Stories That Make You Shake Your Head At The World

[HoosierFaithful]

I gotta go to work but if we love our children as much as we say we do, we all need to have as few red lines as possible (while still understanding that people’s strongly held beliefs are valid) in addressing this issue that we, as the most powerful country in the history of the world, uniquely cannot seem to figure out. 
 

not trying to make this political. Trying to make my statements broadly agreeable and middle of the road.  This entire issue just vexes me. 

[rico]

4 minutes ago, HoosierFaithful said:

I don't know, man, but I think folks setting aside their deeply entrenched beliefs (me included) has to be a part of the solution because we're the only country where this happens and, guess what:

Did you know the leading cause of death in children? It's guns.  We're the only place where that's so striking.

Maybe we should just do away with schools?  The kids stay at home all day and get educated online.  Now there is a solution.  Or maybe the schools need better security measures?  Make the schools like a prison.  Have razor wire all the way around them and put the Army in charge of security?

[HoosierFaithful]

Hey man I think everything is on the table.  I’m not kidding. 

[Reacher]

Apparently the shooter was going to target another school but didn't because they had armed security there? Chose the "softer" target and shot out the locked glass door to gain entrance.

His or her mother was apparently anti gun but it didn't stop her child from buying guns. Was there mental illness involved as well? Already laws for dealing with that.

I was talking to a friend who went to a school event this past week. The school had an unarmed non police person at an entrance without a metal detector. My friend was like what is the point of that? School wanted to look like they were doing something when in reality it was very minimal security

Edited March 28, 2023 by Reacher

[NotIThatLives]

With the non existent federal budget, you could have full time armed security at every single school building in the country for like 40 million a year.  It's so do able it's a total freaking joke.  

[rico]

1 hour ago, NotIThatLives said:

With the non existent federal budget, you could have full time armed security at every single school building in the country for like 40 million a year.  It's so do able it's a total freaking joke.  

Military personnel are already on the Federal payroll.  Use them.

[IUFLA]

1 hour ago, rico said:

Military personnel are already on the Federal payroll.  Use them.

It'd beat the living hell out of some of the other "extra" jobs they gave me...

[Lostin76]

3 hours ago, Reacher said:

Apparently the shooter was going to target another school but didn't because they had armed security there? Chose the "softer" target and shot out the locked glass door to gain entrance.

His or her mother was apparently anti gun but it didn't stop her child from buying guns. Was there mental illness involved as well? Already laws for dealing with that.

I was talking to a friend who went to a school event this past week. The school had an unarmed non police person at an entrance without a metal detector. My friend was like what is the point of that? School wanted to look like they were doing something when in reality it was very minimal security

I’ve been seeing articles that said the shooter was receiving mental health care. Also so many guns. She was apparently buying them legally and hiding them from her parents. 

Have been seeing this visual making the rounds today, and it’s just really hard to look at.

The pace of these events has just become ridiculous, but nothing changes. And this visual even removes stuff like armed robbery or gang violence. This is an insane explosion of these types of events. But sure, lets coddle gun companies and keep letting our politicians let cowards like the NRA run policy for our country. 

And no, I’m not saying take everyone’s guns. But FFS make it more difficult to get them and have consequences for misusing them. 

It’s insane to me that it’s 2023 and the two leading causes of deaths are guns deaths and car deaths. Both f#*king  largely preventable if we gave a shit. But we don’t. 

[Reacher]

34 minutes ago, Lostin76 said:

I’ve been seeing articles that said the shooter was receiving mental health care. Also so many guns. She was apparently buying them legally and hiding them from her parents. 

Have been seeing this visual making the rounds today, and it’s just really hard to look at.

The pace of these events has just become ridiculous, but nothing changes. And this visual even removes stuff like armed robbery or gang violence. This is an insane explosion of these types of events. But sure, lets coddle gun companies and keep letting our politicians let cowards like the NRA run policy for our country. 

And no, I’m not saying take everyone’s guns. But FFS make it more difficult to get them and have consequences for misusing them. 

It’s insane to me that it’s 2023 and the two leading causes of deaths are guns deaths and car deaths. Both f#*king  largely preventable if we gave a shit. But we don’t. 

There are laws in place to prevent sales to people being treated for mental health issues. How were these circumvented? Laws are worthless when not enforced. Yet the answer is often to pass more laws!

[Reacher]

3 hours ago, NotIThatLives said:

With the non existent federal budget, you could have full time armed security at every single school building in the country for like 40 million a year.  It's so do able it's a total freaking joke.  

Why not use volunteers? Police that are already being paid? Retired law enforcement and military? Pay a teacher already there an extra $2000 per year. A combination of the above? Doesn't need to be a cost issue. 

