FW_Hoosier Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Hoosierhoopster said: We’ll see. If you read what CAM is saying he’s not saying he wants to run a big team. You can’t get out and run in transition D with that group — which is exactly what CAM is saying he wants to do. If we go back to a traditional front line team we’ll get steam rolled in the B1G and it’s actually contrary to what CAM has been saying. One thing I really like is how well he has adjusted to who is healthy and available. Brunk is a solid big. He is not quick, however, he does not run well in tradition, the team out of the gate often moved slowly on offense, and he doesn’t rotate quickly on D. We’ll see Brunk absolutely should not be starting when we get into the meat of the schedule. He’s a good veteran body to have, but he’s going to get sonned when we move into Big Ten play. @5fouls had both Brunk and Thompson getting 20 mpg, but I think they both end up closer to 15. Brunk’s not quick or physical enough, and Race is pretty limited offensively. They’ll both be key parts of the rotation, but we need to ride TJD and Smith in the front court. Those two, along with Phinisee, Durham, Green, and hopefully Hunter eventually all need to be getting more minutes than Race and Brunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 3 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said: Brunk absolutely should not be starting when we get into the meat of the schedule. He’s a good veteran body to have, but he’s going to get sonned when we move into Big Ten play. @5fouls had both Brunk and Thompson getting 20 mpg, but I think they both end up closer to 15. Brunk’s not quick or physical enough, and Race is pretty limited offensively. They’ll both be key parts of the rotation, but we need to ride TJD and Smith in the front court. Phinisee, Durham, Green, and hopefully Hunter eventually all need to be getting more minutes than Race and Brunk. Small sample size for sure, but Race has IU's top offensive rating to this point (not counting Cooper Bybee) https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2020.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FW_Hoosier Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 8 minutes ago, 5fouls said: Small sample size for sure, but Race has IU's top offensive rating to this point (not counting Cooper Bybee) https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2020.html Yeah, I’d say that’s one of those stats that is easily contradicted by the eye test, especially this early in the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrassIU Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 2 hours ago, Hoosierhoopster said: I'm going to ridicule you anyway. 😁 Isn't that the real reason we all come here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrassIU Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 9 minutes ago, 5fouls said: Small sample size for sure, but Race has IU's top offensive rating to this point (not counting Cooper Bybee) https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana/2020.html I ridicule this post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 20 hours ago, Hoosierhoopster said: Fouls man you're missing the point. This isn't traditional 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 spots, it's a 3-forward lineup. Playing him in a three-forward lineup does not make him a "3", he's not playing as a "3", he's playing as a mobile rolling forward. Why is it so important to you to call him a 3? I mean besides that he's not playing as a 3, does it matter? In fairness, I'm going to direct that question back to me, I guess it doesn't matter what you want to call him, he's playing well -- from my perspective (and Gleas's for what it's worth) he's just not a 3 and calling him that is misleading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reacher Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 13 hours ago, Drroogh said: My only disagreement, is that based on the body of work last year and this year, Rob is still our best point! Let's just hope he gets completely and stays healthy this year regardless of whether he starts or not! Agree with you about last year. This year, Green and Durham appear to have improved their games. I love Rob and his defense. Right now, Robs O isn't quite there. Hopefully it will be in another few games. That leaves assists. Watching Green, I saw him creating for others more than Rob does. I think our 3 guards are now pretty even in many respects. All good defensively. Green has an edge as a scorer and ability to create his own shot- and for others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 13 hours ago, FW_Hoosier said: Brunk absolutely should not be starting when we get into the meat of the schedule. He’s a good veteran body to have, but he’s going to get sonned when we move into Big Ten play. @5fouls had both Brunk and Thompson getting 20 mpg, but I think they both