Arizona Post Game Thread

[IUCrazy2]

3 hours ago, southsidehoosier said:

I know KenPom isn’t the AP top 25 but UNC is 25 and Xavier is 29 statistically 

The NET is what matters for seeding.

[IUCrazy2]

3 hours ago, RoadToZion said:

Fun game and we played just fine without our second best player. Everyone lighten up. Arizona is really really good. International talent galore. These losses don’t bother me…it’s a hell of a lot better than playing a game against some community college and winning 100-40. 

I mean, yes and no.  It is kind of a downer to lose but not a huge deal, IF we start winning our share of these.  That is the big thing.  Just playing in these games won't help recruiting if we aren't near 50/50 in the games against the big teams.  If we want to rebuild the brand we have to do better than last night. 

We should be pissed that we let a game against a team we can beat get away from us so bad.  There was no moral victory last night.  We CAN compete with these teams and we need to do it.

[Lurker]

1 hour ago, Indykev said:

 

From that angle it looks like an intercepted lob meant for TJD and not a goaltended shot.

[btownqb]

5 minutes ago, Lurker said:

From that angle it looks like an intercepted lob meant for TJD and not a goaltended shot.

The intent isn't relevant, though. Balls on the way down/over the cylinder. 

[IUDan93]

1 hour ago, KoB2011 said:

I do not agree on RT, despite him having his best game of the year. He and TJD both got outplayed by their bigs, and that’s not even getting into JG and MR. We were completely outplayed upfront. There’s a lot that goes into the “why” we got outplayed upfront, but not a single guy upfront outplayed their man.

Combine that with some atrocious calls and that’s the game. 

RT was over-matched physically in the post, but at least he scored from the outside. Since he did play his best game of the season, I figured that this means that his play wasn't the reason we lost. It really is too bad that TJD hasn't had an athletic 7 foot rim protector to play along side. 

I did not include MR because he did not play well. I think JG played well enough.  

[IUDan93]

23 minutes ago, btownqb said:

The intent isn't relevant, though. Balls on the way down/over the cylinder. 

Yep. We have all seen lob passes that end up going in. The points count, right?  Also, TG has taken this one-handed runner in the lane a bunch of times this year. Each time I initially think he is throwing a lob,

[Purdue7]

3 hours ago, Indykev said:

Is it a lob or shot?  He grabbed one out the air with 3:00 to go in 1st half too 

if TJD dunks it is it offensive goaltending?  
 

 

[Seeking6]

Just getting back from Vegas. First thing. What an environment. I spoke with a MGM person a couple hours after the game and she just said Indiana is welcome back whenever and however it can work. Totally blown away at the turnout.

Regarding game. Arizona is legit top 2-3 in nation with their size. With that said (and I haven't read all the comments yet) you can't let bigs continue to just lower their frickin shoulder and plow refs. Just brutal. We miss JHS more than some thought. Xavier is great when he's good but we need that calming presence of JHS badly. 

Happy to see Race draw guys out. Bates is doing his thing. Kopp getting more and more confident. Disappointed in TJD. There is no way he should ever go that long without a FGA....I don't care how many guys are hanging all over him.

Lots of other thoughts but trying to get caught up. I will say this. Tommy Lloyd is a grade 1 dbag. He's getting 80% of the calls all night long and every timeout, every possession he's chirping at the refs. Combination of Bo Ryan/Bruce Weber and maybe Fran.......

Not the result we wanted but we get so much more out of this. We have a ton of improvement to do but it's all correctable especially when JHS gets healthy. Take the week. Get finals out of the way and look forward to Kansas. Go Hoosiers. Incredible atmosphere though.

[Purdue7]

1 hour ago, btownqb said:

The intent isn't relevant, though. Balls on the way down/over the cylinder. 

It would have been interesting to see any other angle or overhead shot 

 

[3Ballin]

8 minutes ago, Purdue7 said:

It would have been interesting to see any other angle or overhead shot 

 

There is an angle from right behind a ref standing under the basket opposite Trey and you can tell its right on line and still above the rim and CLEARLY on the way down. Forgive me i cant find it again. 

[IUCrazy2]

1 minute ago, 3Ballin said:

There is an angle from right behind a ref standing under the basket opposite Trey and you can tell its right on line and still above the rim and CLEARLY on the way down. Forgive me i cant find it again. 

It was unquestionably a goal tend.  I think it was meant to be another of Galloway's floaters.  TJD did not even attempt to go up for it because it is on line with the rim.  That thing was going to hit on the inside of the cylinder if it wasn't obstructed.  It was an awful call.

