Purdue Post Game Thread

[Inequality]

Everyone can see it’s not working. Once it’s starts to affect recruiting, it’s completely over.

[KoB2011]

Just some clueless guy who doesn't understand recruiting and NIL blaming Woodson for not addressing the guard situation:

 

 

[TheWatShot]

10 minutes ago, Inequality said:

Everyone can see it’s not working. Once it’s starts to affect recruiting, it’s completely over.

It already has. We have one recruit signed for next season. One. At this point last year we only had Cupps and Newton. Maybe he'll get lucky and another 5 star will de-commit from somewhere. That's about the only way he can get them here. High schoolers aren't buying whatever he's selling. 

 

Anymore I just marvel at how we can go through so many coaches and get the same awful results. 

[IU Scott]

6 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

 

 

How about the game that RMK came back for the Purdue game.

[5fouls]

7 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

 

 

Odle is correct in what would have happened under Knight.  The reality is, that approach does not work in today's environment either.  

If you look at the Top 5 teams in the Polls, none of them are authoritarian coaches.  Heck, we know K. Sampson is anything but that.  The key is getting players that both fit your system AND that will buy into it.

A player that works hard and has some pride is more valuable than a more talented player. 

 

[IUCrazy2]

4 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Odle is correct in what would have happened under Knight.  The reality is, that approach does not work in today's environment either.  

If you look at the Top 5 teams in the Polls, none of them are authoritarian coaches.  Heck, we know K. Sampson is anything but that.  The key is getting players that both fit your system AND that will buy into it.

A player that works hard and has some pride is more valuable than a more talented player. 

 

We need to jettison some of the assistant staff.  All they do is recruit and frankly they haven't done that well.  Cheaney gets mentioned as a guy that is developing players rather frequently.  We aren't always seeing the results but he is someone we hear.  Our last few big recruits were landed by Walsh.  What exactly are Rosemond and Hunter doing other than collecting a check?

We need an X and O guy and a development guy in those spots who also recruit.

[Dawg Bawls]

10 hours ago, Bushmage said:

Xavier is embarrassing at this point

I picked up a half case for X to enjoy the rest of his night...

[Maedhros]

7 hours ago, TheWatShot said:

It already has. We have one recruit signed for next season. One. At this point last year we only had Cupps and Newton. Maybe he'll get lucky and another 5 star will de-commit from somewhere. That's about the only way he can get them here. High schoolers aren't buying whatever he's selling. 

 

Anymore I just marvel at how we can go through so many coaches and get the same awful results. 

Recruiting is my concern as well.

Coaches need to be allowed bad seasons. Matt Painter is the media's darling now, but he had some rough years after the baby boilers class. A decent portion of their own fan base wanted him gone, and it's fairleigh likely he would have been fired from IU after nine years, just as Crean was. 

Painter learned. A few recruiting misses, misevaluations, and a roster won't come together the way you want. Could very well be that's what happened to Indiana this year. There have been some concerning long term trends in the Woodson era, sure, but I would argue lack of complementary skills and overall team chemistry to be the reasons we aren't having the same success as the past two seasons, and those can be solved through recruiting.

But more than the results of any one game, or this season, the recruiting results haven't been what we needed. Jalen Hood-Schifino and Malik Reneau were great gets. Kel'el Ware has been mostly fantastic, and Mgbako is rounding into the player we expected. But three of those four were or are likely to be one year rentals. Where are the pieces around them? Liam is a great get, with seemingly a combination of skills we haven't seen in Bloomington in a long time. He's not going to fix this roster himself. 

It's possible to write this season off as one where things just didn't come together. Maybe Woodson bet big on Xavier Johnson, missed on some other guys in the '23 prep/portal class, and now has play the roster he has, not the roster he wants. I hope so. But after some bad bets and misses in the '24 prep class, it's starting to become a trend. This gets turned around in the '24 portal window, or it likely doesn't get turned around at all.

Edited January 17 by Maedhros

[NotIThatLives]

8 hours ago, Muddy River said:

Ummm.  Archie lost to Purdue badly at Assembly Hall on the night Coach Knight returned to the hall…so there is that….

And kept the guys in the locker room during halftime when coach was introduced absolute shame should have been fired on the spot

[Hoosier987]

7 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

Just some clueless guy who doesn't understand recruiting and NIL blaming Woodson for not addressing the guard situation:

 

 

Powell get it. Everyone does. Why the hell Woodson decided to put all his eggs in the X basket, I’ll never understand. Everyone in the entire world knew what we needed except the Staff…so here we are. If we had any semblance of a guard play, we’d be good.

So blow up the roster at the end of the year after this disastrous construction and get all the top portal guards. Keep Mgbako, Reneau and Cupps and move forward. 

Edited January 17 by Hoosier987

[rico]

45 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Odle is correct in what would have happened under Knight.  The reality is, that approach does not work in today's environment either.  

