13th&Jackson Posted January 29 Report Share Posted January 29 4 minutes ago, HoosierDPU95 said: Who knows what was said to them but you have to think that guards looking at our roster (from a distance) and seeing two senior guards slotted in the starting lineup probably questioned how much they would start/play. IDK. XJ was coming off a season ending injury and Gallo had only been a starter due to injury. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted January 29 Report Share Posted January 29 7 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said: IDK. XJ was coming off a season ending injury and Gallo had only been a starter due to injury. Yeah, I think we could have had Caleb Love. I wouldn’t think a good guard would be too worried about minutes if we looked like a roster that wanted to play 4 out, but again, we took Ware and it made it pretty clear we weren’t going to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted January 29 Report Share Posted January 29 https://www.thedailyhoosier.com/indianas-unsteady-play-highlights-recruiting-missteps-strategy-in-need-of-recalibration/ Pretty much what has been said on here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13th&Jackson Posted January 29 Report Share Posted January 29 13 minutes ago, IU Scott said: https://www.thedailyhoosier.com/indianas-unsteady-play-highlights-recruiting-missteps-strategy-in-need-of-recalibration/ Pretty much what has been said on here. https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/college/indiana/2023/09/29/indiana-basketball-iu-recruiting-mike-woodson-big-2024-swings-liam-mcneeley-boogie-fland-derik-queen/70980052007/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted January 29 Report Share Posted January 29 26 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said: https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/college/indiana/2023/09/29/indiana-basketball-iu-recruiting-mike-woodson-big-2024-swings-liam-mcneeley-boogie-fland-derik-queen/70980052007/ I can't read this because it is a pay site Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13th&Jackson Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 28 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I can't read this because it is a pay site Sorry, it opened for me but now I can’t access it either. It talked about how CMW’s assistants advised him against swinging for top ranked recruits, but to work up the ladder. He wouldn’t accept that they had to wait because IU was still a destination program and he didn’t want to wait. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 10 hours ago, 13th&Jackson said: Sorry, it opened for me but now I can’t access it either. It talked about how CMW’s assistants advised him against swinging for top ranked recruits, but to work up the ladder. He wouldn’t accept that they had to wait because IU was still a destination program and he didn’t want to wait. very torn on my feelings about that. i want top talent, but i want the right mix. i'm not going to complain about him bringing in top talent. i don't think we're going to be better if Woodson gets lower rated recruits with the idea that he'll get them playing great basketball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13th&Jackson Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 1 hour ago, NCHoosier32 said: very torn on my feelings about that. i want top talent, but i want the right mix. i'm not going to complain about him bringing in top talent. i don't think we're going to be better if Woodson gets lower rated recruits with the idea that he'll get them playing great basketball. No complaints, just his philosophy. The article noted that he likes to work with players to get to the NBA. Makes sense as a selling point for him. We needed to upgrade talent and he’s done that. I think it’s also a recognition that as CMW said, his window is closing and he wants to win now. Will it build a foundation for continuity and success? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 2 hours ago, NCHoosier32 said: very torn on my feelings about that. i want top talent, but i want the right mix. i'm not going to complain about him bringing in top talent. i don't think we're going to be better if Woodson gets lower rated recruits with the idea that he'll get them playing great basketball. Maybe take the Cignetti approach. Who cares what they are rated. Get guys in the portal that play during the crucial minutes in a game and demonstrate the ability to execute the role you need to fill. If those guys are ranked high, great. If those guys aren’t ranked high, but you believe in them, also great. But I think the challenge for any staff is being confident enough in your system to clearly define the roles that need to be filled, and then identifying those guys to fill them. Purdue and Wisconsin know what they need, it’s why they have been successful. I think Woody is still trying to figure out his system and the personnel he needs to make it work. It looks to me like there has been a lot of trial and error going on these last 2.5 years. This is not so much a criticism of CMW, but an example of an inexperienced college coach trying to figure out what schemes work in CBB and the caliber of athlete he needs in terms of athleticism, fundamentals, basketball IQ, etc. Thus, he’s not only trying to figure out which pegs fit in the holes, he’s still trying to figure out what shape the holes need to be. Our issues are two-fold when it comes to personnel. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 1 minute ago, tdhoosier said: Maybe take the Cignetti approach. Who cares what they are rated. Get guys in the portal that play during the crucial minutes in a game and demonstrate the ability to execute the role you need to fill. If those guys are ranked high, great. If those guys aren’t ranked high, but you believe in them, also great. But I think the challenge for any staff is being confident enough in your system to clearly define the roles that need to be filled, and then identifying those guys to fill them. Purdue and Wisconsin know what they need, it’s why they have been successful. I think Woody is still trying to figure out his system and the personnel he needs to make it work. It looks to me like there has been a lot of trial and error going on these last 2.5 years. This is not so much a criticism of CMW, but an example of an inexperienced college coach trying to figure out what schemes work in CBB and the caliber of athlete he needs in terms of athleticism, fundamentals, basketball IQ, etc. Thus, he’s not only trying to figure out which pegs fit in the holes, he’s still trying to figure out what shape the holes need to be. Our issues are two-fold when it comes to personnel. really really like and agree with this post. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 20 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: Maybe take the Cignetti approach. Who cares what they are rated. Get guys in the portal that play during the crucial minutes in a game and demonstrate the ability to execute the role you need to fill. If those guys are ranked high, great. If those guys aren’t ranked high, but you believe in them, also great. But I think the challenge for any staff is being confident enough in your system to clearly define the roles that need to be filled, and then identifying those guys to fill them. Purdue and Wisconsin know what they need, it’s why they have been successful. I think Woody is still trying to figure out his system and the personnel he needs to make it work. It looks to me like there has been a lot of trial and error going on these last 2.5 years. This is not so much a criticism of CMW, but an example of an inexperienced college coach trying to figure out what schemes work in CBB and the caliber of athlete he needs in terms of athleticism, fundamentals, basketball IQ, etc. Thus, he’s not only trying to figure out which pegs fit in the holes, he’s still trying to figure out what shape the holes need to be. Our issues are two-fold when it comes to personnel. Great post! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrassIU Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 31 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: Maybe take the Cignetti approach. Who cares what they are rated. Get guys in the portal that play during the crucial minutes in a game and demonstrate the ability to execute the role you need to fill. If those guys are ranked high, great. If those guys aren’t ranked high, but you believe in them, also great. But I think the challenge for any staff is being confident enough in your system to clearly define the roles that need to be filled, and then identifying those guys to fill them. Purdue and Wisconsin know what they need, it’s why they have been successful. I think Woody is still trying to figure out his system and the personnel he needs to make it work. It looks to me like there has been a lot of trial and error going on these last 2.5 years. This is not so much a criticism of CMW, but an example of an inexperienced college coach trying to figure out what schemes work in CBB and the caliber of athlete he needs in terms of athleticism, fundamentals, basketball IQ, etc. Thus, he’s not only trying to figure out which pegs fit in the holes, he’s still trying to figure out what shape the holes need to be. Our issues are two-fold when it comes to personnel. This is a ludicrous post with no merit. (Sorry, couldn't let all the praise go to your head) This sucks!! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 28 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: Maybe take the Cignetti approach. Who cares what they are rated. Get guys in the portal that play during the crucial minutes in a game and demonstrate the ability to execute the role you need to fill. If those guys are ranked high, great. If those guys aren’t ranked high, but you believe in them, also great. But I think the challenge for any staff is being confident enough in your system to clearly define the roles that need to be filled, and then identifying those guys to fill them. Purdue and Wisconsin know what they need, it’s why they have been successful. I think Woody is still trying to figure out his system and the personnel he needs to make it work. It looks to me like there has been a lot of trial and error going on these last 2.5 years. This is not so much a criticism of CMW, but an example of an inexperienced college coach trying to figure out what schemes work in CBB and the caliber of athlete he needs in terms of athleticism, fundamentals, basketball IQ, etc. Thus, he’s not only trying to figure out which pegs fit in the holes, he’s still trying to figure out what shape the holes need to be. Our issues are two-fold when it comes to personnel. Watched Houston out tough Texas at Texas in ot last night. I'd say Houston has everything they need to make a final four or better run. Top three scorers are guards. Their 'big' guys are like modern NBA dudes. Just strong atheltic guys, didn't see one attempt of back to basket stuff. I looked up their recruiting rankings over the last 4 years. One 5 star. Hit the transfer portal very nicely 2 and 3 years ago being rated 3rd and 4th transfer classes. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13th&Jackson Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 41 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: Maybe take the Cignetti approach. Who cares what they are rated. Get guys in the portal that play during the crucial minutes in a game and demonstrate the ability to execute the role you need to fill. If those guys are ranked high, great. If those guys aren’t ranked high, but you believe in them, also great. But I think the challenge for any staff is being confident enough in your system to clearly define the roles that need to be filled, and then identifying those guys to fill them. Purdue and Wisconsin know what they need, it’s why they have been successful. I think Woody is still trying to figure out his system and the personnel he needs to make it work. It looks to me like there has been a lot of trial and error going on these last 2.5 years. This is not so much a criticism of CMW, but an example of an inexperienced college coach trying to figure out what schemes work in CBB and the caliber of athlete he needs in terms of athleticism, fundamentals, basketball IQ, etc. Thus, he’s not only trying to figure out which pegs fit in the holes, he’s still trying to figure out what shape the holes need to be. Our issues are two-fold when it comes to personnel. Posted this previously, but it's worth repeating. This is Youngstown State's approach to bringing in 7 transfers: “It’s very similar to last year,” YSU coach Jerrod Calhoun said. “We had some specific needs. Obviously this year was a little bigger class. The biggest thing I looked for in the portal was for guys that have won. We certainly have done that. … We’ve got a lot of guys that are used to winning. We wanted to get old, and we’ve got one of the oldest rosters in college basketball.” 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 26 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: Maybe take the Cignetti approach. Who cares what they are rated. Get guys in the portal that play during the crucial minutes in a game and demonstrate the ability to execute the role you need to fill. If those guys are ranked high, great. If those guys aren’t ranked high, but you believe in them, also great. But I think the challenge for any staff is being confident enough in your system to clearly define the roles that need to be filled, and then identifying those guys to fill them. Purdue and Wisconsin know what they need, it’s why they have been successful. I think Woody is still trying to figure out his system and the personnel he needs to make it work. It looks to me like there has been a lot of trial and error going on these last 2.5 years. This is not so much a criticism of CMW, but an example of an inexperienced college coach trying to figure out what schemes work in CBB and the caliber of athlete he needs in terms of athleticism, fundamentals, basketball IQ, etc. Thus, he’s not only trying to figure out which pegs fit in the holes, he’s still trying to figure out what shape the holes need to be. Our issues are two-fold when it comes to personnel. What's frustrating... Brooks Barnhizer, Nijel Pack, Jake Laravia, and Desmond Bane all fit that "Cignetti approach"... but weren't 247/Rivals/ESPN darlings, so they aren't even mentioned... Those 4 fit EVERY college team. And holy cow-- 3 of those were crazy productive HS players, I am unsure of Bane and what his #s were in HS. Desmond Bane 2016-- we take Curtis Jones, Devonte Green... Jake Laravia 2019-- we took TJD, Franklin only-- why wasn't Laravia paired with TJD instead of Race!?!?! Nijel Pack 2020-- we took Leal, Lander--- should have been taking Pack+Tony Perkins... Barnhizer 2021-- coaching change during this one, but just an example. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ That is shit I don't understand. Recruiting services seem to do a decent job on the Top 40-45 kids. I think they identify those pretty well, and those guys usually, at least, become rotational pieces. Outside of that top core, I don't think these services have any clue who should be ranked 60th compared to 360th.... We should stop putting stock into as fans. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In regards to Woodson, we dropped the ball on not recruiting Jack Benter anymore than we did, BUT... not convinced he would have given Indiana a look anyway. Don't lose Sisley, Mullins because we are chasing something out of state. 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 3 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said: Posted this previously, but it's worth repeating. This is Youngstown State's approach to bringing in 7 transfers: “It’s very similar to last year,” YSU coach Jerrod Calhoun said. “We had some specific needs. Obviously this year was a little bigger class. The biggest thing I looked for in the portal was for guys that have won. We certainly have done that. … We’ve got a lot of guys that are used to winning. We wanted to get old, and we’ve got one of the oldest rosters in college basketball.” Galloway fits that, Malik fits that, Cupps fits that, McNeely fits that----- get MM to continue to buy in, two portal guards... there is a path for us to be just fine next season, gunna take some work, though. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steubenhoosier Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 49 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: Maybe take the Cignetti approach. Who cares what they are rated. Get guys in the portal that play during the crucial minutes in a game and demonstrate the ability to execute the role you need to fill. If those guys are ranked high, great. If those guys aren’t ranked high, but you believe in them, also great. But I think the challenge for any staff is being confident enough in your system to clearly define the roles that need to be filled, and then identifying those guys to fill them. Purdue and Wisconsin know what they need, it’s why they have been successful. I think Woody is still trying to figure out his system and the personnel he needs to make it work. It looks to me like there has been a lot of trial and error going on these last 2.5 years. This is not so much a criticism of CMW, but an example of an inexperienced college coach trying to figure out what schemes work in CBB and the caliber of athlete he needs in terms of athleticism, fundamentals, basketball IQ, etc. Thus, he’s not only trying to figure out which pegs fit in the holes, he’s still trying to figure out what shape the holes need to be. Our issues are two-fold when it comes to personnel. Agree with everything you say here.... Of course, Purdue and Wisconsin have coaches who have been in their positions considerably longer than 2 1/2 years to develop their cultures and know what kind of players fit 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
13th&Jackson Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 16 minutes ago, btownqb said: Galloway fits that, Malik fits that, Cupps fits that, McNeely fits that----- get MM to continue to buy in, two portal guards... there is a path for us to be just fine next season, gunna take some work, though. He was referring to guys who had played and won at the collegiate level. Five senior, two junior and one sophomore transfer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 6 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said: He was referring to guys who had played and won at the collegiate level. Five senior, two junior and one sophomore transfer. Winning is winning. You don't just forget how to do it. Malik, McNeely, Galloway, Cupps. Buuuuuut--- just make sure your two portal guard additions are about the exact opposite of XJ, in many ways, and fit the mold of the Ytown St coach and we're fine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 Seth Greenberg was on a local radio show yesterday and was talking about IU and Woodson. He feels these NBA guys who go to college coaching just don't understand the time commitment that comes with coaching in college. Just saying that the college game is so different and the maturity of the college players are do different. He also think that the college coaches who tries the NBA struggles not understanding the pro game 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierDPU95 Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 5 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Seth Greenberg was on a local radio show yesterday and was talking about IU and Woodson. He feels these NBA guys who go to college coaching just don't understand the time commitment that comes with coaching in college. Just saying that the college game is so different and the maturity of the college players are do different. He also think that the college coaches who tries the NBA struggles not understanding the pro game Which is why I feel like the answer here is for Woodson to hire an assistant head coach (from the college ranks) who would/could eventually take over. No, Fife was not that guy. He may have thought he was but clearly Woody wasn't aligned with that plan. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 48 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said: Of course, Purdue and Wisconsin have coaches who have been in their positions considerably longer than 2 1/2 years to develop their cultures But even then they have down years... Look at Wisconsin last year... Get an AJ Storr, a healthy Tyler Wahl, and tell Chuckie Hepburn he doesn't have to score, just run the team, and they're back... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btownqb Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 20 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Seth Greenberg was on a local radio show yesterday and was talking about IU and Woodson. He feels these NBA guys who go to college coaching just don't understand the time commitment that comes with coaching in college. Just saying that the college game is so different and the maturity of the college players are do different. He also think that the college coaches who tries the NBA struggles not understanding the pro game Soooo... he's guessing. 🤷♂️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 Not offering any of my own comments, but here is a good number of stats for IU, MSU, and Wisconsin dating back to Gards first year. You can all draw your own conclusions about the programs, down years, up years, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluegrassIU Posted January 30 Report Share Posted January 30 3 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: Not offering any of my own comments, but here is a good number of stats for IU, MSU, and Wisconsin dating back to Gards first year. You can all draw your own conclusions about the programs, down years, up years, etc. That looks like.my filled out lottery tickets I am about to take into this here convenience store. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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