I was wrong earlier, it would have meant we were down 6 if called properly.  We would have had AZ have to inbound the ball so we would have more time to set up D.  As it was, we went down and got the flop call (which was also terrible), they hit a FT, TJD gets a foul, and they hit a 3.  We go from down 6 to down 12, pick up a terrible foul on our best player which puts him on the bench, and had our reserve PF also pick up a terrible foul which impacts his ability to play aggressively.

Somebody up above mentioned the AZ coach constantly working the refs.  It is annoying but it works.  If you are not going to counter that you will find yourself on the bad side of fouls in most games.  We have been outshot from the foul line in every game we have played against P5 teams.  Every single one.

[Seeking6]

4 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

It was unquestionably a goal tend.  I think it was meant to be another of Galloway's floaters.  TJD did not even attempt to go up for it because it is on line with the rim.  That thing was going to hit on the inside of the cylinder if it wasn't obstructed.  It was an awful call.

I was wrong earlier, it would have meant we were down 6 if called properly.  We would have had AZ have to inbound the ball so we would have more time to set up D.  As it was, we went down and got the flop call (which was also terrible), they hit a FT, TJD gets a foul, and they hit a 3.  We go from down 6 to down 12, pick up a terrible foul on our best player which puts him on the bench, and had our reserve PF also pick up a terrible foul which impacts his ability to play aggressively.

Somebody up above mentioned the AZ coach constantly working the refs.  It is annoying but it works.  If you are not going to counter that you will find yourself on the bad side of fouls in most games.  We have been outshot from the foul line in every game we have played against P5 teams.  Every single one.

Part of the guys I was there were actually under the basket of that goal tend. One almost got tossed because he yelled at the silver fox ref (don't know name) wtf are you possibly looking at and kept after him each time down the court...

[IUFLA]

So just a couple of notes (which maybe I should have included in the pre-game)

After @mrflynn03's comments about an "International All-Star Team" I had to look...All of the Arizona kids have extensive International experience...All quotes are "borrowed" from Wikipedia  

Ballo played for Mali at the 2017 FIBA Under-16 African Championship in Vacoas-Phoenix, Mauritius. He averaged 14.4 points and 12.8 rebounds per game, winning the gold medal while making the tournament All-Star Five.[15] Playing for Mali at the 2018 FIBA Under-17 World Cup in Argentina, Ballo averaged 20.6 points and a tournament-high 16.9 rebounds per game and was named to the All-Star Five.[16] On 7 July 2018, he recorded 32 points and a tournament-record 32 rebounds in a 110–108 triple overtime loss to the Dominican Republic.[17] Ballo won a gold medal with Mali at the 2018 FIBA Under-18 African Championship in Bamako, Mali. He averaged 8.5 points and six rebounds per game.[18]

Ballo competed at the 2019 FIBA Under-19 World Cup in Heraklion, Greece, missing the first two games due to visa issues.[19][20] In five games, he averaged 17.6 points, 11.8 rebounds, and 3.8 blocks per game, leading Mali to a silver medal, the best performance by an African team at a global basketball tournament.[20] Ballo was named to the All-Star Five with teammate Siriman Kanouté.[21]

He committed to Gonzaga, but transferred to Arizona when Lloyd took the job (to which Mark Few said, "I'll drink to that!")  

Tubelis played for Lithuania at the 2016 FIBA U16 European Championship in Radom, where he averaged 4.9 points and 4.3 rebounds per game.[15] At the 2018 FIBA U16 European Championship in Novi Sad, he averaged 14.3 points, 10.4 rebounds and 2.7 blocks per game.[16] Tubelis represented Lithuania at the 2019 FIBA U18 European Championship in Volos, averaging 14.9 points, 12.6 rebounds and 3.4 blocks per game.

Kriisa played for the youth teams of his hometown club BC Tartu since he was 12 years old and debuted with University of Tartu first team during the 2016–17 KML season at the age of 15. In September 2017 he signed with Brose Bamberg and started playing in their affiliate team Baunach Young Pikes.[1] His stint in Germany was cut short due to periostitis and he returned to Estonia for treatment.[2]
In August 2018, he signed with Žalgiris Kaunas.[3] In his first year with the Kaunas team Kriisa played on the Lithuanian second league (NKL) team Žalgiris-2 and also for the youth team in the Euroleague Basketball Next Generation Tournament. He was awarded with the MVP and All-Tournament Team honours at the Kaunas Qualifying Tournament. Kriisa averaged 17.3 points, 4.7 assists and 2.7 rebounds over 7 games ib the 2018–19 season of Next Generation Tournament.[4]