end up closer to 15. Brunk’s not quick or physical enough, and Race is pretty limited offensively. They’ll both be key parts of the rotation, but we need to ride TJD and Smith in the front court. Those two, along with Phinisee, Durham, Green, and hopefully Hunter eventually all need to be getting more minutes than Race and Brunk. Brunk And Davis will play a role. The main one being, keep TJD on the floor as long as possible. So them guarding the biggest of B1G bigs is what it is. 2nd half and late game situations will all be situational based on matchup and foul situation, whether we need defense or offense. I could see Davis and Brunk minutes going down in conference with TJD going up but it won't be a by a huge margin. When the games get tighter the best players will be on the floor longer. Race just seems like a dirty work horse winner. Hard to keep them guys off the floor. Then we have the, should we play 3 forwards since we will get lectured about calling Smith a 3 debate. Hard to say because we have yet to have all four guards 100% healthy and playing in the same game. Current minute avgs through 5. Brunk 19 TJD 24.2 Davis 10.5 Race 17.2 Smith 26.2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reacher Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 1 hour ago, NotIThatLives said: Brunk And Davis will play a role. The main one being, keep TJD on the floor as long as possible. So them guarding the biggest of B1G bigs is what it is. 2nd half and late game situations will all be situational based on matchup and foul situation, whether we need defense or offense. I could see Davis and Brunk minutes going down in conference with TJD going up but it won't be a by a huge margin. When the games get tighter the best players will be on the floor longer. Race just seems like a dirty work horse winner. Hard to keep them guys off the floor. Then we have the, should we play 3 forwards since we will get lectured about calling Smith a 3 debate. Hard to say because we have yet to have all four guards 100% healthy and playing in the same game. Current minute avgs through 5. Brunk 19 TJD 24.2 Davis 10.5 Race 17.2 Smith 26.2 Well said. No way do we not start our best post defender and let TJD get some freshman calls against him in the post and send him to the bench early. I like the Brunk - TJD / Davis - Thompson platoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13th&Jackson Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Reacher said: Well said. No way do we not start our best post defender and let TJD get some freshman calls against him in the post and send him to the bench early. I like the Brunk - TJD / Davis - Thompson platoon Brunk is just so smart and fundamentally sound. Shon Morris was raving about him in the Princeton game. I think Archie trusts him as much as anyone on the roster. He will be on the floor when it matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FKIM01 Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 ...and yet, he was almost a cast-off at Butler. Nice call, coach! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 On 11/21/2019 at 10:21 AM, IUFLA said: That's true, but I think that's more a product of Rob not playing many minutes, and Devonte being a better point guard than Al. devonte is also better than rob, although i think rob is very good too. when we start playing real teams we will know more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 On 11/21/2019 at 1:00 PM, IUFLA said: I think it's just a convenient way to describe a position and the responsibilities of that position within the offense, along with the player attributes, both physically and skill-set wise. People with a far better grip on the intricacies of basketball than I have argue that Justin's skill-set doesn't match the requisite skill-set for a 3 in most offenses. slashing, rebounding, and now for your extra value entertainment, outside shooting! what "requisite skill set" is missing? justin producing early in the season at the 3 spot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 18 hours ago, Drroogh said: My only disagreement, is that based on the body of work last year and this year, Rob is still our best point! Let's just hope he gets completely and stays healthy this year regardless of whether he starts or not! the definition of a point guard is the guy who can handle the ball against pressure, has the best court vision, and the ability to create opportunities for his teammates to score with deft passing. the player who does that best for iu is green, without a doubt. phinisee is also a very good point guard, just not quite as good as green. we will frequently see them playing together. nothing wrong with two point guards on the floor together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 17 hours ago, FW_Hoosier said: Brunk absolutely should not be starting when we get into the meat of the schedule. He’s a good veteran body to have, but he’s going to