KoB2011 Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 23 minutes ago, IUFLA said: I'm not saying "just because it's always been done that way" I'm saying teams have employed its strategic value and pulled off unlikely wins... I guess the question becomes, should a team that has done what it takes for 38 or 39 minutes lose a game because of a gimmicky rule? They still have to hit free throws... Heck, we probably win last night if not for 1 and 1s 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 (edited) 5 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: I guess the question becomes, should a team that has done what it takes for 38 or 39 minutes lose a game because of a gimmicky rule? They still have to hit free throws... Heck, we probably win last night if not for 1 and 1s You're gonna have to clarify "gimmicky rule" for me... If your foul is out on the floor, and not in the act of shooting, why should you get 2 FTs? You have to earn the second one... Edited February 16, 2023 by IUFLA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 Just now, IUFLA said: You're gonna have to clarify "gimmicky rule" for me... If your fouls out on the floor, and not in the act of shooting, why should you get 2 FTs? You have to earn the second one... why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmax Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 First things first, we win that game going away if we had not gotten into our own heads in the first half. Completely sloppy and disjointed. But the league should really dump Larry Scirotto. I mean the things that he was fired for from the police department where he was chief are not insignificant. He is absolutely consistently terrible. Enough is enough. Get rid of him. You can not convince me that there are not better options out there. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrassIU Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 6 minutes ago, madmax said: First things first, we win that game going away if we had not gotten into our own heads in the first half. Completely sloppy and disjointed. But the league should really dump Larry Scirotto. I mean the things that he was fired for from the police department where he was chief are not insignificant. He is absolutely consistently terrible. Enough is enough. Get rid of him. You can not convince me that there are not better options out there. Preach! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 2 minutes ago, btownqb said: why? You weren't trying to score...Many times, you're simply burning clock... One of the reasons Valvano employed the strategy pre shot clock was because teams (notably UNC) would play keep away rather than basketball... Even with the shot clock coaches identify poor FT shooters and utilized it to stop the clock, and hopefully get the ball back without giving up any points in the process... While I agree that sticking with something "because it's always been done that way" is dumb, I'll counter with making changes simply for the sake of change is dumber... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 1 hour ago, btownqb said: They don't make sense. I guess what I don't understand is what is hard to understand about the 1-1. It has been in place every since I have been alive and has worked great for many years. I have watched more of the women's game this year and can't tell any difference between quarters or halves. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 7 minutes ago, IUFLA said: You weren't trying to score...Many times, you're simply burning clock... One of the reasons Valvano employed the strategy pre shot clock was because teams (notably UNC) would play keep away rather than basketball... Even with the shot clock coaches identify poor FT shooters and utilized it to stop the clock, and hopefully get the ball back without giving up any points in the process... While I agree that sticking with something "because it's always been done that way" is dumb, I'll counter with making changes simply for the sake of change is dumber... You can still pray and do that, as an opposing team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 8 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I guess what I don't understand is what is hard to understand about the 1-1. It has been in place every since I have been alive and has worked great for many years. I have watched more of the women's game this year and can't tell any difference between quarters or halves. I think I understand everything there is to know about a 1-1. I don't see that it has "worked great for many years". And idk what to tell you about not seeing the difference between a bball game with quarters vs. one with halves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kdug Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 15 minutes ago, ledies22 said: not the case. go back and listen. I just listened to it again, but i am not a stenographer. I mean all of this is speculation and none of it is facts unless you hear from the officials directly. media: "Ummmm yah officials. Why do you guys treat Woody and IU differently" Officials: "Cuz we hate them. Woody is an arrogant former NBA coach." your two paragraphs are a little contradictory. you dont buy that woody doesnt have the relationship and might be a little arrogant with the officials, and dont know how to treat them yet? But you mention 3 others that are complete hot heads that get away with a lot more. "there are people that are very close to the team that FEEL the same way..... needs to change his approach with officials." I'll have to listen to it again, I was just going off what I remembered from that episode. Also, what I said was not contradictory whatsoever. I didn't mention anything about the relationships, was commenting on Woody being arrogant as the reason, and pointing out several other coaches who come off as very arrogant but still get away with a lot. That being said, I also don't buy not having existing relationships as being a legit reason either. If that's the case, Juwan Howard and Michigan would be having the same issue. As far as I'm aware, they haven't. When he gets T'd up, it's for something like threatening to kill the opposing coach, which seems like a valid reason for a T and ejection. I honestly think it just comes down to the refs not being good at their jobs, and applying rules/calls/techs incredibly inconsistently. Just so happens we've been on the wrong side of it more often than not this year. I don't recall having the same issue last year, so hopefully it evens out in the long run. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 4 minutes ago, btownqb said: You can still pray and do that, as an opposing team. Yes, but you're basically rewarding a team that is simply trying to burn clock with a lead... 1-1 makes it a bit more dicey... And, to be honest, the rule is structured to stymie over use by granting 2 FTs after foul #10... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 7 minutes ago, btownqb said: When has it "worked great"? 1983... One of the most exciting tournaments I can remember... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 Eliminating the 1:1 would remove an important variable in determining the outcome of the game. Not sure why we would want to make the game more formulistic and less exciting. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 (edited) 4 minutes ago, IUFLA said: Yes, but you're basically rewarding a team that is simply trying to burn clock with a lead... 1-1 makes it a bit more dicey... And, to be honest, the rule is structured to stymie over use by granting 2 FTs after foul #10... Still.. makes no sense to me. You can't burn clock with a 30 sec shot clock, that's one of the benefits. You commit 7 fouls, I guess that is the amount we have came up with?... The other team should shoot FTs. Edited February 16, 2023 by btownqb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 1 minute ago, 5fouls said: Eliminating the 1:1 would remove an important variable in determining the outcome of the game. Not sure why we would want to make the game more formulistic and less exciting. How is it important at all? Seems entirely unnecessary. It would be more exciting for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 2 minutes ago, 5fouls said: Eliminating the 1:1 would remove an important variable in determining the outcome of the game. Not sure why we would want to make the game more formulistic and less exciting. How about this, the team that was fouled has the choice to "decline" the free throws and take the ball out of bounds. Like, why should I lose a game because my team played better but the other team essentially intentionally fouled my worst free throw shooter? Give me the option to take the 1:1 or take it out of bounds. If you foul Steve Alford, I'm taking the points, if you foul De'Ron Davis I'm taking it out of bounds. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 This thread is completely derailed. You guys want to talk about 1 and 1s.... tag me in another thread. Sorry to all. I should have known the possibility of trying something different wasn't going to go over well with a few. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SawatchHoosier Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 Just now, BGleas said: Give me the option to take the 1:1 or take it out of bounds. If you foul Steve Alford, I'm taking the points, if you foul De'Ron Davis I'm taking it out of bounds. But what if you have Devonte Green hmmmmmmmmmmmmm? Bet you didn't think of that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 1 minute ago, SawatchHoosier said: But what if you have Devonte Green hmmmmmmmmmmmmm? Bet you didn't think of that? Am I at home or on the road? 🤣 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SawatchHoosier Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 Just now, btownqb said: This thread is completely derailed. You guys want to talk about 1 and 1s.... tag me in another thread. Sorry to all. I should have known the possibility of trying something different wasn't going to go over well with a few. Indiana MBB Post Game thread where ... 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 37 minutes ago, IUFLA said: You're gonna have to clarify "gimmicky rule" for me... If your foul is out on the floor, and not in the act of shooting, why should you get 2 FTs? You have to earn the second one... That is why they call it the bonus 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 9 minutes ago, btownqb said: How is it important at all? Seems entirely unnecessary. It would be more exciting for me. It is more exciting at the end if the game when you are down 1 and the team is shooting a 1-1. That puts way more pressure on the shooter to hit the first shot. If you have two or just makes for less suspense. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxnJxn Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 5 minutes ago, btownqb said: This thread is completely derailed. You guys want to talk about 1 and 1s.... tag me in another thread. Sorry to all. I should have known the possibility of trying something different wasn't going to go over well with a few. I mean, it's a natural conversation, you've all made good points on both sides, and can't speak for others but I've enjoyed reading the responses and discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 43 minutes ago, IUFLA said: You're gonna have to clarify "gimmicky rule" for me... If your foul is out on the floor, and not in the act of shooting, why should you get 2 FTs? You have to earn the second one... Why would you punish a team for simply getting fouled? The point is to punish the defense for fouling too much, not to punish the offense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted February 16, 2023 Report Share Posted February 16, 2023 1 minute ago, IU Scott said: It is more exciting at the end if the game when you are down 1 and the team is shooting a 1-1. That puts way more pressure on the shooter to hit the first shot. If you have two or just makes for less suspense. Then we should also adopt the NBA's 4th quarter advance the back rule. It would make the game way more exciting as well and it puts more pressure on the defense late in the game adding suspense. How much more exciting would last nights ending have been if IU could call timeout and have a SLOB with 4 seconds left where we could have got a real shot off? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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