Kriisa made his EuroLeague debut for Žalgiris on 25 October 2019 and scored his first point from a free throw as Žalgiris defeated LDLC ASVEL 70–56 in the Regular Season Round 4 game.[5] In November 2019 Kriisa was sent on loan to another Lithuanian team CBet Prienai to gain experience in the Lithuanian Basketball League (LKL).[6] His loan spell ended in January 2020 and Kriisa returned to Žalgiris-2.[7]

Pelle Larsson started at Utah then transferred, he played for RIG Lulea and BC Lulea ... named Swedish Basketball League's Star of the Year honor after averaging 7.6 points, 2.8 rebounds, 1.9 assists and 0.8 steals with BC Lulea in 2019-20 ... in 2018-19, he averaged 17.9 points, 6.3 rebounds, 3.7 assists and 1.7 steals with RIG Lulea, earning him a spot on Eurobasket's All-Swedish BasketEttan Third Team ... while playing with the Swedish U18 team at the FIBA U18 European Championships in Romania, he averaged 15.8 points, 7.1 rebounds, 5.5 assists and 1.9 steals while leading the tournament in field goal percentage (61.1) and assists ... was also named to the all-tournament team at the FIBA U18 European Championships ... his father, Christian, played professional basketball in Sweden ... his older brother, Vilgot, played collegiate basketball at the University of Maine (2018-21).

 

Edited December 11, 2022 by IUFLA

[KoB2011]

1 hour ago, IUDan93 said:

RT was over-matched physically in the post, but at least he scored from the outside. Since he did play his best game of the season, I figured that this means that his play wasn't the reason we lost. It really is too bad that TJD hasn't had an athletic 7 foot rim protector to play along side. 

I did not include MR because he did not play well. I think JG played well enough.  

I mean a lot of people played well enough, the reality is this was a really close game that got blown open late with some harmful calls. 14 is incredibly deceptive to how closely the two teams played. 

[Artesian_86]

I know we are talking about 2 points more with the missed goaltending call, but that was a massive momentum shifter had it counted. They credited AZ for one early in the game. That missed call was the beginning that literally took the air out of our sails.

[IUFLA]

Just now, KoB2011 said:

14 is incredibly deceptive to how closely the two teams played. 

Gus Johnson said as much at the end of the game...

[IUFLA]

1 minute ago, Artesian_86 said:

I know we are talking about 2 points more with the missed goaltending call, but that was a massive momentum shifter had it counted. They credited AZ for one early in the game. That missed call was the beginning that literally took the air out of our sails.

Immediately followed by the flop call, and TJD's 4th foul...

[KoB2011]

34 minutes ago, Purdue7 said:

 

It would depend where it was caught for it to be offensive goaltend, but a defender grabbing a ball on the way down headed to the rim is a goaltend. Offense is about if the balls over the cylinder when it is grabbed. 

[Artesian_86]

6 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

So just a couple of notes (which maybe I should have included in the pre-game)

After @mrflynn03's comments about an "International All-Star Team" I had to look...All of the Arizona kids have extensive International experience...All quotes are "borrowed" from Wikipedia  

Ballo played for Mali at the 2017 FIBA Under-16 African Championship in Vacoas-Phoenix, Mauritius. He averaged 14.4 points and 12.8 rebounds per game, winning the gold medal while making the tournament All-Star Five.[15] Playing for Mali at the 2018 FIBA Under-17 World Cup in Argentina, Ballo averaged 20.6 points and a tournament-high 16.9 rebounds per game and was named to the All-Star Five.[16] On 7 July 2018, he recorded 32 points and a tournament-record 32 rebounds in a 110–108 triple overtime loss to the Dominican Republic.[17] Ballo won a gold medal with Mali at the 2018 FIBA Under-18 African Championship in Bamako, Mali. He averaged 8.5 points and six rebounds per game.[18]

Ballo competed at the 2019 FIBA Under-19 World Cup in Heraklion, Greece, missing the first two games due to visa issues.[19][20] In five games, he averaged 17.6 points, 11.8 rebounds, and 3.8 blocks per game, leading Mali to a silver medal, the best performance by an African team at a global basketball tournament.[20] Ballo was named to the All-Star Five with teammate Siriman Kanouté.[21]

He committed to Gonzaga, but transferred to Arizona when Lloyd took the job (to which Mark Few said, "I'll drink to that!")  