If you look at the Top 5 teams in the Polls, none of them are authoritarian coaches.  Heck, we know K. Sampson is anything but that.  The key is getting players that both fit your system AND that will buy into it.

A player that works hard and has some pride is more valuable than a more talented player. 

 

What exactly is Woody's system?  Because I sure as hell can't figure it out.

[5fouls]

11 minutes ago, Hoosier987 said:

So blow up the roster at the end of the year after this disastrous construction and get all the top portal guards. Keep Mgbako, Reneau and Cupps and move forward. 

Galloway deserves his Covid year if he wants it.

Sparks deserves to experience Senior Day at IU if he's willing to be a role player off the bench.

 

[jefftheref]

8 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

This mess is 100% Mike Woodson's mess.

This is year 3 - this is his team and his guys. We are trending towards being the worst team, sans Crean's first three years, since before Bobby Knight was coach. That is unfathomable.

He blamed Edey going off on not having TJD and Race.... two guys he didn't recruit.

The refs sucked, but he chose to sit our only good chance at winning the entire first half. That's on him and no one else.

We have more 15+ point losses in 2.5 years of Mike Woodson that we did in 4 years of Archie, or in the last 7 years of Tom Crean. 

We run a bad offensive scheme and a bad defensive scheme. We've been a bad rebounding team the entire time he's been here. He's stubborn and when he gets questioned he is frequently combative.

He's got two months to show why he shouldn't have an incredibly hot seat. 

Two more months of crap ball and coaching. I am getting to the point where I don't care. Same shi?, different day!

Like I have said before, you think this year is bad wait until next year!

[tdhoosier]

Would somebody mind confirming or denying if you can record live events on Peacock?

I got home at 8:00 (cst) and rewound the game as far as I could but ultimately missed the first 5 minutes. I started watching, got 2 minutes into the 2nd half and then Peacock randomly shut down. Once I restarted the app (which took about 3 freaking minutes, as usual), I couldn’t find the game.  

Maybe it was a blessing in disguise. 

[13th&Jackson]

32 minutes ago, Maedhros said:

Recruiting is my concern as well.

Coaches need to be allowed bad seasons. Matt Painter is the media's darling now, but he had some rough years after the baby boilers class. A decent portion of their own fan base wanted him gone, and it's fairleigh likely he would have been fired from IU after nine years, just as Crean was. 

Painter learned. A few recruiting misses, misevaluations, and a roster won't come together the way you want. Could very well be that's what happened to Indiana this year. There have been some concerning long term trends in the Woodson era, sure, but I would argue lack of complementary skills and overall team chemistry to be the reasons we aren't having the same success as the past two seasons, and those can be solved through recruiting.

But more than the results of any one game, or this season, the recruiting results haven't been what we needed. Jalen Hood-Schifino and Malik Reneau were great gets. Kel'el Ware has been mostly fantastic, and Mgbako is rounding into the player we expected. But three of those four were or are likely to be one year rentals. Where are the pieces around them? Liam is a great get, with seemingly a combination of skills we haven't seen in Bloomington in a long time. He's not going to fix this roster himself. 

It's possible to write this season off as one where things just didn't come together. Maybe Woodson bet big on Xavier Johnson, missed on some other guys in the '23 prep/portal class, and now has play the roster he has, not the roster he wants. I hope so. But after some bad bets and misses in the '24 prep class, it's starting to become a trend. This gets turned around in the '24 portal window, or it likely doesn't get turned around at all.

The difference is, when Painter had his down years he was in his early 40s. Plenty of time to adjust. Woodson will be 66 in March. No time to go through a couple losing years. Does he seem like a guy who has the fire in the belly to coach another 6-8 years and make the necessary adjustments?

[dbmhoosier]

8 hours ago, Inequality said:

Everyone can see it’s not working. Once it’s starts to affect recruiting, it’s completely over.

People all over Twitter are starting to crack.  Will get extremely ugly next season if Dolson allows Woody to return.  Let's pray they aren't that incompetent.

 

 

[Hoosier987]

8 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

He blamed Edey going off on not having TJD and Race.... two guys he didn't recruit.

I kind of chuckled when I read he said that. Woodson was gifted an older team from the prior regime. Granted, he did pick up JHS but was only able to win 1 round of 64 game in the 2 years he has TJD and Race.

[Hoosier987]

1 minute ago, dbmhoosier said:

People all over Twitter are starting to crack.  Will get extremely ugly next season if Dolson allows Woody to return.  Let's pray they aren't that incompetent.

 

 

Hadn’t seen you post here in a long time. Glad to see you’re back. I totally get what you’re saying…I think we’re in a very precarious situation with Woodson because he’s a former IU player and there’s a lot of politics involved…for this reason, I don’t think IU is going to let him go. He’s going to need to retire imo. 

