It is our own fault.  We didn't do what we needed to do.  Winning 5 games at the end of the season against mediocre teams and doing so by mostly close games, is not going to change the over all metrics.  You can't pick and choose when you want to look at the body of work. 

We shouldn't have lost to PSU, Rutger, etc... throughout the year and we probably wouldn't be in this place.  Also those losses were by double digits.  I give this team credit where it due, we're winning game we should win NOW, we should have done that when we needed to win them THEN.  

Sucks to waste the season until the last 4 games and into the BTT.  Keep wining and we won't have to worry about it.

1 minute ago, btownqb said:

I would bet my house CJ Gunn doesn't out-perform Leal in practice. 

Coach know what he is doing.

Just now, IUJoe said:

There are a few on the team where I would believe it if someone said they didn't show up in practice.  Leal isn't one of them.

Obviously coach knows more than we do.  We're not in practice.  We're not coaching, just fans.  I leave the coaching to the coach.  He knows what he is doing, i am told

2 hours ago, 5fouls said:

You cant make this shiat up.

We have the same overall record as MSU

We have the same Quad 1 record as MSU.

We have a better Quad 2 record than MSU.

We own a head to head win over MSU.

We are 70 spots behind MSU in the NET.

You can complain and moan about this all you want.  They have more +15 point wins and less +15 point losses than we do compared to the wins/losses.  It's really not hard to figure out the metrics behind what the NET is doing.  Kill the 300+ team you play and don't get your ass handed to you very often by anyone else, then + wins enough to stay in the top 50 and you're pretty golden.  We had way too many mid/low single digit wins against shitty teams early and then gave up to many 15+ losses over the season.  We also win close alot of games.  How many low single digit games do we win by.  No one cares if you win by 1 if you're undefeated or close to it.  But a 18 to 20 win season, you can't win a majority of your games by single digits.  You're going to be considered mediocre.  

They have to use something to differentiate the team with similar Quad wins/losses.  What else are they going to look at?  Paint vs 3point scoring?  Rebounds? Efficiency maybe?

All this is coming from me, who knows nothing about anything, so take what i say and ignore it

3 hours ago, btownqb said:

After March-October, and then from what we've seen from Gunn, Banks, Cupps, no Newton, and an open scholly..  coupled with our horrible play early on... 

How in the world was it Dec 29th before Leal saw double digit mins? 

I going with he didn't show up in practice and Coach Woodson knows what he is doing?

in our hearts we're all full of hot air

Looks like Wisc stepped off the pedal and let Maryland have some dignity.  Only lost by 31 

1 minute ago, Seeking6 said:

This is the definition of a team and program who has quit. 5 players to leave. Someone might want to check in on DQ....losing by 40 to Wisconsin?

I won't be surprised if he asks out of his letter

Maryland is getting the holy living shite beat out of them by a sub par Wisconsin team.  Jeez

22 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Update. Kansas should be a 7 seed at best....maybe even 8.

They are 19th NET with a major injury,  I would say they end up around 6.  Going to get the benefit their history i would assume and get a better seeding.  An 8/9 would be awesome, win and straight to #1 next round