Tubelis played for Lithuania at the 2016 FIBA U16 European Championship in Radom, where he averaged 4.9 points and 4.3 rebounds per game.[15] At the 2018 FIBA U16 European Championship in Novi Sad, he averaged 14.3 points, 10.4 rebounds and 2.7 blocks per game.[16] Tubelis represented Lithuania at the 2019 FIBA U18 European Championship in Volos, averaging 14.9 points, 12.6 rebounds and 3.4 blocks per game.

Kriisa played for the youth teams of his hometown club BC Tartu since he was 12 years old and debuted with University of Tartu first team during the 2016–17 KML season at the age of 15. In September 2017 he signed with Brose Bamberg and started playing in their affiliate team Baunach Young Pikes.[1] His stint in Germany was cut short due to periostitis and he returned to Estonia for treatment.[2]
In August 2018, he signed with Žalgiris Kaunas.[3] In his first year with the Kaunas team Kriisa played on the Lithuanian second league (NKL) team Žalgiris-2 and also for the youth team in the Euroleague Basketball Next Generation Tournament. He was awarded with the MVP and All-Tournament Team honours at the Kaunas Qualifying Tournament. Kriisa averaged 17.3 points, 4.7 assists and 2.7 rebounds over 7 games ib the 2018–19 season of Next Generation Tournament.[4]

Kriisa made his EuroLeague debut for Žalgiris on 25 October 2019 and scored his first point from a free throw as Žalgiris defeated LDLC ASVEL 70–56 in the Regular Season Round 4 game.[5] In November 2019 Kriisa was sent on loan to another Lithuanian team CBet Prienai to gain experience in the Lithuanian Basketball League (LKL).[6] His loan spell ended in January 2020 and Kriisa returned to Žalgiris-2.[7]

Pelle Larsson started at Utah then transferred, he played for RIG Lulea and BC Lulea ... named Swedish Basketball League's Star of the Year honor after averaging 7.6 points, 2.8 rebounds, 1.9 assists and 0.8 steals with BC Lulea in 2019-20 ... in 2018-19, he averaged 17.9 points, 6.3 rebounds, 3.7 assists and 1.7 steals with RIG Lulea, earning him a spot on Eurobasket's All-Swedish BasketEttan Third Team ... while playing with the Swedish U18 team at the FIBA U18 European Championships in Romania, he averaged 15.8 points, 7.1 rebounds, 5.5 assists and 1.9 steals while leading the tournament in field goal percentage (61.1) and assists ... was also named to the all-tournament team at the FIBA U18 European Championships ... his father, Christian, played professional basketball in Sweden ... his older brother, Vilgot, played collegiate basketball at the University of Maine (2018-21).

 

Thanks IUFLA…. I think you may be feeling the same way I do… without being negative?

Edited December 11, 2022 by Artesian_86

[KoB2011]

29 minutes ago, Purdue7 said:

It would have been interesting to see any other angle or overhead shot 

 

You can see any angle you want, the ball was on its way down and the defender can’t touch it.

Think of it this way, if it was so far offline it wasn’t drawing iron someone else would’ve been jumping, it’s pretty clearly one guy misjudged it and three refs missed it. 

[IUFLA]

Just now, Artesian_86 said:

Thanks IUFLA…. I thinks you may be feeling the same way I do… without being negative?

You have to look at it like this I think...

Playing in FIBA tournaments, you're basically playing all star teams...Regardless how we look at Indiana high school basketball, it's not the same caliber competition that those kids faced from early in their careers...

The Montverde kids we have are a good example of the maturity gained when you're playing higher level competition...

[Artesian_86]

2 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

You have to look at it like this I think...

Playing in FIBA tournaments, you're basically playing all star teams...Regardless how we look at Indiana high school basketball, it's not the same caliber competition that those kids faced from early in their careers...

The Montverde kids we have are a good example of the maturity gained when you're playing higher level competition...

Spot on to a T! How many US born, college age players playing in the US are going to get that much national competition experience ? Correct if I’m way off or wrong. It just runs me the wrong way.

[cthomas]

44 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Tommy Lloyd is a grade 1 dbag. He's getting 80% of the calls all night long and every timeout, every possession he's chirping at the refs. Combination of Bo Ryan/Bruce Weber and maybe Fran.......

I thought the same thing. An absolutely unlikable guy. In fact, the entire team whined and flopped all night. Definitely have the personality of the coach. Win and lose with class, that's all I ask.