[13th&Jackson]

5 minutes ago, Hoosier987 said:

Hadn’t seen you post here in a long time. Glad to see you’re back. I totally get what you’re saying…I think we’re in a very precarious situation with Woodson because he’s a former IU player and there’s a lot of politics involved…for this reason, I don’t think IU is going to let him go. He’s going to need to retire imo. 

Zero chance they fire Woodson. I just hope they don’t offer a contract extension. 

[CTrojan88]

Keeping him around just because he is a former player is ridiculous. You hear all the time that it is about the program, not one person (heard it all the time when RMK was estranged). Give him a job elsewhere in the department, just get him off the bench.

Edited January 17 by CTrojan88

[KoB2011]

18 minutes ago, Hoosier987 said:

I kind of chuckled when I read he said that. Woodson was gifted an older team from the prior regime. Granted, he did pick up JHS but was only able to win 1 round of 64 game in the 2 years he has TJD and Race.

And both tournament losses were among the 15 games we’ve lost by 15+ in 2.5 years…

[Maedhros]

Woodson took us back to the Tournament for the first time in four tries, then and followed it up with an encore that earned a 4-seed, our best in ten years. Not a chance you fire that guy after one bad season in year three. Good grief.

Regardless of how you think it will go, Woodson has earned some runway to get things back on track.

[tdhoosier]

20 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

The difference is, when Painter had his down years he was in his early 40s. Plenty of time to adjust. Woodson will be 66 in March. No time to go through a couple losing years. Does he seem like a guy who has the fire in the belly to coach another 6-8 years and make the necessary adjustments?

It’s tough with comparisons, but in Painters third year, his team was ranked as high as 14. The next year he had 27 wins and won the conference tournament. The year after that his team won the conference and had 29 wins. 

In year 3, his teams were progressing and the future looked bright.

Currently with Woody, the program is in a regression. He did progress in his first 2 years, developed players and had a moderate amount of success, but right now the cupboard looks bare. I do think it’s a tad too soon to determine if this is currently a bump in the road or a trend downward. The issue is clearly personnel - lack of back court talent and mismatched skill sets. Luckily, Woody can save himself with the portal. He failed last year getting the guys he needed. I think this staff needs to prove that they can turn this thing around in the Spring and build a balanced roster. 

An additional problem is that our program has a history of changing coaches. Combine that with this year’s poor performance, and Woody getting close to being in recruiting purgatory. Blame who you want for these circumstances, but it is what it is. I think that’s why many say that in our program, who is desperate to get our team back into upper echelon of college basketball, a new coach has to come in and win quick. With the the portal, that timeline is now even quicker. 

[IUCrazy2]

18 minutes ago, jojo123 said:

What we are witnessing is politics . From the our BOT to the hierarchy of the league. All intertwined. The liberal board does not want to see IU basketball restored to its old glory. They used PC or woke to bring down a once proud program. You can say it’s not politically motivated if you want, but you don’t control an institution that involves billions of dollars without politics being heavily involved. You don’t control referees and a television network without politics being involved. Every narrative that comes from the Big is somehow negative when it comes to IU. I agree we haven’t been that good, but look who the Admin has hired.  We need a good reporter with balls to go and press the board. Make things public. Dark to light. 

Don't attribute to a conspiracy what is more likely explained by incompetence.  We throw more money at our basketball program than almost any school in the country.  The problem we have is that we are perennially stuck in 1987.  From my POV, all that "getting in the shoe game is cheating" was for us suckered.  Everyone was doing it, the NCAA only "cared" when it was forced to, even then they did nothing.  The dumbest thing we ever did was burn down our program over phone calls.

And everyone involved with the program is living off the vapors of a coach who has passed away and had not coached a game at IU since I was a junior in college (I am 45 now.)

I am f---ing tired of listening to the radio and getting clowned the day after these rivalry games.  And yeah, we swept them last year but we have been on the wrong end of these way too often.  Just f---ing tired of it.  And no, I am not going anywhere.  I have been mostly biting my tongue all year.  Woodson better put away the f---ing cigars and do some damn coaching. 

[tdhoosier]

28 minutes ago, jojo123 said:

What we are witnessing is politics . From the our BOT to the hierarchy of the league. All intertwined. The liberal board does not want to see IU basketball restored to its old glory. They used PC or woke to bring down a once proud program. You can say it’s not politically motivated if you want, but you don’t control an institution that involves billions of dollars without politics being heavily involved. You don’t control referees and a television network without politics being involved. Every narrative that comes from the Big is somehow negative when it comes to IU. I agree we haven’t been that good, but look who the Admin has hired.  We need a good reporter with balls to go and press the board. Make things public. Dark to light. 

Seriously. What is wrong with you? You are disturbing, even for a troll.