[NotIThatLives]

2 hours ago, rico said:

Military personnel are already on the Federal payroll.  Use them.

The Google machine said there's about 100,000 school buildings in the United States. 

Also don't believe it's a money issue to hire train and equip and pay these Security Forces.

[Lostin76]

44 minutes ago, Reacher said:

There are laws in place to prevent sales to people being treated for mental health issues. How were these circumvented? Laws are worthless when not enforced. Yet the answer is often to pass more laws!

Oh, I’m well aware that the police that we pay taxes for to enforce laws are weak and useless. The laws are circumvented b/c the people who we pay to enforce them don’t actually do anything. 

What is the answer though? I’m not trying to be a dick, I’m just upset that nothing ever changes and we value guns over our children. Same with traffic deaths. The answers are obvious, but god forbid, we slow down or reroute traffic. 

 

 

Edited March 28, 2023 by Lostin76

[Lostin76]

4 hours ago, NotIThatLives said:

With the non existent federal budget, you could have full time armed security at every single school building in the country for like 40 million a year.  It's so do able it's a total freaking joke.  

So, the answer is not to do anything about the US being absolutely flooded with guns. To let people open carry multiple guns literally in every single open public space w/o restriction, and then add more guns by having armed volunteer guards at the entrance and exit of every public venue. 

Sounds like fun AND freedom. 

Not attacking you as a poster, but I see this argument as a solution, and I just can’t see how more guns is the solution. 

[rico]

26 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

The Google machine said there's about 100,000 school buildings in the United States. 

Also don't believe it's a money issue to hire train and equip and pay these Security Forces.

What's your point?

Use the Military.  They have guys already trained for guard duty/search and seize.  I mean they are doing this kind of thing overseas at their own bases.  Last time I was at Grissom I got checked out.

[rico]

13 minutes ago, Lostin76 said:

So, the answer is not to do anything about the US being absolutely flooded with guns. To let people open carry multiple guns literally in every single open public space w/o restriction, and then add more guns by having armed volunteer guards at the entrance and exit of every public venue. 

Sounds like fun AND freedom. 

Not attacking you as a poster, but I see this argument as a solution, and I just can’t see how more guns is the solution. 

When I go to my local county courthouse I have to pass through a metal detector.  If it goes off after emptying my pockets etc. they pull me aside and wave me with a "wand."  I always get pulled aside and checked because I have a metal rod in my leg.

[IUFLA]

1 hour ago, Lostin76 said:

I’ve been seeing articles that said the shooter was receiving mental health care.

 

1 hour ago, Lostin76 said:

And no, I’m not saying take everyone’s guns. But FFS make it more difficult to get them and have consequences for misusing them. 

I agree... People with mental health issues shouldn't have the ability to buy guns, and anyone who allows someone with mental health issues to access their firearms should be held accountable...

But here's where I'm going to piss you off... We have to quit covering up certain mental health issues as "normal."

@HoosierFaithful says "were not protecting our children" and he's right, but in many more arenas than gun violence. Some are foisting adult issues and adult stresses onto our children. The most important thing I did raising 3 children was letting them be kids, and not subject them to ideas and lifestyles that are outside of what they should be concerned about.

31 minutes ago, Lostin76 said:

I’m well aware that the police that we pay taxes for to enforce laws are weak and useless.

And I would wager that any parent whose child survived yesterday's shooting would say you were wrong in your assessment.

[Lostin76]

1 minute ago, IUFLA said:

 

I agree... People with mental health issues shouldn't have the ability to buy guns, and anyone who allows someone with mental health issues to access their firearms should be held accountable...

But here's where I'm going to piss you off... We have to quit covering up certain mental health issues as "normal."

@HoosierFaithful says "were not protecting our children" and he's right, but in many more arenas than gun violence. Some are foisting adult issues and adult stresses onto our children. The most important thing I did raising 3 children was letting them be kids, and not subject them to ideas and lifestyles that are outside of what they should be concerned about.

And I would wager that any parent whose child survived yesterday's shooting would say you were wrong in your assessment.

You aren’t pissing me off at all. And I’m not sure which mental issues are treated as normal. They are pretty much all treated as an afterthought and a joke. 

And sure, the police yesterday were much better than Uvalde, but if the person was receiving mental treatment, then they should not have had access to guns. Where was law enforcement when she walked out with legally acquired guns. 

And finally, I’m cool if people want to choose guns over kids, but just admit it. Admit that the stupid easy access to guns is more important than the damage they do to our country. 

[IUFLA]

1 minute ago, Lostin76 said:

but if the person was receiving mental treatment, then they should not have had access to guns.