[mrflynn03]

23 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

So just a couple of notes (which maybe I should have included in the pre-game)

After @mrflynn03's comments about an "International All-Star Team" I had to look...All of the Arizona kids have extensive International experience...All quotes are "borrowed" from Wikipedia  

Ballo played for Mali at the 2017 FIBA Under-16 African Championship in Vacoas-Phoenix, Mauritius. He averaged 14.4 points and 12.8 rebounds per game, winning the gold medal while making the tournament All-Star Five.[15] Playing for Mali at the 2018 FIBA Under-17 World Cup in Argentina, Ballo averaged 20.6 points and a tournament-high 16.9 rebounds per game and was named to the All-Star Five.[16] On 7 July 2018, he recorded 32 points and a tournament-record 32 rebounds in a 110–108 triple overtime loss to the Dominican Republic.[17] Ballo won a gold medal with Mali at the 2018 FIBA Under-18 African Championship in Bamako, Mali. He averaged 8.5 points and six rebounds per game.[18]

Ballo competed at the 2019 FIBA Under-19 World Cup in Heraklion, Greece, missing the first two games due to visa issues.[19][20] In five games, he averaged 17.6 points, 11.8 rebounds, and 3.8 blocks per game, leading Mali to a silver medal, the best performance by an African team at a global basketball tournament.[20] Ballo was named to the All-Star Five with teammate Siriman Kanouté.[21]

He committed to Gonzaga, but transferred to Arizona when Lloyd took the job (to which Mark Few said, "I'll drink to that!")  

Tubelis played for Lithuania at the 2016 FIBA U16 European Championship in Radom, where he averaged 4.9 points and 4.3 rebounds per game.[15] At the 2018 FIBA U16 European Championship in Novi Sad, he averaged 14.3 points, 10.4 rebounds and 2.7 blocks per game.[16] Tubelis represented Lithuania at the 2019 FIBA U18 European Championship in Volos, averaging 14.9 points, 12.6 rebounds and 3.4 blocks per game.

Kriisa played for the youth teams of his hometown club BC Tartu since he was 12 years old and debuted with University of Tartu first team during the 2016–17 KML season at the age of 15. In September 2017 he signed with Brose Bamberg and started playing in their affiliate team Baunach Young Pikes.[1] His stint in Germany was cut short due to periostitis and he returned to Estonia for treatment.[2]
In August 2018, he signed with Žalgiris Kaunas.[3] In his first year with the Kaunas team Kriisa played on the Lithuanian second league (NKL) team Žalgiris-2 and also for the youth team in the Euroleague Basketball Next Generation Tournament. He was awarded with the MVP and All-Tournament Team honours at the Kaunas Qualifying Tournament. Kriisa averaged 17.3 points, 4.7 assists and 2.7 rebounds over 7 games ib the 2018–19 season of Next Generation Tournament.[4]

Kriisa made his EuroLeague debut for Žalgiris on 25 October 2019 and scored his first point from a free throw as Žalgiris defeated LDLC ASVEL 70–56 in the Regular Season Round 4 game.[5] In November 2019 Kriisa was sent on loan to another Lithuanian team CBet Prienai to gain experience in the Lithuanian Basketball League (LKL).[6] His loan spell ended in January 2020 and Kriisa returned to Žalgiris-2.[7]

Pelle Larsson started at Utah then transferred, he played for RIG Lulea and BC Lulea ... named Swedish Basketball League's Star of the Year honor after averaging 7.6 points, 2.8 rebounds, 1.9 assists and 0.8 steals with BC Lulea in 2019-20 ... in 2018-19, he averaged 17.9 points, 6.3 rebounds, 3.7 assists and 1.7 steals with RIG Lulea, earning him a spot on Eurobasket's All-Swedish BasketEttan Third Team ... while playing with the Swedish U18 team at the FIBA U18 European Championships in Romania, he averaged 15.8 points, 7.1 rebounds, 5.5 assists and 1.9 steals while leading the tournament in field goal percentage (61.1) and assists ... was also named to the all-tournament team at the FIBA U18 European Championships ... his father, Christian, played professional basketball in Sweden ... his older brother, Vilgot, played collegiate basketball at the University of Maine (2018-21).

 

Some of the teams these guys played for are professional euro club basketball teams. How are they even eligible for college basketball?

[IUFLA]

5 minutes ago, Artesian_86 said:

Spot on to a T! How many US born, college age players playing in the US are going to get that much national competition experience ? Correct if I’m way off or wrong. It just runs me the wrong way.

No, exactly right...does me too, but those are the rules. 

There is no shame to losing to Arizona. Like I said, I saw a bit of a change in Malik's effort level from the first half to the second...

Woody's message is, "hey kid, you want to get to the league? Ok, here's who you have to climb over to get there."