get sonned when we move into Big Ten play. @5fouls had both Brunk and Thompson getting 20 mpg, but I think they both end up closer to 15. Brunk’s not quick or physical enough, and Race is pretty limited offensively. They’ll both be key parts of the rotation, but we need to ride TJD and Smith in the front court. Those two, along with Phinisee, Durham, Green, and hopefully Hunter eventually all need to be getting more minutes than Race and Brunk. i agree with your assessment of brunk's lack of athleticism. that will show up in big ten play. he will still contribute. i think thompson will improve as the season wears on. i'm not so sure i agree about his limited offense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 1 hour ago, coachv said: the definition of a point guard is the guy who can handle the ball against pressure, has the best court vision, and the ability to create opportunities for his teammates to score with deft passing. the player who does that best for iu is green, without a doubt. phinisee is also a very good point guard, just not quite as good as green. we will frequently see them playing together. nothing wrong with two point guards on the floor together Im with you on Green in the half court. In the half court Green is slick city. Full court he can get the job done but with a little more high risk and maybe struggling to get out of aolid double teams. Rob in the full court may be a tick more protective of the ball. It's a good problem have and shows Lander how nice it will be to play alongside Rob, as a senior. Dude is only a sophomore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FW_Hoosier Posted November 22, 2019 Report Share Posted November 22, 2019 8 hours ago, NotIThatLives said: Brunk And Davis will play a role. The main one being, keep TJD on the floor as long as possible. So them guarding the biggest of B1G bigs is what it is. 2nd half and late game situations will all be situational based on matchup and foul situation, whether we need defense or offense. I could see Davis and Brunk minutes going down in conference with TJD going up but it won't be a by a huge margin. When the games get tighter the best players will be on the floor longer. Race just seems like a dirty work horse winner. Hard to keep them guys off the floor. Then we have the, should we play 3 forwards since we will get lectured about calling Smith a 3 debate. Hard to say because we have yet to have all four guards 100% healthy and playing in the same game. Current minute avgs through 5. Brunk 19 TJD 24.2 Davis 10.5 Race 17.2 Smith 26.2 Agree with a lot of what you’re saying here. I’m just not sold on Brunk. I’ve got a good buddy that’s a Butler fan, and he said Brunk looked equally great against cupcake competition last year, but just wasn’t nearly as effective once the athleticism of the competition ramped up. Like I said, he’ll definitely play a valuable role on this team, but I just don’t see him getting a ton of minutes once conference play starts. Hopefully I’m wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steubenhoosier Posted November 23, 2019 Report Share Posted November 23, 2019 1 hour ago, FW_Hoosier said: Agree with a lot of what you’re saying here. I’m just not sold on Brunk. I’ve got a good buddy that’s a Butler fan, and he said Brunk looked equally great against cupcake competition last year, but just wasn’t nearly as effective once the athleticism of the competition ramped up. Like I said, he’ll definitely play a valuable role on this team, but I just don’t see him getting a ton of minutes once conference play starts. Hopefully I’m wrong. Or, you could let Brunk prove you either right or wrong here in Bloomington. The past is the past. Give the kid a chance and let him prove you wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted November 26, 2019 Report Share Posted November 26, 2019 On 11/22/2019 at 4:42 PM, FW_Hoosier said: Agree with a lot of what you’re saying here. I’m just not sold on Brunk. I’ve got a good buddy that’s a Butler fan, and he said Brunk looked equally great against cupcake competition last year, but just wasn’t nearly as effective once the athleticism of the competition ramped up. Like I said, he’ll definitely play a valuable role on this team, but I just don’t see him getting a ton of minutes once conference play starts. Hopefully I’m wrong. I agree - we are playing bigger than we probably will in conference play right now by force. When/if Phinisee and Hunter get to playing solid and 100% I think we'll see a lot more lineups with Smith at the 4 and TJD at the 5. Race, Brunk and Davis will eat up the remaining minutes there, and you really can go with who is playing best of those three in a given game to determine that. Durham, Franklin, Green, Hunter, Phinisee and Anderson will get the bulk/all the time 1-3 once we are full strength IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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