Absolutely not... But it certainly doesn't lie at the feet of law enforcement. Her doctor knew she was suicidal, as did her parents and they knew about the guns and were concerned about them. The background check has to extend to medical records, and we need a reporting mechanism so it throws a red flag...

4 minutes ago, Lostin76 said:

I’m cool if people want to choose guns over kids, but just admit it.

Come on... If you want a productive conversation that's a shit thing to post.

You're better than that... 

[Seeking6]

Man I just typed out a response. I had to delete. Here's what I know. Every possible plan over the past 25 years isn't working. From ease of buying guns to mental health issues to red flags and so on. 

If the highest probability of success is to secure our schools and give them safety....why not use every available resource we have to do that? 

Don't want our schools to look prisons? Screw that. Better that vs a morgue and crime scene.

[Lostin76]

15 minutes ago, rico said:

When I go to my local county courthouse I have to pass through a metal detector.  If it goes off after emptying my pockets etc. they pull me aside and wave me with a "wand."  I always get pulled aside and checked because I have a metal rod in my leg.

Sure, we got married here in Manhattan city hall and had to go through a metal detector. It makes sense. But do I then have to go through a metal detector to go to church, the bakery, the liquor store, the bookstore?

I have to stop and be patted down because Barney Fife can’t go to the Subway to pick up a sandwich w/o carrying several guns? F*ck that. I shouldn’t have to give up my freedoms, b/c Barney Fife is too scared to live his life w/o carrying. 

[HoosierFaithful]

1 minute ago, Seeking6 said:

Man I just typed out a response. I had to delete. Here's what I know. Every possible plan over the past 25 years isn't working. From ease of buying guns to mental health issues to red flags and so on. 

If the highest probability of success is to secure our schools and give them safety....why not use every available resource we have to do that? 

Don't want our schools to look prisons? Screw that. Better that vs a morgue and crime scene.

If this is the best we can do so kids don’t die, so be it. Make them like military bases. There are a lot of problems with that, and I am floored that we as a country can’t find a better solution, but you’re right: everything is better than dead. 

[Lostin76]

4 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Absolutely not... But it certainly doesn't lie at the feet of law enforcement. Her doctor knew she was suicidal, as did her parents and they knew about the guns and were concerned about them. The background check has to extend to medical records, and we need a reporting mechanism so it throws a red flag...

Come on... If you want a productive conversation that's a shit thing to post.

You're better than that... 

No, I’m not better than that. That’s where I am. Though I didn’t mean it personally towards you and I hope you know that. I would never lump you in with that. 

We actually push those types of things in our Epic medical records. Alerts and red flags are shockingly easy to do inth e medical records. But the NRA and our current crop of worthless politicians won’t let that happen. 

I mean it in general in our society. We have clearly made that choice. Own it then. Just admit that guns are more important than kids or other innocent people. 

[HoosierFaithful]

We are self moderating well and I appreciate that, and this is not in reaction to any recent posts, but if you think you’re gonna say something stupid: delete the post, go tell your dog instead, and enjoy some sunshine. 

[IUFLA]

1 minute ago, Lostin76 said:

No, I’m not better than that. That’s where I am. Though I didn’t mean it personally towards you and I hope you know that. I would never lump you in with that. 

We actually push those types of things in our Epic medical records. Alerts and red flags are shockingly easy to do inth e medical records. But the NRA and our current crop of worthless politicians won’t let that happen. 

I mean it in general in our society. We have clearly made that choice. Own it then. Just admit that guns are more important than kids or other innocent people. 

So a question... How did the fact that she was suicidal not get reported? How could her parents not understand that Audrey having firearms was dangerous, not only to herself but to others? 

I asked at the beginning of this, what's changed in the last 50 that has made this more frequent? 

 

[NotIThatLives]

40 minutes ago, Lostin76 said:

So, the answer is not to do anything about the US being absolutely flooded with guns. To let people open carry multiple guns literally in every single open public space w/o restriction, and then add more guns by having armed volunteer guards at the entrance and exit of every public venue. 

Sounds like fun AND freedom. 

Not attacking you as a poster, but I see this argument as a solution, and I just can’t see how more guns is the solution. 

Basically every major event is packed to the gills with armed security.   

I don't understand why we wouldn't.  It's literally the easiest solution and would cost 40 million a year.  Granted that number has went up over the last 3 years.  

As this debate pops up every 3 days to 6 months while we wait on the next public massacre, I'm reminded that part of the original reason for the citize s to be armed is so a foreign or do estimate government could not overtake them.  Disarming everyday citizens is not an option.  Make them a hell of a lot harder, make longer waiting periods. Any common sense solution and deterent.